Author Topic: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue  (Read 3523 times)

ksksat27

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We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« on: September 05, 2013, 10:40:21 PM »
Dear all,

We all speak of qualifications for vedantic study , self enquiry, ekadasi fasting,  karma ,  different lokas etc. etc. etc.

But without going to much complexities we should learn to  simply put down our ego
with folded hands , stand before our father Arunachala Shiva and make a simple loving prayer:

"oh my Father Arunachala Shiva I dont even know to have full faith on you or know to pronounce your name.  Then what to speak of the qualifications for vedantic study or jnana yoga.   Further my body does not allow to do raja yoga.  So I humbly pray to you,  please remove my ignorance and grant me the jnana which is sought after by even great ardent sages.  please forgive all my errors and sins and upliftt me,  grant me more and more of your devotion Arunachala"


In the end the above prayer will do invoke Grace than all our own qualifications put together.

When this simple faith , trust and bhakthi to Arunachala who was revealed by our Guru Sri Ramana is not there with us, no use of all the other complex analysis of various tatvas and qualifications.

Daily quote from the 108 verses on Arunachala, by Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi

I am a fool who prays only when overwhelmed by misery, yet show me Thy Grace sincerely, O Arunachala!





Vinod

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2013, 02:29:42 PM »
Dear Ksksat,

Very sweet and heart touching prayer. In this busy world of career ambitions & personal motives we tend to forget praying to our beloved Arunachala & our eternal master Ramana. Inspite of things turning in our way at times, we still forget to thank our Arunachala for the fruits & still we always utter Arunachala! the moment we are in trouble.

It is indeed very beautiful way of praying esp for people of this generation who are not much in to satvic practices.

Om Arunaachaleshwaraaya Namaha!

Subramanian.R

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2013, 02:44:08 PM »
Dear Krishnan,

Nice prayer.  'One should pray like a child' said one poet.  Simple prayers have their own effect on a person who prays.

While going to bed, I used to pray:  "Bhagavan, you remain ever in my heart, during jagrat, swapna and sushupti.
Every nano second of my life is dictated by you."   

Arunachala Siva.

atmavichar100

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2013, 09:26:30 PM »
Bhavani Ashtakam
A Prayer to Mother Divine,Bhavani, written by Shri Aadi Shankaracharya.

This poem addressed to Mother Bhavani by a helpless devotee who feels he has not done any religious duties , has no idea of yoga , tantra , mantra , has done lot of bad deeds in the past  etc yet he wants to be devoted to Mother Bhavani and prays to her that she is the only refuge for him . The spirit of the prayer can be used when praying to one's Ishta Devata like Shiva , Subramanya , Narayana , Krishna , Arunachala etc

http://www.greenmesg.org/mantras_slokas/devi_bhavani-bhavani_ashtakam.php

Meaning:
1.1: Neither the Father, nor the Mother; Neither the Relation and Friend, nor the Donor,
1.2: Neither the Son, nor the Daughter; Neither the Servant, nor the Husband,
1.3: Neither the Wife, nor the (worldly) Knowledge; Neither my Profession,
1.4: You are my Refuge, You Alone are my Refuge, Oh Mother Bhavani.

Meaning:
2.1: In this Ocean of Worldly Existence which is Endless, I am full of Sorrow and Very much Afraid,
2.2: I have Fallen with Excessive Desires and Greed, Drunken and Intoxicated,
2.3: Always Tied in the Bondage of this miserable Samsara (worldly existence),
2.4: You are my Refuge, You Alone are my Refuge, Oh Mother Bhavani.

3.1: Neither do I know Charity, nor Meditation and Yoga,
3.2: Neither do I know the practice of Tantra, nor Hymns and Prayers,
3.3: Neither do I know Worship, nor dedication to Yoga,
3.4: You are my Refuge, You Alone are my Refuge, Oh Mother Bhavani.

4.1: Neither do I Know Virtuous Deeds, nor Pilgrimage,
4.2: I do not know the way to Liberation, and with little Concentration and Absorption,
4.3: I know neither Devotion, nor Religious Vows; Nevertheless Oh Mother,
4.4: You are my Refuge, You Alone are my Refuge, Oh Mother Bhavani.

5.1: I performed Bad Deeds, associated with Bad Company, cherished Bad Thoughts, have been a Bad Servant,
5.2: I did not perform my Traditional Duties, deeply engaged in Bad Conducts,
5.3: My eyes Saw with Bad Intentions, tongue always Spoke Bad Words,
5.4: You are my Refuge, You Alone are my Refuge, Oh Mother Bhavani.

6.1: Little do I know about The Lord of Creation (Brahma), The Lord of Ramaa (Goddess Lakshmi) (Vishnu), The Great Lord (Shiva), The Lord of the Devas (Indra),
6.2: The Lord of the Day (Surya) or The Lord of the Night (Chandra),
6.3: I do not know about other gods, but always seeking Your Refuge,
6.4: You are my Refuge, You Alone are my Refuge, Oh Mother Bhavani.

