Author Topic: Thirukural Thread  (Read 18741 times)

atmavichar100

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Thirukural Thread
« on: January 16, 2015, 07:27:20 PM »
Today i.,e  Fri 16 Jan 2015 Thiruvalluvar Day I have started an exclusive thread to discuss about Thirukural , the great text given by Saint Thiruvalluvar for the entire Humanity .Tiruvalluvar Day marks the birth anniversary of the immortal Tamil Poet-Saint Thiruvalluvar. He is the author of Kural or Thirukural, a poetic composition of 1330 verses , a great antiquity in Tamil Literature which can be termed as a treatise on the art of living a happy and peaceful life.Thiruvalluvar in Thirukural diagnoses the intricacies of human nature and one will be captivated by his thorough knowledge of human psychology. Many of his insights on human mind are yet to be studied by modern psychology. His advices on various topics are sagacious and practical and are relevant in all times. Each new generation is attracted to his teachings in the Thirukural as it is not hampered by prejudice or dogma of any kind.

Here  are some facts of Thirukural .


Source :
http://www.quora.com/Tamil-language/What-are-some-mind-blowing-facts-about-Thirukural

1. Out of the 247 Tamil alphabets, just 37 have been used in the Thirukural
2. The only two flowers in the book are Anicham (Scarlet Pimpernel) and Kuvalai (Cup Flower)
3. Nezlhunji fruit is the only fruit featuring in the book
4. The only seed featuring in the book is, Kundrimani (Crab?s eye tree)
5. The two trees featuring in the boor are Palm and Bamboo.
6. The alphabet featuring the most times is ?னி? it features 1705 times.
7. The letters featuring only once are ளீ,ங .
8. The two words that are not used in the thirukural are தமிழ்(Tamil), கடவுள்(A word meaning God in Tamil).
9. The  first Tirukkural and Naladiyar texts published. This was by  Gnanaprakasam in 1812 and printed at the Masadinacaritai Printers in  Madras.
10. Total no of words is 14,000.
11. Total no of letters is 42,194.
12. Out of 247 letters,37 letters never used.
13. Number 9 never used.
14. The word 'Kodi' (Crore) used in 7 places.
15. The word '70 kodi' appears only once.
16. Translated into 26 Languages.
17. Translated into English by 40 authors.

These are the 5 Thirukkural?s that wont touch lips.
 310

 இறந்தார் இறந்தார் அனையர் சினத்தைத்
 துறந்தார் துறந்தார் துணை

 Iṟantār iṟantār aṉaiyar ciṉattait
 Tuṟantār tuṟantār tuṇai

 341

 யாதனின் யாதனின் நீங்கியான் நோதல்
 அதனின் அதனின் இலன்

 Yātaṉiṉ yātaṉiṉ nīṅkiyāṉ nōtal
 Ataṉiṉ ataṉiṉ ilaṉ

 489

 எய்தற்கு அரியது இயைந்தக்கால் அந்நிலையே
 செய்தற்கு அரிய செயல்

 Eytaṟku ariyatu iyaintakkāl annilaiyē
 Ceytaṟku ariya ceyal

 1082

 நோக்கினாள் நோக்கெதிர் நோக்குதல் தாக்கணங்கு
 தானைக்கொண் டன்னது உடைத்து

 Nōkkiṉāḷ nōkketir nōkkutal tākkaṇaṅku
 Tāṉaikkoṇ ṭaṉṉatu uṭaittu

 1296

 தனியே இருந்து நினைத்தக்கால் என்னைத்
 தினிய இருந்ததுஎன் நெஞ்சு

 Taṉiyē iruntu niṉaittakkāl eṉṉait
 Tiṉiya iruntatu?eṉ ne?cu

« Last Edit: January 16, 2015, 07:39:31 PM by atmavichar100 »
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2015, 07:34:26 PM »
Other facts of Thirukural :

All the Kurals have only 7 words and thus all the 1330 ThiruKuraLs fit within 140 characters. So we could say Thiruvalluvar, the author of ThirukuraL is world's 1st Tweeter!

