Author Topic: my musings  (Read 116818 times)

Jewell

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Re: my musings
« Reply #120 on: September 30, 2012, 11:04:06 PM »
Dear Sri Ravi, You are always Dear Ravi! I dont know what made You sir think that You are the Strange one? It is Your own interpretation,trough Your mind prism. Dear Ravi,i dont agree with You,is not Ravi,You are bad! My thinking of You sir will NEVER change on worse,it is only my thinking of Your THINKING. It is the Huge difference! If i take from You,i mean on learning,advice,it must be legitimite. Your words sir,have much more value then of any other,and more responsability with it. I never had problem with Sri Ravi,but with his views.

Jewell

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Re: my musings
« Reply #121 on: September 30, 2012, 11:13:53 PM »
Dear Ravi, I cannot hate You sir!! Never! I only dont agree. And i believe You,sir look on that like on disrespect. But it is not!! I will always respect You,but i dont have any other way to say that i dont agree. What is left is only not to say anything. But,i believe it is not right. I dont hate anyone here,how could i?! But i dont agree with everyone. I dont think sir that You have any bad intention! But,i just wish that You dont think that i have one. It is Not so!!! Wish You All the Best!

Ravi.N

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Re: my musings
« Reply #122 on: September 30, 2012, 11:27:00 PM »
Jewell,
Ravi is just a name and Ravi ,the person is not of any consequence.Please do not inconvenience yourself thinking that I will take you amiss.I do not take any offence.Criticisms only help us to see for ourselves where we are and if there is substance in it,we correct ourselves;If not we set them aside.
Did you understand what I have said Regarding Compassion?This is all that Matters.If not ,what is the problem with that view.Just what is not acceptable?No authority involved in this.
I have addressed that post to you but the content in that is generic and applicable to all,including what I have said regarding the 'Ripples' :)
This is true of not just the few here but a Great majority of people do not take criticism well.They immediately start reacting.If it is an official or social response,I will avoid pointing this out.We are not here  for a Kitty party!We are here to exchange our appreciation of what we understand as spiritual outlook.We need to have a free and honest and sometimes undiluted exchange.I am blunt sometimes and I know when I am. :)
Namaskar.

Jewell

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Re: my musings
« Reply #123 on: September 30, 2012, 11:42:26 PM »
Dear Sri Ravi, Honest exchange is what i want from the first day. That is not problem. Only sir,You cannot make assumptions about someone,and take that like answer. If You said something right,i would take it. I wont be happy,but i would take it. Sir,You dont know me,and all that,betwean lines,are harsh assumptions. I am not here for party! Thats why,Exsactly,i dont want someone thouch my Ideals! They are taking me trough all journey,and You can say something to me,but should not ask that i accept Yours view. Respect dasnt have anything with that! Because,i didnt came for party!! I Wish You All the Best!
« Last Edit: September 30, 2012, 11:44:40 PM by Jewell »

Hari

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Re: my musings
« Reply #124 on: September 30, 2012, 11:44:25 PM »
Quote
Everything, if it is not genuine ,is of no use.Truthfulness is the Basic Requirement.

Today a friend of mine told me: "I am an egoist and I am not ashamed of that!". He was very truthful. But there are people who (I know such) who always go to churches and give money, give food to the poor sometimes and so on. Are they doing it from pure love? Aren't they doing it because they believe that such actions would bring success to their family, in their job and so on. Isn't that also egoism? So saying "I am egoist" and covering it by statements like "O, I am good person. I love everyone because everyone is God's child" - isn't that the same?

Ans secondly - Who is "better"? These people or a jnani in the cave whose ego is dead and does not do anything? Isn't the mere presence of the jnani in this world more valuable than all "good" egoistic deeds of all the ignorant people? I am just curious of your opinion.

Best wishes, Hari
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Ravi.N

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Re: my musings
« Reply #125 on: September 30, 2012, 11:50:22 PM »
Jewell,
Again!Why are you so defensive as if whatever I have stated have 'Jewell' in mind.Whatever I have stated is true for all of us.Please Focus on 'What' and not on 'who'.
In general I have seen Males focus on 'What' and Females focus on 'Who'.
I have not made any assumptions about you. :)
What is it about compassion that you did not agree with?
Namaskar.

