Author Topic: Destroying vasanas  (Read 5629 times)

silence

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 55
    • View Profile
Destroying vasanas
« on: January 16, 2013, 10:33:46 PM »
Friends,

It seems to me that vasanas are the real problem. One can know, at least theoretically, that one is pure awareness but vasanas prevent actual realization. The self is always there, never disappears. In spite of that, we don't realize it, so I take it removing vasanas should be our only task (since no effort is necessary to be the self, we already are the self). Am I right about this?

Thanks,
Silence

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43530
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2013, 08:32:06 AM »
Dear silence,

Concentration or meditation on the Self is the only way. Meditation on the Self helps one progress in Self Inquiry and thus vasanas
would be annihilated in due course, after strenuous practice.

Arunachala Siva.

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2013, 10:49:19 AM »
Dear Sri Silence,

Kindly please see my post in My Musings, by following the link below, it may of interest to you -

http://www.arunachala-ramana.org/forum/index.php?topic=7164.msg41644#new

Harih Om

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2013, 10:53:51 AM »
         :) Making the Vasanas non-binding ... thats the right way of putting it.
Vasanas get the power to bind due to ignorance.
ignorance is identification with body, mind, intellect, ego etc. This is ignorance.
I am body
I am mind
I am intellect
I am ego

this is ignorance.

when ignorance is undone... vasanas become non-binding ... they lose their power to bind.
this is liberation.

Dear Sri Udai,

while one is sitting upon fire, will it help to affirm as the fire is non binding, can the affirmations such as I am not body, i am atma, i am not mind I am atma, I am not intellect I am atma, I am not ego I am atma help?

The was as revealed by Bhagavan is to root out the Vasanas by tracing their original source, that is the way.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2013, 11:05:44 AM »
All Vasanas become non-binding when Ignorance is destroyed.
The question as to how ignorance is destroyed is not discussed here.

is there any difference between destroying vasanas and undoing ignorance.

when ignorance is undone

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2013, 11:09:28 AM »
and Udai,

your argument that vasanas are non binding when ignorance is destroyed is not fully correct, for the natural maintainances of body cannot be called or termed as vasanas, irrespective of our efforts the breathing goes on, the heart beat goes on, the hunger calls and all of it goes on, vasanas is quite different, the body takes care of its needs, it is only the additional desires that emanates from oneself is termed as vasanas,

like we discussed yesterday, anger need not trouble you as you say you are awareness, but the anger ending up troubling somebody else, you cannot escape by saying you are awareness, that anger ought to be rooted. We cannot say anger is non-binding here.

There is no anger in a Sage. point blank.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2013, 11:17:53 AM »
Dear Udai,

:)
I am thoroughly open minded, if what is conveyed is truly resonating, i do not have least qualms in accepeting it and surrendering myself to what is truth, as truth is really humbling.

When ignorance goes Vasanas goes along with it or when Vasanas goes, ignorance goes along with it. It is not right to distinguish between the two.

They are both one and the same.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2013, 11:20:48 AM »
Vasana is not just natural maintenance of body...

request to please read what i have conveyed, i have not said in my post natural maintainance of body is vasanas, request to please not to misquote so that the discussion can go on in the right spirit.

and Udai,

your argument that vasanas are non binding when ignorance is destroyed is not fully correct, for the natural maintainances of body cannot be called or termed as vasanas, irrespective of our efforts the breathing goes on, the heart beat goes on, the hunger calls and all of it goes on, vasanas is quite different, the body takes care of its needs, it is only the additional desires that emanates from oneself is termed as vasanas,

like we discussed yesterday, anger need not trouble you as you say you are awareness, but the anger ending up troubling somebody else, you cannot escape by saying you are awareness, that anger ought to be rooted. We cannot say anger is non-binding here.

There is no anger in a Sage. point blank.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2013, 11:24:51 AM »
Each one of us is uniqe ... we had unique experieces and memories... unique in terms of likes and dislikes ... for example you may like a particular temperature. Someoen else dislikes it. Taht is vasana. And diffeernt vasanas. But when one is put in a temperature thats not conducive, that is when we see if it is binding or not. IF it is binding, one feels not just a discomfort but unhappiness and a sense of lacking.
if its non-binding ... the acceptance is complete and one sees the discomfort as discomfort and leaves it there.

I think we can leave out these small vasanas in our discussion, lets focus on the major vasanas, kama krodha lobha madha matsarya.

we need not really spend so much time in discussing what Vasanas truly are, the Sages have revealed them already, they are the following as  -

love (Kama), anger (Krodha), avarice (Lobha), lust (Moha), pride (Madha), unhealthy competition (Matsarya), jealousy (Asooya)

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2013, 11:34:47 AM »
लोकवासनया जन्तोः शास्त्रवासनयापि च ।
देहवासनया ज्ञानं यथावनैव जायते ॥२७१॥


lokavaasanayaa jantoh shaastravaasanayaapi ca
dehavaasanayaa jnyaanam yathaavanaiva jaayate . 271

People cannot attain Realisation because of their desire to run after the world, their thirst for unnecessary study of the scriptures and their anxiety to pamper the body.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2013, 11:38:15 AM »
Big Vasanas small vasana, there is nothing like big or small, for sure,

but the spirit of what was being conveyed is simply that we fail to take notice of the big elephant that be visible to our naked eye, where as we study deeply with a subtle brain and telescopic analyses.

« Last Edit: January 17, 2013, 11:40:40 AM by Nagaraj »
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2013, 11:43:09 AM »
if I understand that Knowledge of Shastras is only a luxury and does not define me ... my knowledge of shastras no more remains a hinderance ... as in the case of shankara who read so many shastras !!
so a vasana to read shastras is it binding it itself ? When I think it "Defines ME" and "Feel Proud" ... thats when it gains power and binds me ! when I know its a luxury ... when I see it as just a tool ... I read and yet remain untouched !! Like Shankara.

these expressions of yours are very vague, abstract, unclear.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2013, 11:46:04 AM »
The beggar feels miserable ... when he knows he is the King who is playing role of a beggar ... situations wont change, but he is all joy. Still he loves a different temprature perhaps ... he has the choice to go into his palace and stay in conducive temperature ... but he does not coz he has chosen to act like the beggar with a purpose ... there is discomfort in the robes he wears ... the dust on his body ... but when he knows he is the King and lives in the beggar robes, its different from when he thinks he is the beggar and lives in the beggar robes!

Vasanas are robes. .. one of the pancha koshas.

ok, how through this example are you trying to say, that one may overcome ones vasanas? can one disrobe ones vasanas as the beggar?

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #13 on: January 17, 2013, 11:49:45 AM »
My main point to your views regarding Vasanas is narrowed down to this -

That just belief and understanding that Vasanas do not bind one is not enough,

It may be true, Vasanas may not really bind one, but the Vasanas have to be overcome.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

ramana_maharshi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3557
    • View Profile
Re: Destroying vasanas
« Reply #14 on: January 17, 2013, 12:29:14 PM »
Quote
Vasanas are preferences ... related to body-mind ... due to your upbringing!
Its ignorance that sets them to fire.


Udai garu,

I agree with your above analysis sir.