The word 'Tamil' never occurs in any of the Kurals even once. Rightly making it as 'Ulaga Podhu Marai' (common to all irrespective of language,culture and ethnicity)

The word 'kadavul' does not appear in thirukkural
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2015, 07:37:51 PM »
Many consider Thirukural to be an anti vedic , anti sanskrit , anti brahmin book especially by the Dravidian Parties in TN . Here is a link to the views of Thirukural by a Vedic , Sanskrit Scholar and he has found lot of similarities between Thirukural and Vedic Teachings:

http://snsriramadesikan.com/thirukkural.html#Tirukkural
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2015, 11:48:54 AM »
PM Modi releases Gujarati translation of 'Thirukkural'

Source : http://zeenews.india.com/news/india/pm-modi-releases-gujarati-translation-of-thirukkural_1531558.html

New Delhi: Prime Minister Narendra Modi Friday released a Gujarati translation of Thiruvalluvar`s "Thirukkural", which holds a prime place among the classical Tamil literary works, an official statement said.

Friday was also observed as `Thiruvalluvar Day` dedicated to celebrated Tamil poet and philosopher, it said.
"I bow to the great Thiruvalluvar. Simple and vast in scope, his thoughts and writings have been a strong influence on humanity for centuries," Modi said on the occasion.


"The ideas expressed in `Thirukkural` are so universal that even after almost two millennia they are still relevant and revered. `Thirukkural` does not refer to any nation, leader, society, language, religion or caste in the entire book, which is why it has been called the universal Veda."



The Central Institute of Classical Tamil, an institute under the human resource development ministry, has taken up the mission of bringing out the "Thirukkural" in all Indian languages in which it has not been translated so far. The institute also proposes to launch an e-version of the book shortly.


The Gujarati translation has been done by P. C. Kokila, born in Gujarat, a professor of Hindi, and a resident of Tamil Nadu.
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

ksksat27

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2015, 06:19:06 PM »
Thirukural is unparallel and philsophical. 

please write one kural in a post.  i think your font size is very large.

kadavul is not used , but Iraivan,  Deivam etc. are used in many places.

And one must take pre-caution to stop with arathu paal.   portul paal and kaamathu paal not good for sadhaks, especially kaamathu paal.

atmavichar100

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2015, 12:59:29 PM »
Quote
please write one kural in a post.  i think your font size is very large.

Dear Kskat

I am right now studying Thirukural along with Bhagavad Gita and once my study matures I will write my own thoughts on the same . Right now I will only be posting here others opinions and translations of Thirukural as they are also part of my continued study . I conider Thirukural more as a reflective text that one must meditate upon and reflect his/her own life according to the Kurals and see the Truth of the same . Take For example this Thiru Kural "Theeyinal sutta punn ullaarum aaraathe naavinaal sutta vadu -தீயினால் சுட்ட புண் உள்ளாறும் ஆறாதே நாவினால் சுட்ட வடு -
The wounds of fire would vanish with time but the wounds caused by words never. "
  If we reflect on this Kural and see for ourselves how we were effected by wounds caused by words of others and how we caused wounds to others through our words then we can really see the Truth of this Thirukural . The same with each and every Thirukural .
I will do my best to share as much as I can the various resources of Thirukural First and then write in my own thoughts of the same .
As regards Fonts I deliberatly keep it big and highlight the key points accordingly as I found many Senior Citizens have diifculty in reading the small texts and want it big enough so that they can read it clearly even at a distance . That is one of the reasons why I also keep my posts quite short but with big fonts .
« Last Edit: January 23, 2015, 01:02:08 PM by atmavichar100 »
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2015, 01:20:35 PM »
An Excellent site for all the Thirukurals , their Trnsliteration with their meanings in Tamil as well as English .

http://www.gokulnath.com/thirukurals
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

ksksat27

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2015, 05:42:11 PM »
Dear sir wonderful.

ok you can keep fonts big if it helps old age people sir.....

I have few kurals to give more insights:  can you kindly give some insights on this?    I always study only Arathu paal.  what is your suggestion?  Kaamathu paal is not good for sadhaks ?

vaiyathul vaazhvaangu vaazhbhavan vaanuraiyum deivathul vaikka padum

thondrir pugazhodu thondruga adhilaar thondralin thondraamai nandru etc. 

