Author Topic: The nature of Jnana  (Read 6440 times)

Jewell

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2013, 04:04:48 PM »
Dear Sri Silentgreen,

Yes,good question. I believe that there is no gruoping thoughts for jnani. He is not led by the thoughts. Any thought,bad or noble. Thoughts are thoughts. Thats why complete silence comes,or,its all about.
And the freedom of jnani not to become robber,or to take advantage of wisdom,is freedom from ego,from personality. From robber or Saint. Both. I supose it is known when its happen. And that is,when any notion of me,mine,compulsion,doership in general is left. When there is no person who is or thinks this or that.

With love and prayers,

silentgreen

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #16 on: March 11, 2013, 04:10:43 PM »
So, what is that extra (other than watching thoughts in a non-attached way) in jnana which makes thoughts like dharma / adharma and himsa / ahimsa get special significance?
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Jewell

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2013, 04:14:58 PM »
Dear Sri Silentgreen,

It is the heart,Silence. Or even that is not quite true. I believe there is no special significance at all. No thought is of any value. It is the way it is. Only that,i believe.

Nagaraj

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #18 on: March 11, 2013, 04:20:36 PM »
If jnana is simply watching a set of thoughts or ideas flowing by without any attachment, where is the requirement of grouping thoughts based on dharma / adharma or himsa / ahimsa? How does such thoughts get special categories?

For a Jnani, Thoughts flow if He wills, Movement of Thoughts can be compared with the Shakti. There is no Shakti without Shiva and there is no Shiva without Shakti.

A Jnani cannot watch thoughts as  a Jnani can never be different from the thoughts. Like Bhagavan said, Jnanis mind itself is Brahman. Shiva itself is Shakti and Shakti itself is Shiva.

Some revelations of Saint Jnaneshwar -

Sugar and its sweetness
Cannot be separated from one another,
Nor can camphor and its fragrance.

If there are flames,
There is also the fire.
If we catch hold of Shakti,
We have Shiva as well.

The Sun appears to shine because of its rays,
But it is the Sun itself, which produces the rays.
In act, that glorious Sun and its shining
Are one and the same.

To have a reflection, one must have an object;
If we see a reflection, then we infer
That an object exists.
Likewise, the supreme Reality, which is one,
Appears to be two.

Through Her,
The absolute Void becomes the manifest world;
But Her existence
Is derived from Her Lord.

Shiva Himself became His beloved;
But, without Her presence,
No universe exists.

Because of Her form,
God is seen as the world;
But He created Her form
Of Himself.

Embarrassed by Her formless Husband
And Her own graceful form,
She adorned Him with a universe
Of myriad names and forms.

In unity, there is little to behold;
So She, the mother of abundance,
Brought forth the world as a play.

She made evident the glory of Her Lord
By spreading out Her own body-form;
And He made Her famous by concealing Himself.

He takes the role of Witness
Out of love of watching Her;
But when Her appearance is withdrawn,
The role of Witness is abandoned as well.

Through Her,
He assumes the form of the universe;
Without Her,
He is left naked.

Although He is manifest,
He, Himself, cannot be seen.
It is only because of Her
That He appears as universal form.

When He is awakened by Her,
Shiva perceives the world;
Then He enjoys this dish She serves,
As well as She who serves.

While He sleeps, She gives birth
To the animate and inanimate worlds;
When She rests,
Her Husband disappears.

When He conceals Himself,
He cannot be discovered without Her grace.
They are as mirrors, each to the other.

When He embraces Her,
It is His own Bliss that Shiva enjoys.
He is the enjoyer of everything,
But there is no enjoyment without Her.

She is His form,
But Her beauty comes from Him.
By their intermingling,
They are, together, enjoying this feast.

Shiva and Shakti are the same,
Like air and its motion,
Or like gold and its luster.

Fragrance cannot be separated from musk,
Nor heat from fire;
Neither can Shakti be separated from Shiva.

Embracing each other, they merge into one,
As darkness merges into light
At the breaking of dawn.

All levels of speech, from Para to Vaikari,
Merge into silence
When their true nature is realized,
Just as the ocean and the Ganges both merge
Into the primal Waters
When the universal Deluge comes.

Likewise, while attempting
To see Shiva and Shakti,
Both the seer and his vision disappear.
Again and again, I offer salutations
To that universal pair.

.............. i have to stop from posting more... each verse is so pulling!!!! thank you..

--
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Jewell

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #19 on: March 11, 2013, 04:28:30 PM »
I agree with Sri Nagaraj. Beautiful verse! Thank You!
There is no division in the end,and identification with any thought,in the same time. It is total functioning.
It is the way it is.

silentgreen

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #20 on: March 11, 2013, 04:39:30 PM »
Dear Tushinam,
What is jnana?
That is what I am asking you to provide in the context of my previous question. A direct precise answer.


Dear Jewel,
When the notion of me and mine is not there, what is still left to become sensitive to dharma / adharma and himsa / ahimsa?
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Subramanian.R

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2013, 04:52:48 PM »
Dear silentgreen,

1. Sri Bhagavan says that other names of Jnana is Peace, Bliss and Love. When these are there, how can a Jnani live without
loving others. (See Pancharatnam, Verse 5). So he cannot definitely rob anyone since he even loves robbers and wealthy man.

