Author Topic: When will it happen?  (Read 2401 times)

silence

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 55
    • View Profile
When will it happen?
« on: January 07, 2014, 06:50:45 AM »
I understand that we're already the Self, and there's nothing new to attain. But vasanas block this realization as clouds block the sun. So my question is, when will these vasanas get exhausted? How long?

Must we simply do self-inquiry and wait for the vasanas to get exhausted on their own? Or is there some other method?

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43540
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2014, 07:41:23 AM »
Dear silence,

Self Inquiry constantly and daily done, will burn away the Vasanas.  Bhagavan has confirmed it.

Arunachala Siva.

silence

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 55
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2014, 11:26:38 AM »
Dear silence,

Self Inquiry constantly and daily done, will burn away the Vasanas.  Bhagavan has confirmed it.

Arunachala Siva.

Dear Subramaniam, thanks. the reason i am asking is, when I try to do self-inquiry, all kinds of thoughts keep coming and going - I dont consciously think those thoughts, they just come and go. These are vasanas, I believe, since they are not in my control, they act as if they have a mind of their own. People recommend control - that we must control whatever occurs. But I feel that's futile, so that is why I wondered whether self-inquiry can slowly eliminate the vasanas. Point is, I wish to reach a state where, when I sit down or lie down, nothng should come to mind, only awareness.

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43540
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2014, 12:50:56 PM »
Dear silence,

It will also happen with persistent self inquiry.  Do not lose hope.

Arunachala Siva.

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2014, 06:53:48 PM »
Dear Sri silence,

Yes, we are always the Self and nothing but the Self. So, Sri Bhagwan taught to discard the illusion of the sense of otherness. Then, He has taught that the Self will shine forth, pure and pristine. Therefore, Its Realisation is nothing but one realising the unreality of one’s body and mind.  And thoughts are bound to arise as soon as one sits for meditation or Enquiry, for how else would vasanas be extricated from their deepest hiding places, only to be destroyed by the twin swords of Enquiry? It is natural that thoughts arise during the sadhana. One must keep vigilance so that as soon as a thought arises one must not swerve away from the Self-attention. However , if one does, one must be able to notice it, by persistent sadhana, as soon as possible, and by  resorting to the  the Ultimate Question, that is, ‘Who am I?’, one must be able to come back to one’s True Atma-Swarupa.

Dear Sri silence, I feel that you are graced to practice the profound Path of Self-enquiry.  There is therefore no need to worry whatever. Self-enquiry is its own Light. Faith in its Efficacy and Perseverance are the Key and the rest is the work of His Grace which is the Primary Cause in the first place, being the Middle, as well as the End.

Thanks very much.
Pranam,
  Anil

silence

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 55
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2014, 07:55:53 PM »
Dear eranilkumarsinha,

Thanks. I am just worried that my inquiry is going nowhere. The thoughts are always there - mental state hasn't changed, but inquiry keeps going. So i am a little concerned that I am doing something wrong.

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2014, 07:54:58 AM »
Quote from Sri silence:
“I understand that we're already the Self, and there's nothing new to attain.”
“I am just worried that my inquiry is going nowhere. The thoughts are always there - mental state hasn't changed, but inquiry keeps going. So i am a little concerned that I am doing something wrong.”



Dear Sri silence,

I do not know how you practice Self-enquiry. You have mentioned in your post that you understand that you are already the Self and that there is nothing new to attain. That is so very good even if the understanding is intellectual to start with.
Dear Sri silence, Sri Bhagwan has taught that the degree of absence of thought is the measure of progress on the path, and that it is not always possible for the seeker to gauge his own progress.

Yes, we are the Self and there is nothing new to attain. Therefore, to whom is the thought always there? Obviously then to the ‘RISEN’ ego or the ‘I’-thought, which is a thought  after all, shining in the Light of the Consciousness of the Self. All other thoughts are connected to the core or central ‘I’-thought only.  AND  THE  EGO  OR  THE  ‘I’-THOUGHT  COMES  HOLDING  ONLY  ‘US’,  THAT  IS,  THE  SELF,  FOR  IT IS  NOT  AN  INDEPPENDENT  ENTITY,  NAY,  NO  ENTITY  AT  ALL . It comes and goes, appears and disappears, but we always truly remain as we are, the ‘I’ that is purnam, the perfection, but ego rises, we forget ourselves and identify with the ‘not-Self’.  This is why Sri Bhagwan has taught to hold ourselves (Self) and the ego and its thoughts would disappear, being unreal, HAVING NO REAL BEING.

Dear Sri silence, practice therefore consists in withdrawal within the Self every times you are disturbed by a thought. Thus, if you are able to attend to the ‘I’-feeling or ‘I’-ness, to the exclusion of all other thoughts, this too eventually will dissolves in the Self and culminate in the Self-Realisation. This is the Teaching, and we will do rather well when we keep it simple. 
 

Thanks very much.
Pranam,
  Anil

silence

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 55
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2014, 10:53:06 AM »
Dear Anil,

Thanks again for explaining in detail. One doubt, if you don't mind. What does it mean to hold on to the "I" thought? I am assuming the I thought is NOT the Self but the ego, correct? So by clinging to the ego, other thoughts will disappear, is that it? Then finally the ego will also disappear?