Regards,
Krishna

atmavichar100

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2015, 10:08:02 PM »
Kskat

I am really not an authority to give my opinion on the Kurals that you have given or on  Kamathu Pal as I have not studied that .I am also a beginner only to Kural and have learned it in bits and pieces  and only now studying them properly and have started with Arathu Pal . As I said I consider Thirukural to be a very practical text that we need to use it to reflect on our own life as well as others .Just like when we feel dejected we contemplate on the wise words of our elders ,I feel Thirukural ( as well as Bhagavad Gita ) are tools for ur to reflect and apply appropriate course correction .
Also I feel the solution for one Kural will be in another chapter in another Kural and so it is better to study all the Thirukurals to get a very complete picture .
One More thing I wish to add - do not be too focussed on getting the right meaning in the first attempt itself .Keep studying the text and keep memorising the Thirukuals and these Kurals will enter your mind as divine seeds and will start yielding divine fruits in due course .That is the power of these divine texts like Thirukural , Bhagavad Gita , Thevaram , Thiruvachagam , Thiru arutpa , Bhagavan Ramana's Tamil Works etc . People go to Temples , Holy Places , Samadhis of Saints etc etc to receive the divine blessings and no doubt all these activities give divine blessings but one thing which I found effective that everyone can follow wherever they are are to study these divine texts daily with devotion and these divine texts will shower their grace of the reader .  Bhagavan Ramana may not be available in a Human form but his grace is available to us through his divine works . Same with Thirukural . The divine poets grace is there for those who study it sincerely and contemplate on  it daily . I will keep sharing my insights here as and when I progress on the same and till then keep posting others talks , views on Thirukural .

I suggest you listen to the excellent talk on Thirukural by Ilankai Jeyraj , a Tamil Eelam Saivite Spiritual Scholar
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24aAH95Df_A
 
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

Ravi.N

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2015, 08:15:37 AM »
atmavichar,
Excellent talk by Ilangai jeyaraj that covers so simply and succinctly varna ashrama dharma.Further without the dharmic foundation spiritual growth is just impossible.I also recommend the book Weavers wisdom,English translation of Tirukkural by the Himalayan academy.The Foreword by sri sivaya subramuniya swami is quite incisive and how this translation has been done and how it compares with the other translations is beautifully brought out.
https://www.himalayanacademy.com/book/weavers-wisdom

Sage TGN gave a series of 10 talks on Tirukkural ,the key to understand the couplets,how to break free from the Regimentation of chapterization(the classification into chapters happened much later as per the understanding/misunderstanding of the scholars).Many were the wonderful insights that TGN brought out-and in the process he let out the secret 'naan ahak katchiyai kandathai ungalukku sollugiren-I am narrating to you what I have seen in my inner vision.you will not find it in any book.'

Namaskar
« Last Edit: January 24, 2015, 08:19:17 AM by Ravi.N »

atmavichar100

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2015, 01:01:10 PM »
Dear Sri Ravi & Others

I know about Sage TGN's views on Thirukural and I suggest that when you have time you write his explanations on the same .This thread is only meant only for  Thirukural .So feel free to share any good insights , resources that you have on Thirukural .
BTW Thanks for the link to the book "Weavers Wisdom" ,I have downloaded the same .
« Last Edit: January 24, 2015, 01:15:39 PM by atmavichar100 »
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

ksksat27

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2015, 08:51:26 PM »
Kskat

I am really not an authority to give my opinion on the Kurals that you have given or on  Kamathu Pal as I have not studied that .I am also a beginner only to Kural and have learned it in bits and pieces  and only now studying them properly and have started with Arathu Pal . As I said I consider Thirukural to be a very practical text that we need to use it to reflect on our own life as well as others .Just like when we feel dejected we contemplate on the wise words of our elders ,I feel Thirukural ( as well as Bhagavad Gita ) are tools for ur to reflect and apply appropriate course correction .
Also I feel the solution for one Kural will be in another chapter in another Kural and so it is better to study all the Thirukurals to get a very complete picture .
One More thing I wish to add - do not be too focussed on getting the right meaning in the first attempt itself .Keep studying the text and keep memorising the Thirukuals and these Kurals will enter your mind as divine seeds and will start yielding divine fruits in due course .That is the power of these divine texts like Thirukural , Bhagavad Gita , Thevaram , Thiruvachagam , Thiru arutpa , Bhagavan Ramana's Tamil Works etc . People go to Temples , Holy Places , Samadhis of Saints etc etc to receive the divine blessings and no doubt all these activities give divine blessings but one thing which I found effective that everyone can follow wherever they are are to study these divine texts daily with devotion and these divine texts will shower their grace of the reader .  Bhagavan Ramana may not be available in a Human form but his grace is available to us through his divine works . Same with Thirukural . The divine poets grace is there for those who study it sincerely and contemplate on  it daily . I will keep sharing my insights here as and when I progress on the same and till then keep posting others talks , views on Thirukural .

