Author Topic: jiddu krishnamurthy  (Read 12519 times)

Subramanian.R

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Re: jiddu krishnamurthy
« Reply #30 on: August 29, 2012, 12:18:34 PM »
Dear Hari,

1. You are putting a cart before the horses. Societal norms are for everyone. But in India, where both Sri Bhagavan and JK
lived, they should follow the societal norms.  In India polygamy is unlawful and equally unlawful is seducing a married woman.
So one should, if he calls himself a Jnani should avoid this. In case he cannot avoid sensual feelings, he can as well come down
and marry a girl and be happy. He should not go to the level of adopting a tricky incident to satisfy his sensual feelings and that
too with a woman who is married to some one else. If JK says - I am not a Jnani and I am an ordinary person, even then this
adultery is punishable and condemnable.

2. Tantric practices failed in India because of its impracticality., It is like walking on a parapet of a deep dry well. One mistake,
you will have a great downfall. Even in those Tantric practices, one should treat a girl as Devi and then  sleep with her.
This is a dangerous step. One mistake. All is lost. That is why when Sri Ramakrishna was asked to practice this Veera Marga
by Bhaivarai Brahmani, Sri Ramakrishna refused showing aversion to this practice.

3. No doubt some Jnanis of Jain religion walk naked occasionally on the streets of Bangalore. This I have seen. Now what
happens? They are given police protection!  What does it mean? Though it may be a good religious practice, it is forbidden
because the society at large does not take it kindly.

4. Even in T'malai, when Sri Bhagavan was for sometime staying in the Vahana Mantapam of the Temple during which time,
He had lost His torn coupina and had to be there fully naked for some days, some devotee brought a coupina for Him,
because the society would object to it. Sri Bhagavan also agreed and took the new coupona. This incident took place immediately
within a few years of His arrival in T'malai sometime in 1899 - 1900.

Arunahcala Siva.                         

Vinod

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Re: jiddu krishnamurthy
« Reply #31 on: August 29, 2012, 01:08:01 PM »
it is very difficult to not judge when the mind is overactive. Judging is the projection of our inner inferiorities outside.

Dear Hari,

Thats true, its very hard for us not to judge but at least we can restrict our self by not judging every thing and have control on the self. I believe only in preachings but not the source, sometimes we can also learn few things from animals and this doesnt mean that they are our guru or we are inferior to them and everybody has their own role in this world. As you have said it is all leela of the god and we are just the puppets.

Even Subramanian Ji has valid points, a person cannot do bad things in consciousness and come on the stage and preach good things.

As per the quotes of brother Atma Vichar - Maa ganga is the purest in himalayas and filthiest in kasi its just the way we look at things.

OM ARUNACHALESHWARAAYA NAMAHA!

 

Hari

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Re: jiddu krishnamurthy
« Reply #32 on: August 29, 2012, 01:45:11 PM »
Quote
Dear Hari,

Thats true, its very hard for us not to judge but at least we can restrict our self by not judging every thing and have control on the self. I believe only in preachings but not the source, sometimes we can also learn few things from animals and this doesnt mean that they are our guru or we are inferior to them and everybody has their own role in this world. As you have said it is all leela of the god and we are just the puppets.

Even Subramanian Ji has valid points, a person cannot do bad things in consciousness and come on the stage and preach good things.

As per the quotes of brother Atma Vichar - Maa ganga is the purest in himalayas and filthiest in kasi its just the way we look at things.

OM ARUNACHALESHWARAAYA NAMAHA!

Dear Vinod, what and who is a Guru? Guru is God in some form who teaches you to realize your nature. No matter how you would call It - the Self, Consciousness, the Light and so on. Even a stone can be your Guru because God is even in the stones and if He wishes He can teach you through that stone. He can teach you even through your mother, father, friends, birds, everything because God lives in everything in His Completeness but He manifests and acts in different way in His different forms.

Best wishes, Hari
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Hari

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Re: jiddu krishnamurthy
« Reply #33 on: August 29, 2012, 08:15:56 PM »
Dear Hari,

1. You are putting a cart before the horses. Societal norms are for everyone. But in India, where both Sri Bhagavan and JK
lived, they should follow the societal norms.  In India polygamy is unlawful and equally unlawful is seducing a married woman.
So one should, if he calls himself a Jnani should avoid this. In case he cannot avoid sensual feelings, he can as well come down
and marry a girl and be happy. He should not go to the level of adopting a tricky incident to satisfy his sensual feelings and that
too with a woman who is married to some one else. If JK says - I am not a Jnani and I am an ordinary person, even then this
adultery is punishable and condemnable.

2. Tantric practices failed in India because of its impracticality., It is like walking on a parapet of a deep dry well. One mistake,
you will have a great downfall. Even in those Tantric practices, one should treat a girl as Devi and then  sleep with her.
This is a dangerous step. One mistake. All is lost. That is why when Sri Ramakrishna was asked to practice this Veera Marga
by Bhaivarai Brahmani, Sri Ramakrishna refused showing aversion to this practice.