Jewell

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Re: my musings
« Reply #126 on: October 01, 2012, 12:01:16 AM »
Dear Sri Ravi, I am not deffensive for Jewell,but for her Ideals,which are her Guru ideals! Thats why it is sacred! I agree on commpation,but not that it is something which someone can chose. And that is NOT because of my way of living!!! I can do that! But,some other man cant just chose to be good. Your view is right,but not the only one true! I already said everything in my posts. It seems that we just dont understand eachother... I dont know how else to explane what i mean sir. Wish You All the Best!

Ravi.N

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Re: my musings
« Reply #127 on: October 01, 2012, 12:04:22 AM »
Hari,
"Isn't the mere presence of the jnani in this world more valuable than all "good" egoistic deeds of all the ignorant people? I am just curious of your opinion."

Indeed yes.Are we discussing the State of a JnAni or are we discussing the Role of Compassion as an important element in Sadhana?The Truthfulness that I have mentiones is with regard to that.
In the case of your friend as well,Truthfulness will eventually pay.He atleast sees himself for what he is,an Egotist.If at any point in time,he comes to understand the limitations,he is in a much better position to cope up with that than someone who is 'pretending ' that he is not an Egoistic person.
Truthfulness always pays.Moreover Truthfulness is not something that is a matter of convenience.Will your friend be Truthful in the same way if by doing so,he stands to lose a million dollars!This is what Truthfulness is all about.It should permeate the whole of life and not be used for only a part of it.

This is what Sri Ramakrishna says:
"When I renounced everything with an offering of flowers at the Lotus Feet of the Mother,
I said: 'Here, Mother, take Thy holiness, take Thy unholiness. Here, Mother, take Thy
dharma, take Thy adharma. Here, Mother, take Thy sin, take Thy virtue. Here, Mother, take
Thy good, take Thy evil. And give me only pure bhakti.' But I could not say, 'Here, Mother,
take Thy truth, take Thy falsehood.
'

Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: my musings
« Reply #128 on: October 01, 2012, 12:06:08 AM »
Jewell,
"I am not deffensive for Jewell,but for her Ideals,which are her Guru ideals! Thats why it is sacred!"
Friend,Wish you the Very Best.
Namaskar.

Hari

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Re: my musings
« Reply #129 on: October 01, 2012, 12:16:38 AM »
Quote
Indeed yes.Are we discussing the State of a JnAni or are we discussing the Role of Compassion as an important element in Sadhana?

This was not my point but my example is relevant even for that. My friend admitted that he is not compassionate and love himself most. The people who go to churches, give money and food to the poor are also not compassionate but they are trying to be. How could one become compassionate? Can compassion be achieved by self-hypocricy and hypocricy? How to become compassionate? This is more important question than the dry philosophical dialogues about compassion.
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Jewell

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Re: my musings
« Reply #130 on: October 01, 2012, 12:29:23 AM »
Dear Hari, That is something which i try to say from the begining! Only that! Not that i dont want or like commpation,but whether that can be chose or not. Or,say that people should be commpationate,but say how also. And that,for me,that can be possible only trough introspection,and self inquiry. At least,to have some result fast,faster then any other way. I agree with Sanatana Dharma,but not that it is first thing to do,necesary. Everyone will come to commpation trough self inquiry in the end. That is my view. Only,it need to be real,and introspection is one way.

Jewell

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Re: my musings
« Reply #131 on: October 01, 2012, 12:34:07 AM »
I was saying that it is more important reason behind,than deed. I didnt say it wont help,but commpation is not cause to chose path of realisation,but its bio product,effect.

Jewell

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Re: my musings
« Reply #132 on: October 01, 2012, 12:43:12 AM »
Dear Sri Ravi,friend, Thank You! Wish You All the Best from All my Heart!!!

Nagaraj

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Re: my musings
« Reply #133 on: October 01, 2012, 05:32:11 AM »
Friends,

I think, things have gone absolutely out of context. What was being communicated is that as a person evolves further in Self, the more, compassion, friendliness, equanimity, etc.. all these come automatically as a byproduct for the one whose consciousness just grows and grows further, and not just limited to ones own family and friends.