I suggest you listen to the excellent talk on Thirukural by Ilankai Jeyraj , a Tamil Eelam Saivite Spiritual Scholar
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24aAH95Df_A
 


I agree sir,  repeating the divine text inward as I walk and go in bus helps tremendously in the sadhana.   I have that experience with Sri Ramana's Arunachala related poems like Navamanimalai, arunachala pathigam, arunachala pancharatnam and my Heart favorite Arunachala Asksharamani malai. only thing that soothes the mind is the reading or playing of Arunachala poems and upadesa undhiyar.

Earlier some kurals will go into my mind and rewind itself time and again -- like piravi perungadal neendhuvaar neendhaar iraivanadi seraadhar , anbirkum undo adaikkum thaazh etc.


Ravi.N

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2015, 07:46:47 AM »
Friends,

கற்க கசடறக் கற்பவை கற்றபின்
நிற்க அதற்குத் தக.
                        couplet 391

Learn thoroughly(without doubt or blemish)that which is learnt;Having learnt
Stand as That(as per that)

In this one couplet,The Great Sage Tiruvalluvar packs everything that is indispensable to Living.The Question arises as to what is  learning?Is he referring to learning of Physics,Chemistry or mathematics or a vocation?Is he referring to the systematic gathering of any sort of information and learning it without an iota of a doubt and obtain 100 % marks in an examination?

We have the clue to the nature of கல்வி in these couplets:

ஒருமைக்கண் தான் கற்ற கல்வி ஒருவற்கு
எழுமையும் ஏமாப் புடைத்து
                                      Couplet 398

This is usually translated like this:
The learning a man secures in one birth will secure his well-being in seven.

Again we need to contemplate on what is ஒருமைக்கண்-Is Tiruvalluvar refering to 'birth' here?What is that which one learns that will accompany him and secure him in seven generations or births?
Is it possible that Tiruvalluvar is referring to the Unity of our Being or Existence when he says ஒருமைக்கண் ?

ஒருமைக்கண் தான் கற்ற கல்வி then refers to Self Knowledge and He who has this knowledge and stands as That-This learning is never lost and secures his well being forever.

In couplet 393 Tiruvalluvar says:
கண்ணுடையர் என்பவர் கற்றோர் முகத்திரண்டு
புண்ணுடையர் கல்லா தவர்

Those that have EYE(singular-hence it refers to  vision) alone are learned(wise);The ignorant have only two sores in their visage.We may refer to what Sage avvaiyar had said:ஒன்றாக
காண்பதுவேகாட்சி  புலன் ஐந்தும் வென்றானது வீரமே வீரம்-Vision is that which sees unity and the courage of one who has conquered the five senses alone is courage.

In couplet 400,Tiruvalluvar says:
கேடில் விழுச்செல்வம் கல்வி யொருவற்கு
மாடல்ல மற்றை யவை
.

A man?s learning is an imperishable and precious wealth. No other possession is as golden.
Just like Gold remains as Gold and remains blemishless  and ever valuable,so is learning.மாடு means Gold.

It is clear that the Learning that Tiruvalluvar refers to is Self Knowledge.Having Learnt this Self Knowledge without an iota of doubt we should simply stand as That.
It is the standing as That that confirms that this learning is blemishless-Just talking about it does not mean anything.



Ravi.N

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2015, 08:17:42 AM »
Friends,
I warmly recommend Tirukkural by B S Acharya published by Narmada Pathippagam and costs Rs 100/-.It is quite a handy book(physically)and also has alphabetic index of verses  -so that we can quickly find the couplet that we have in mind.Ofcourse the translation is in plain tamizh and this we need to take it for what it is.We need to delve deeply into the verese and look for keys in the other verses to unlock the deep wisdom that it has to offer.The Deeper and earnest our study,the more we will learn and benefit.

தொட்டனைத் தூறும் மணற்கேணி மாந்தர்க்குக்
கற்றனைத் தூறும் அறிவு.