3. No doubt some Jnanis of Jain religion walk naked occasionally on the streets of Bangalore. This I have seen. Now what
happens? They are given police protection!  What does it mean? Though it may be a good religious practice, it is forbidden
because the society at large does not take it kindly.

4. Even in T'malai, when Sri Bhagavan was for sometime staying in the Vahana Mantapam of the Temple during which time,
He had lost His torn coupina and had to be there fully naked for some days, some devotee brought a coupina for Him,
because the society would object to it. Sri Bhagavan also agreed and took the new coupona. This incident took place immediately
within a few years of His arrival in T'malai sometime in 1899 - 1900.

Arunahcala Siva.                       

Everyone must follow societal norms because breaking them he/she causes frustration and sometimes mental pain to society as whole. So I don't consider a particular act as punishable and condemnable. Why is adultery generally wrong? Because this would lead to breaking a family and if there are children they would suffer, the victim of this affair also. But what if they both have been in love and this was their destiny? So why should we try to be the supreme judge and to mete out justice. The point was can the adulterer (supposing he is) Sri Krishnamurthy be a Jnani? I think why not? But he cannot be a teacher because nobody would follow him. I think that this topic is not in the spirit of this forum and the Master to Whom it is dedicated. So my part in this topic is over.
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Subramanian.R

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Re: jiddu krishnamurthy
« Reply #34 on: August 29, 2012, 08:31:16 PM »
Dear Hari,

Valmiki BECAME  a Jnani AFTER HE WAS A HUNTER.

Saint Kannappa BECAME  a Jnani AFTER HE WAS A HUNTER.

Pothana the telugu saint BECAME A  Jnani AFTER HE WAS A WOMANISER

Bhilvamangal the Malayalam saint BECAME A Jnani AFTER HE WAS A WOMANISER.

See the difference. They did not become hunters and womanisers AFTER BECOMING A JNANI.

A Jnani is on the top of the Hill. He should not step down to the foot hills and do atrocities.  If he does so, he is no
longer a Jnani. In other words, his Jnanabodham  did not permanently abide in His Heart and his mind / ego has jumped out
by giving a slip to the Heart.  He becomes a normal jivabodha.

Sri Sankara says even an advanced Sadhaka can easily down in the ladder of morality, like a ball rolled down from a
staircase, so quickly and so swiftly. (Viveka Choodamani)

If that be the case, a Jnani can  come own more easily and more swiftly  by a single act of grave mistake.
 
Arunachala Siva.

PS> It is also my last post on the subject of fake jnanis like JK and UGK and other thousands fake jnanis.

Arunachala Siva.

deepa

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Re: jiddu krishnamurthy
« Reply #35 on: August 29, 2012, 11:10:08 PM »
A Jnani is on the top of the Hill. He should not step down to the foot hills and do atrocities.  If he does so, he is no
longer a Jnani. In other words, his Jnanabodham  did not permanently abide in His Heart and his mind / ego has jumped out
by giving a slip to the Heart.  He becomes a normal jivabodha.

Sri Sankara says even an advanced Sadhaka can easily down in the ladder of morality, like a ball rolled down from a
staircase, so quickly and so swiftly. (Viveka Choodamani)

If that be the case, a Jnani can  come own more easily and more swiftly  by a single act of grave mistake.
 

I don't want to judge JK or anybody either.. I don't really know much about them anyways.

What does Bhagawan says about "abiding"? (sahaja samadhi?) Why do advanced sadhakas slip? Is it still because of their vasanas? Or were they not "advanced" to begin with and just appeared so to their disciples/devotees?

Btw, when the Nithyanandha episode happened, a friend called him modern day Vishwamitra.. So, slipping from a advanced maybe savikalpa samadhi has been happening and well-documented..



Vinod

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Re: jiddu krishnamurthy
« Reply #36 on: August 30, 2012, 11:56:41 AM »

Valmiki BECAME  a Jnani AFTER HE WAS A HUNTER.

Saint Kannappa BECAME  a Jnani AFTER HE WAS A HUNTER.

Pothana the telugu saint BECAME A  Jnani AFTER HE WAS A WOMANISER

Bhilvamangal the Malayalam saint BECAME A Jnani AFTER HE WAS A WOMANISER.

See the difference. They did not become hunters and womanisers AFTER BECOMING A JNANI.

Arunachala Siva.

Dear Subramanian,

Those are perfect examples even Chand Asoka(violent Asoka)  has been transformed to opposite after self realization and the rest was history. He moved to even other kingdoms to spread the word of peace and Dhyanam(as per Buddha teachings). He transformed from demon to jnani after self realization.

"A Jnani is on the top of the Hill. He should not step down to the foot hills and do atrocities" - I was thinking about the same when I was onbed and it has also brought some change in me, thank you for those wonderful comments and live examples.

OM ARUNACHALESHWARAAYA NAMAHA!