Author Topic: To be, or not to be  (Read 2364 times)

Vladimir

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
To be, or not to be
« on: October 17, 2012, 04:49:57 PM »
To be, or not to be, that is NOT the question. The difference between 'to be' and 'not to be' is illusory. Moreover, this difference is the root of Illusion.

Jewell

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6087
  • Love,always love and only love
    • View Profile
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2012, 05:45:53 PM »
Dear Vladimir, I find this very true. It is ego's question in the first place. I feel this what You have wrote correct. But when i want to rationalise that,and think about that,i find my self somehow dumb...

Beloved Abstract

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 228
    • View Profile
    • David Ford Art
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2012, 06:49:58 PM »
to be ( to believe you are the story the mind tells )
or not to be ( to stop believing the story )
pretty simple really   :)
simply stop telling the story of the self and see who you are without it

Vladimir

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2012, 08:51:13 PM »
Dear Vladimir, I find this very true. It is ego's question in the first place. I feel this what You have wrote correct. But when i want to rationalise that,and think about that,i find my self somehow dumb...

Dear Jewell, oh, let the mind to be dumb, no problem. That's good. Let the mind to be confused. Your mind is just a slave, treat it as a slave, not as a ruler  :)

Vladimir

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2012, 08:56:33 PM »
to be ( to believe you are the story the mind tells )
or not to be ( to stop believing the story )
pretty simple really   :)

Dear Beloved Abstract, I did not mean 'to be ( to believe you are the story the mind tells )'. I meant the very desire for beeinness that keeps together atoms and molecules, and makes all living beeings survive.

Beloved Abstract

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 228
    • View Profile
    • David Ford Art
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2012, 09:07:34 PM »
are you sure ?
who is it that has this desire ?   ;)
simply stop telling the story of the self and see who you are without it

Jewell

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6087
  • Love,always love and only love
    • View Profile
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2012, 09:21:05 PM »
Dear Vladimir, I again find what You have wrote very true!:) It is a slave indeed. Thank You Very much for the advice! With love and prayers...

Vladimir

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2012, 11:16:57 PM »
are you sure ?
who is it that has this desire ?   ;)

The Beingness that possesses all five-elemental bodies, eats one another and goes from one into another. And at this particular so called moment of time makes our personalities sure we exist. But when is the start point of this 'i amness'? What made me so sure that 'I' exist? It is definitely not my personal history, it had definitely started long before my first guesses about myself and the world began. And it will not die when my personal histiry ends. Since I know my life is nothing compare to eternity, less than a drop. Actually it's really nothing.
But who witnesses all this? Who is able to witness even that total I Amness? Who is that Absolute Subject that fixes how I Amness started in this particular body?

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2012, 11:32:19 PM »
The Beingness that possesses all five-elemental bodies, eats one another and goes from one into another. And at this particular so called moment of time makes our personalities sure we exist. But when is the start point of this 'i amness'? What made me so sure that 'I' exist? It is definitely not my personal history, it had definitely started long before my first guesses about myself and the world began. And it will not die when my personal histiry ends. Since I know my life is nothing compare to eternity, less than a drop. Actually it's really nothing.
But who witnesses all this? Who is able to witness even that total I Amness? Who is that Absolute Subject that fixes how I Amness started in this particular body?

It is said in the Vedas, that first Self only was, and that Self desired to know itself, it became the 'other'

If a flower wished to enter into itself
In order to enjoy its own fragrance,
It would have to become a bee.

Just as a nose might become a fragrance,
Or ears might give out a melody
For their own enjoyment,
Or the eyes might produce a mirror
In order to see themselves;

Or flowers might take the form of a bee,
A lovely young girl might become a young man,
Or a sleepy man might become
A bed on which to lie;

Just so, the one pure Consciousness becomes
The enjoyer and the object of enjoyment,
The seer and the object of vision,
Without disturbing Its unity.

Even one who has attained wisdom
May appear to become the enjoyer
Of the sense objects before him;
But we do not know
What his enjoyment is like.

A Shevanti flower bursts forth
With a thousand petals;
Yet it does not become anything
But a Shevanti (chrysanthemum) flower.

To the hand, camphor is touch,
To the eye, it’s a white object,
To the nose it is fragrance;
Nonetheless, it is camphor, and nothing but
camphor.

Likewise, the sensible universe
Is only the vibration of the Self.

There is really no action or inaction;
Everything that is happening
Is the sport of the Self.

Brihadaranyaka Upanishad expresses the following:

In the beginning, there was only the Self. ... He reflected, and saw that there was nothing but Himself, whereupon he xclaimed, “I am” (Aham). Ever since, He has been known within as “I.” Even now, when announcing oneself, one says, “I am ...,” and then gives the other name that one bears.

He was afraid. Even today, one who is alone is afraid. But then he realized, “Since there is nothing else but myself, what is there to fear?” It is only from [the presence of] a second [entity] that fear need ever arise. However, he was still unhappy. Even today, one is unhappy when alone. He desired a mate. And so he took on the form of a being the size of a man and woman joined in a close embrace; and then He separated into two individuals: a man and a wife. Therefore, as the sage Yajnavalkya has declared, this body, by itself, is like half of a split pea. [In order to become whole again,] this empty space must be filled by a woman. The male [half] then embraced the female [half], and from that the human race arose.

But the female wondered: “How can he unite with me, whom he has produced from himself? Well then, let me hide!” She became a cow; he became a bull and united with her, and from that cattle arose. She became a mare; he became a stallion. She an ass, he a donkey and united with her; and from that solid-hoofed animals arose. She became a goat, he a buck; she a sheep, he a ram and united with her; and from that goats and sheep arose. In this way, he poured forth all pairing creatures, down to the ants. Then he realized: “All this creation is actually myself; for I have poured forth all this.” One who knows this truth realizes that he, himself, is truly the creator [living] within his own creation.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Vladimir

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 71
    • View Profile
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2012, 12:44:08 AM »
Dear Nagaraj, you quoted beautiful extracts from the Scriptures! Thank you.

Beloved Abstract

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 228
    • View Profile
    • David Ford Art
Re: To be, or not to be
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2012, 02:26:52 AM »
 :)
simply stop telling the story of the self and see who you are without it