Is this right, or am I misunderstanding?

Also when I look for the I thought, it is not there. :-[

ksksat27

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 950
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2014, 03:41:01 PM »
I understand that we're already the Self, and there's nothing new to attain. But vasanas block this realization as clouds block the sun. So my question is, when will these vasanas get exhausted? How long?

Must we simply do self-inquiry and wait for the vasanas to get exhausted on their own? Or is there some other method?

Dear Silence

Your question about vasanas and its destruction is good.   Many scritpures have talked about it.  You are following Bhagavan Sri Ramana's path and have doubts as sincere sadhaka.

But there is a basic fundamental error in putting this question to all of us.   It is that ,  all of us in this forum who are reading and offering you advise are not yet fully self realized.  So whatever answer we give you, whatever tips we give you are from our own ego-minds only.  It is not true knowledge out of which we all answer your question. It is only out of book and inferred knowledge,  we all give out various tips and answers.

So I would suggest, to get tips in your sadhana and clear your doubts either of below can be done:

i) you have to find a living fully realized master and put this question to him.

ii) Or if you cannot find or have no time, for time being you can directly put this question in a paper and place it before the photo of Ramana Maharihi or you can mentally submit it to Hrudayam (Nirguna Brahmam not physical Heart)  and then wait for
an answer. You will get tips and answers to doubts intuitively.

You can always do ii) simulatenously but if you can manage to do i) you are very fortunate.

Beloved Abstract

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 228
    • View Profile
    • David Ford Art
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2014, 07:58:33 PM »
who is it that understands we are already the self ?
who is it that has vasanas blocking realization ?
to who does it matter if vasanas get exhausted ?
who is it that has doubt ?
who is it that has "i " thoughts ?
who  is it that wants vasanas to stop ?
who is it that is concerned they are doing something wrong ?
.....
find the answer to these questions first then see if you still need the other questions answered
hint ..... they all have the same answer
ha ha ha    :)

simply stop telling the story of the self and see who you are without it

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2014, 10:16:06 AM »
Quote from Sri silence:
“One doubt, if you don't mind. What does it mean to hold on to the "I" thought? I am assuming the I thought is NOT the Self but the ego, correct? So by clinging to the ego, other thoughts will disappear, is that it? Then finally the ego will also disappear?

Is this right, or am I misunderstanding?

Also when I look for the I thought, it is not there.  ”



Dear Sri silence,

As you may be aware from my posts, I returned back after a 16-days tour to South India on 5.1.14.Works at home and work-place kept piling and I had to immediately attend to them despite inclement weather. North India is at present reeling under the severe cold-wave. All this caused delay in my response to your earnest question.

Holding on to the ‘I’-thought means practicing to be still with only the thought  of the Self, ‘Atma-chintanai’ (Who am I?), that is, remaining firmly in Self-abidance, without allowing even the least room to the rising of any other thought, other than the thought of the Self. Sri Bhagwan used the word ‘Atma-chintanai’ to denote only the Self-attention.
Self-attention is nothing but attending to the feeling ‘I’, or the consciousness ‘I’, which is the common daily experience of everyone of us, uninterruptedly, without allowing room to the rising of other thoughts. Clinging to the feeling ‘I’ or the consciousness ‘I’ and gaining greater and greater intensity upon it and acquiring greater and greater clarity, are diving within, and deeper and deeper within.

Dear Sri silence, we are all the single indivisible ‘WHOLE’, and Sri Bhagwan taught that the ego never really existed. If we enquire into ourselves, the APPARENT EGO and concomitant ignorance will disappear. In the present state of ignorance, however, what we call our ‘self’ is this ego which partakes of both the EVER-CONSCIOUS SELF and from the UNCONSCIOUS MATTER. But the moment the ego self tries to know itself, it begins to partake less and less of the insentient matter in which is presently absorbed and more and more of the Consciousness of the Self.

Sri Bhagwan thus has taught that the ego is not a real entity and therefore just as it is not necessary to kill the imagined snake in the rope, so also, there is no need to destroy the ego-mind. “KNOWING THE FORM OF THE EGO-MIND MAKES IT DISAPPEAR.”

Therefore, the search for the Source of the ego is the Quest for the very Source from where arises the ‘I am’-ness, the primary, irreducible datum of all our experiences whatever, which is ever-present in all of us. 

Thus, if one perseveres on the Path of Enquiry, one finds that the Self-attention is not a mental activity, for it enables to stop rising as the ego or the ‘I’-thought, and enables to stay as the Pure ‘I’ which is our Being, our Natural State, that is, the State of mere Existence.


Thanks very much.
Pranam,
  Anil   

silence

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 55
    • View Profile
Re: When will it happen?
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2014, 09:08:10 PM »
Thanks so much, Mr. Anil. I also hope your trip was pleasant. Are you a North Indian (and if so wouldn't you be the only one on this forum :))?

I can't say I understand it all, but it is something to think about. I can understand theoretically, but when actually trying it out it's like I've hit an impasse. Hence the frustration. That's why I keep wondering if I am doing it right. I understand we should hold on to I-thought, but here's the problem .... all thoughts other than I-thought is well-defined .... such as thoughts about a certain object, person etc. But I-thought is so vague, so holding to it is so hard.

I can't explain it well, though. Sorry.