7.1: During Dispute and Quarrel, during Despair and Dejection, during Intoxication and Insanity, in Foreign Land,
7.2: In Water, and Fire, in Mountains and Hills, amidst Enemies,
7.3: In Forest, please Protect me,
7.4: You are my Refuge, You Alone are my Refuge, Oh Mother Bhavani.

8.1: I am Helpless, Poor, Afflicted by Old Age and Disease,
8.2: Very Weak and Miserable, always with a Pale Countenance,
8.3: Fallen Asunder, Always surrounded by and Lost in Troubles and Miseries,
8.4: You are my Refuge, You Alone are my Refuge, Oh Mother Bhavani.


However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

deepa

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2013, 06:28:13 AM »
Atmavichar,
Bhavani ashtakam is a big favorite of mine.
How did Adi Shankara who had mastered everything mentioned in it write that he knew nothing?
Did he write from a immature sadhaka standpoint for our benefit?
Did he believe and want to convey that surrender trumps all acquired knowledge?

Thanks for sharing,
Deepa

atmavichar100

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2013, 07:48:16 AM »
Deepaji

Next time when I meet Swami Paramarthananda ( my Vedantic Teacher ) I will put the above questions to him and get the answer and share the same . Adi Shankara apart from writing extensive Commentary on the Gita , 10 Upanishads , Brahmasutras also wrote many minor Vedanta Works ( from Ekashloki to Upadesa Sahasri ) and also lot of Hymns addressing various deities that are worshiped in most parts of India .
Why he wrote them , for whom he wrote them ,is it  a contradiction between what he wrote in his Gita /Upanishad Bhaashyams v/s what he expressed in his poems I do not want to speculate as there is lot of speculative and superficial interpretation of Adi Shankara's works by many people without studying his Bhashyas and works in depth and I do not want to add to that confusion by my own superficial interpretation .
I will get the answer from Swami Paramarthananda himself when I meet him next in person as he is the person whom I rely for all answers relating  to Adi Shankra and his works  and currently I am attending his Bhagavad Gita lectures .
« Last Edit: September 16, 2013, 08:03:07 AM by atmavichar100 »
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

Ravi.N

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2013, 08:12:50 AM »
Friends,

Quote
Bhavani ashtakam is a big favorite of mine.
How did Adi Shankara who had mastered everything mentioned in it write that he knew nothing?
Did he write from a immature sadhaka standpoint for our benefit?
Did he believe and want to convey that surrender trumps all acquired knowledge?



"Even the jnAni who has had the non-dual Enlightenment, still enjoys the play of mAyA. He sees the different things; but knows they are all one. Just as a spectator of a play who is not playing any role in it, the jnAni enjoys the playful novelties of mAyA and revels in his devotion to that parA-Sakthi who is the author of it all. To be keeping such jnAnis in this dual-non-dual state is also the work of Mother Goddess. Mark it. It is not that the jnAni is showing Devotion just for the sake of others only. No, By himself he is indeed thinking ( I think the Mahaswamigal is here letting out an autobiographical tip !-rA ganapathy)-"‘What a pleasure to witness this dualistic play of the non-dualistic One ! What a multiplicity of beauty, panoramic variety and continuity of Love !’ . Thus revelling in that blissful vision, he continues to pour out his own love (bhakti) to that Transcendental Power from the bottom of his heart. This tribute to the jnAni has been given by the great Teacher Suka himself.

Quote
(Cf. Bhagavatam 1-7-10:
AtmArAmAshca munayaH nirgranthA apy-urukrame;
kurvanty-ahaitukIm bhaktim itham-bhUta-guNo hariH. – meaning,
Those who revel in the Self, even though rid of all attachments,
show a causeless bhakti towards the Lord, just naturally.)

On the one hand the devotee who has yet to get the Enlightenment enjoys the devotional state for the very reason of getting the Enlightenment; on the other hand, the one who is already enlightened and is a jIvan-mukta shows his bhakti for the sake of enjoyment of that bhakti and not for any other reward or purpose".

Kanchi MahAswAmi in his Magnificient talk on soundarya Lahari.(Excerpted from Deivathin Kural-by rA Ganapathy).Those interested may download:
http://www.advaitin.net/Articles/Soundaryalahari1.pdf
We have the example of Sri Ramakrishna in recent times who exemplified this Truth.
Namaskar.

deepa

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2013, 08:52:23 AM »
Raviji
That is a beautiful excerpt in periyava's simple style. There is no doubt that gnanis continue to have bhakthi for saguma ishwara also as bhagawan, Ramakrishna et al demonstrated. 

However, my question was on why Adi Shankara is denying his immense knowledge of mantra, yantra, bhakthi, vratam? Why is he claiming to have been "kulachara heena" etc.?
Is it just humility or written for our sake ? Or attitude of surrender?

Atmavichar, will be nice to have Swami Paramarthananda's opinion. I am a regular listener of his lectures, especially BG. I had the fortune to visit and get his blessings while I was in chennai recently.