2. vyavaharika princple is that a Jivan Mukta, wakes up, dreams and sleeps also. This is the practical aspect of his life.
But really speaking, he treats the three avastas as dreams only. Because he knows the paramatika satyam, the Absolute
Truth. And this makes him free from there avastas, three gunas and three aspects of death, rebirth and and death again.
He has totally overcome all the aspects mentioned above, and he is gunatita, avasthatita and kala kala.

3. He is totally detached. All the works he does are not attaching themselves to him. Whether essential works like eating, drinking,
and attending to nature calls, bathing etc., are done as if he is in somnambulism.

Arunachala Siva.       

Jewell

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2013, 05:00:14 PM »
Dear Sri Silentgreen,

I believe there is no fixed classification. It is the moment insight,recognition,or not even that. There is no one to decide,it is simple functioning. It is the Heart,the Self,That.
In general,i supose,anything which is drived by any selfish reasons or motives,which violates,which is not for greater good,is bad. Althrough,individual cannot by any chance to know that. So long is there some trace of individuality left,error is bound to happen. So long is none, there is no error. But jnani is not a person anyway. Jnani is That. Thought I Am Jnani cannot be right. There is no I to be Jnani. Jnani is That. What will happen with some body is irrelevant. Looking through the eyes of Jnana,there cannot be error. Even Jnani is all wrong word. There is only Jnana,there is only That in the end.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 05:26:25 PM by Jewell »

Subramanian.R

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #23 on: March 11, 2013, 05:05:09 PM »
Dear Jewell,

Sri Bhagavan has said that Peace, Bliss and Love are other names for Jnana.


Somnambulism refers to a Jnani's action as if  he does everything as in sleep. As a somnambulist would do.

Arunachala Siva.

Hari

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #24 on: March 11, 2013, 05:12:35 PM »
Jnana is realization that there is only one Reality Which nature is sat-chit-ananda and there is nothing apart from It. There is such thing like 'good' thoughts. Good thoughts are quality of the sattvic mind. Jnanis mind is sattvic. That's why a jnani cannot be robber after Atma-jnana. And why He/She should steal when He/She know that everything is His/Hers? Why to kill and how when there is nothing to be killed?
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Jewell

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #25 on: March 11, 2013, 05:17:52 PM »
Dear Sri Subramanian sir,

Yes,true. And that explanation is also given to please our minds. It is done,all actions,by That ultimatievly,and nothing is done in essence. I think there is no fixed word for that,or explanation. It will be known only when that is riched. Or,when everything is droped. No word exept silence can explane that.
And,yes,Jnani is Bliss and Love,the Self. That is word i guess.

With love and prayers,

Jewell

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #26 on: March 11, 2013, 05:23:59 PM »
Dear Hari,

Yes. There are no good or bad thoughts in the end. Only thoughts. Jnani stoped to be anything,He cannot by any means become the robber,or Saint. They are diametricaly opposite.
 

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #27 on: March 11, 2013, 05:30:30 PM »
Jnani is the Self. He can be only the Self. He cannot be good or bad, person or animal, this or that. He is what He is. It is unexplainable. The Truth cannot be explained. That's why Lord Jesus just has said: "Know the Truth and the Truth will set you free." What kind of Truth? The Truth is the Kingdom of God. But there It is? "The Kingdom of God is within you" has said the Lord. But how to find It? "Follow my teachings". Lord Jesus has known that the Truth cannot be explained and just instructed people how they alone can find It and experience It.
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Jewell

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #28 on: March 11, 2013, 07:44:03 PM »
Dear Hari,

So true.
And anyone who can in any way violate any 'knowledge' is only the person. I believe that in 'life of Jnani everything is reflected by the Truth. In the life of sadhaka,all become, reflected with the Truth also. But reflected,given,brought about. If someone chose to act this way or that,leading himself with thinking :"It doasnt matter what i do,i am not this,i can kill someone. Whats the fuss.",that is vilation,and using of that wisdom. Althrough i believe that anyone with wisdom will never do that. It cannot be used that way. Thats why discrimination is always needed,and complete honesty and sincerity.
Like freedom from thought must exist. Detachment can also be violated in some way. Coz the thought of detachment,is also a thought. So what is left is only to let it be,and Be Still. Only that. Like Bhagavan,Same said Jesus too.

With love and prayers,

silentgreen

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Re: The nature of Jnana
« Reply #29 on: March 11, 2013, 08:01:10 PM »
Dear All,

Everyone has explained Jnana nicely.
As Sri Subramanian summarized beautifully, Jnana is Peace, Bliss and Love.

Now I would like to put the highest conception of Jnana in my own way.
The Love of Jnani is all-encompassing. The pot of ego having broken, Jnani is boundless and a veritable Sangam of Shiva and Shakti.

His Paramarthika life like Shiva is the Divine Pure Consciousness, and Shakti spreads Her motherly Love through him in his Vyavaharika life. So a Jnani is both like a father and a mother. Twameva Mata ca Pita Twameva.

Being merged in Pure Consciousness, a Jnani is Brahmananda svarupa, Brahmanandam Parama Sukhadam.

The pot of ego having broken, all separations from others have dissolved.
So where is the question of stealing or killing?
There is only a thin layer of individuality kept by God for the good of others.

Jnana is God's Swarupa and Jnani is God' body. So life of a Jnani only does good to others.

The story of robber Jnani which I mentioned in another thread was a contradiction in itself; to illustrate that with many external similarities a person may appear like a Jnani, but unless his ego pot is broken and God spreads His all-encompassing Love through him, a person is not a Jnani.

With this I end my part of the discussion here.
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