Ravi.N

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Re: Thirukural Thread
« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2015, 11:33:19 AM »
Krishna(ksksat),

You have asked:

Quote
And one must take pre-caution to stop with arathu paal.   portul paal and kaamathu paal not good for sadhaks, especially kaamathu paal.

Quote
I always study only Arathu paal.  what is your suggestion?  Kaamathu paal is not good for sadhaks ?

vaiyathul vaazhvaangu vaazhbhavan vaanuraiyum deivathul vaikka padum

thondrir pugazhodu thondruga adhilaar thondralin thondraamai nandru

Tiruvalluvar is a great sage and was a householder and the valluvar Vasuki relationship is one that is always given as an example of how a model couple should conduct themselves.
One may safely go to even a harem in Tiruvalluvar's company with the supreme confidence that it will benefit one.

With that bit of an introduction,I will just say that all that you have asked are related in one way or other-and if we deeply understand life and living we will find everything falling into place.

The Basic principle is this-Expansion is life and contraction is death.All experiences that expand our consciousness are steps that help us to root out the limited confines of egoistic living and attain freedom.The Dharma Artha(Porutpal) kama and Moksha gradation is based on this principle.He who lives life as it ought to be lived attains to the Highest good-

வையத்துள் வாழ்வாங்கு வாழ்பவன் வான்உறையும்
தெய்வத்துள் வைக்கப் படும்.


He who lives in this world as life ought to be lived
Shall abide as consciousness that permeates space.

Tiruvalluvar is giving a wonderful clue here that all that is required is not some 'super human' sadhana or 'special trick' to achieve liberation.All that is required is to live life as it Ought to be Lived.This in itself is enough!

The Great Sage says that All life is Yoga-There is nothing like so called separate Sadhana that sets it apart from temporal living.Man has to live in this world-He uses the phrase -வையத்துள் வாழ்வாங்கு வாழ்பவன்-He has to live like a man and live rightly.
He does not define this-He leaves it to the seeker to ponder;Elsewhere he says:

ஈதல் இசைபட வாழ்தல் அதுவல்லது
ஊதியம் இல்லை உயிர்க்கு.                                          verse 231

To Give (oneself) and to live harmoniously-Other than this
There is no expansion for the soul.

-To Give and Live Harmoniously are the very food for the soul and if one does this,such a one shall abide as consciousness forever.
He uses the word வைக்கப் படும் and not வைக்கப்படுவர்-The plurality of souls is only apparently so,what exists is one consciousness ,undivided,pure and simple.

He adds:
தோன்றின் புகழொடு தோன்றுக அஃதிலார்
தோன்றலின் தோன்றாமை நன்று
                couplet 236

If you must be born, be born for glory.
Those born without it would be better off without birth.

It is clear that Life has to be Lived purposefully and the 'Glory' referred to is not public fame-Publicity is here today and gone tomorrow.Glory is that which lasts-The Glory of The Buddha,Jesus christ,Prophet Mohammed,Yajnyavalkya & Maitreyi,avvaiyar,Tiruvalluvar,Sri Ramakrishna & sarada Devi.Sri Bhagavan-We can immediately sense what Tiruvalluvar means.
It makes us think of their parents who have yielded such glorious sons and daughters for the good of this world.These parents have also lived such lives of glory and only then they can yield such offspring.
Now these Glorious ones apart from the exception of Jesus ,the Christ are born of Sex only.This means Sex is something that can serve a noble purpose and it is incumbent on every one born of sex to understand its sacred precincts as well.It is only when one understands anything one can master it and learn to deploy it as and when necessary.
It is clear that Tiruvalluvar has dealt with the whole of Life and life cannot be compartmentalized -Each one has to see where he or she is and take what is appropriate with the objective of 'Expansion' and not stagnation.It is stagnation when we do not flow with life and are caught in 'Dos' and 'Donts'.It is stagnation when we endlessly go on repeating the same experiences day in and day out-eating,labouring to earn income ,snatching some pleasure amidst a dreary Living,Sleeping-again endlessly repeating until the day we exit this world.

Tirukkural gives a whole lot of insights to understand the basic Principles of Living,and living it fully and without compromises.

continued....
« Last Edit: January 26, 2015, 04:43:10 AM by Ravi.N »