Deepa

Ravi.N

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2013, 09:22:04 AM »
Deepa,

Yes,I appreciate your need to listen to what Swami Paramarthananda says.
I will only share my view here-I see no contradiction as this sort of a Bhakti cannot be rationalized.I will simply refer to the way we fondle a Baby with sweet  nothings.This in no way means that this is contradicting our ability to speak.
Sri Bhagavan when asked to explain the true import of Akshara MaNa maalai simply said-'Please think it over for yourself.There was simply no mentation when it was composed'(Paraphrased by me-Ravi)
It is that supreme Shakti that composed these verses through these channels-and it has nothing at all to do with the so called  'individual attainment or endowment' of these Great ones.
It is Ahaituki-causeless and what is expressed is likewise.One has to approach it as such.

Namaskar.

Subramanian.R

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #9 on: September 16, 2013, 09:45:40 AM »
Dear Deepa,



It is natural for any realized person to portray himself, as lowly, sinful and achara-heena.  You can see this in Sri
Sankara's Sri Subramanya Bhujangam, Tayumanavar songs and Saint Manikkavachagar's songs.  Manikkavachagar
calls himself lowly dog in many places in Tiruvachakam.  Sri Sankara's says - I do not know prose, poetry, etc.,

Arunachala Siva.
 

atmavichar100

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #10 on: September 16, 2013, 10:42:40 AM »
Deepaji

I concur with what Ravi and Subramaniam Sir with regard to these poems i.e there really need not be any specific reason why they composed and it can be a divine play and sometimes for humility sake and also to boost the confidence of ordinary sadhaks who are struggling on the spiritual paths these poems could be written .This trait is visible in many poems of Adi Shankra as well as Tamil Jnanis like Manickavachagar , Tayumanavar , Ramalinga Swamigal etc .

However there are specific contexts in which certain poems came like Manisha Panchkam ( in Kasi ) when Acharya Sankara was humbled by a Chandala , Subramanya Bhujangam ( in Tirechendur ) when he was suffering from a severe stomach ailment .I will find out from Swami Paramarthananda in what context Bhavani Ashtakam was written and for whom it was addressed . In case it was written for general purpose how we must take its meaning .

BTW Happy to note that you met  Swami Paramarthananda and got his blessings during your visit to Chennai and that you follow his talks on BG . Most of his talks are uploaded in the sumukam site . I was able to get a bit clarity on Bhagavan Ramana's  Teachings only after attending his talks on BG seriously since last Gita Jayanti ( in Dec 2012 ) and right now only in 6th Chapter and still a long way to go .
« Last Edit: September 16, 2013, 10:51:03 AM by atmavichar100 »
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

ksksat27

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2013, 10:36:35 PM »
I think here again we too much think on brain and try to over analyze and compare simple poems ,  brahma sutra,  light , heavy ,  grand, humble etc.

Further this is the beauty -- we have a doubt on Adi Shankara,  we want to ask somebody else because we are very much convinced that Adi Shankara is no more to answer.  This is where head comes and dominates as our Heart.

Why not?  We can directly ask all these questions to Adhi Shankara? But how?

take some free time out of your schedule,  have a photo of Ganesh and Adi Shankara,  light lamp and incense ,  offer invocations to Ganesh,  your Guru and Adhi Shankara.  Slowly put your question, pour out your Heart on what all doubts, problems, confusions we have to Adhi Shankara. That is it.

Leave it at that.  One day you will get an answer intuitively.   No need for interpretations.

Because Adi Shankara is Self now,  the Self knows to hear and reciprocate our devotion is not it?

Any form we think we are having a contact with that form through Self.  So Adhi Shankara very much speaks now through the formless speechless silence,  the silence of the Heart.

atmavichar100

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2013, 08:06:41 PM »
Raviji
That is a beautiful excerpt in periyava's simple style. There is no doubt that gnanis continue to have bhakthi for saguma ishwara also as bhagawan, Ramakrishna et al demonstrated. 

However, my question was on why Adi Shankara is denying his immense knowledge of mantra, yantra, bhakthi, vratam? Why is he claiming to have been "kulachara heena" etc.?
Is it just humility or written for our sake ? Or attitude of surrender?

Atmavichar, will be nice to have Swami Paramarthananda's opinion. I am a regular listener of his lectures, especially BG. I had the fortune to visit and get his blessings while I was in chennai recently.

Deepa

Dear Deepaji

Today I was fortunate to meet Swami Paramarthananda in person ( went along with my brother who has come from USA for a short visit here ) and I asked him the above question . He said Adi Shankara wrote the poems in first person and hence who ever chants should take it for himself the meaning of those verses . That is the primary purpose and secondary is that however great a person is he keeps himself humble when he writes poems praising the deity .So next time we chant Bhavani Ashtakam we must feel that the verses refer  only to us and not to Shankaracharya .
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

deepa

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Re: We shoud not lose that sweet innocent prayer attidue
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2013, 10:33:19 PM »
Thanks, atmavicharji.

I have started chanting this often.. I think it summarizes the feeling of helplessness and weakness that I feel often when I feel I lack control over my sadhana and give in to worldy temptation and agitation, the only thing to do is surrnder to Guru in the form of Bhavani and let Him/Her take over.

I also agree with ksksatji. The less we use our brain, the better :)