Patanjali says in his Yoga Sutra:

मैत्रीकरुणामुदितोपेक्षाणां सुखदुखःपुन्यविषयाणां भावनापश्चित्तप्रसादनम्
maitrî-karuñâ-muditopekæâñâä sukha-duïkha-puñyâpuñya-viæayâñâä bhâvanâtaå citta-prasâdanam

Consciousness settles as one radiates friendliness, compassion, delight, and equanimity toward all things, whether pleasant or painful, good or bad, as one practices and strives to abide constantly as the knowledge is discerned.

Sri Bhagavan also says:

I have said that equality is the true sign of jnana. The very term equality implies the existence of differences. It is a unity that the jnani perceives in all differences, which I call equality. Equality does not mean ignorance of distinctions. When you have the realisation you can see that these differences are very superficial, that they are not at all substantial or permanent, and what is essential in all these appearances is the one truth, the real. That I call unity. You referred to sound, taste, form, smell, etc. True, the jnani appreciates the distinctions, but he always perceives and experiences the one reality in all of them. That is why he has no preferences. Whether he moves about, or talks, or acts, it is all the one reality in which he acts or moves or talks. He has nothing apart from the one supreme truth. - Sri Ramana Maharshi, from Be as you are

Therefore, Compassion, is not something you can chose, it has to come from within. No compulsions to anybody about doing good to the society, or join or open a missionary and set up an organisation. I don't thing anything has been said anywhere.

Unpleasantness is created when Souls such as Mother Theresa Mahatma Gandhi have taken a beating. But, it is fine. They are such big souls, and they only engulf everybody with their love and compassion and love. No matter how a child is, the Mother still loves it. Was it a question about realisation? no not even that, it was a question of Humanness, primarily. Nobody is bound to force on to themselves, the "Joy of Giving" we just share here, what touches our hearts, and we take it if it touches our hearts or else, there is no compulsion.

Compassion, love is not some object somebody can chose, it is a Gift from God. If we want to say, then it is a product of the Soul, not of Mind and Senses. One True Self only generates Love and Compassion.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

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Bhagavan on Love
« Reply #134 on: October 01, 2012, 07:34:49 AM »
One who renounces desires actually merges in the world and expands his love to the whole universe. Expansion of love and affection would be a far better term for a true devotee of God than renunciation, for one who renounces the immediate ties actually extends the bonds of affection and love to a wider world beyond the borders of caste, creed and race.

A sannyasi who apparently casts away his clothes and leaves his home does not do so out of aversion to his immediate relations but because of the expansion of his love to others around him. When this expansion comes, one does not feel that one is running away from home, instead one drops from it like a ripe fruit from a tree. Till then it would be folly to leave one's home or job.



Question: Swami, it is good to love God, is it not? Then why not follow the path of love?

Sri Ramana Maharshi: Who said you couldn’t follow it? You can do so. But when you talk of love, there is duality, is there not -- the person who loves and the entity called God who is loved? The individual is not separate from God. Hence love means one has love towards one’s own Self.

Questioner: That is why I am asking you whether God could be worshiped through the path of love.

Sri Ramana Maharshi: That is exactly what I have been saying. Love itself is the actual form of God. If by saying, ‘I do not love this, I do not love that’, you reject all things, that which remains is swarupa, that is the real form of the Self. That is pure bliss. Call it pure bliss, God, atma, or what you will. That is devotion, that is realization and that is everything.

If you thus reject everything, what remains is the Self alone. That is real love. One who knows the secret of that love finds the world itself full of universal love.

The experience of not forgetting consciousness, alone, is the state of devotion (bhakti), which is the relationship of unfading real love, because the real knowledge of Self, which shines as the undivided supreme bliss itself, surges up as the nature of love.

Only if one knows the truth of love, which is the real nature of Self, will the strong entangled knot of life be untied. Only if one attains the height of love will liberation be attained. Such is the heart of all religions. The experience of Self is only love, which is seeing only love, hearing only love, feeling only love, tasting only love and smelling only love, which is bliss.



॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta