Author Topic: Rough Notebook-Open Forum  (Read 297949 times)

atmavichar100

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2355 on: January 22, 2018, 10:37:33 AM »
To find God you must know how to love, not God, but the human beings around you, the trees, the flowers, the birds. Then, when you know how to love them, you will really know what it is to love God. Without loving another, without knowing what it means to be completely in communion with one another, you cannot be in communion with truth.~ Jiddu Krishnamurti
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2356 on: January 22, 2018, 07:44:18 PM »
Sadhu Natanananda?s Ferocious Lecture About Self-Enquiry

His face was red with rage. ?What a fool you are!? he told me. ?What do you think you have come to Bhagavan for??

The day he understood his Self Realization, Sadhu Natanananda went incognito. The outward symbol of his becoming Self-realized was his obscurity. He lived alone ? happy to be immersed in the Self all the time.

After Bhagavan?s mahasamadhi in 1950 and until 1967, many did not even know if Natanananda was still alive. Though he stayed in a cottage in Tiruvannamalai, no one knew where he was. Like most of the old devotees, I too thought that he had passed away.

I had spent seven years in the ashram when suddenly one day my friend Dorab Framji asked me, ?Do you know Sadhu Natanananda is alive?? I jumped with joy because I loved his book, Spiritual Instruction, also known as Sri Ramana Darsanam. I paid him a visit. He was an austere man with nothing in his room except for a few loincloths. He blessed me and asked, ?What are you doing? Are you practicing Self-Enquiry??

I replied, ?I am not capable of doing Self-Enquiry. I only chant Arunachala Siva, Arunachala Siva.?

His face was red with rage. I was taken aback because this was my very first meeting with him and I was accustomed to people indulging me whenever they met me.

Not Natanananda! He was a stern and serious man. He raged, ?What a fool you are! What do you think you have come to Bhagavan for? For what function has he chosen you? It is only to make you like him! Read his Forty Verses on Reality, practice Self-Enquiry, BE the truth. That is why you have been chosen!?

I was stunned in disbelief.

- Sri Ganesan in Ramana Periya Puranam
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2357 on: January 23, 2018, 02:35:26 PM »
ANNAMALAI SWAMI ? FINAL TALKS

Thoughts will come as long as the potential for them is inside you. Good thoughts, bad thoughts, they will all keep coming.
There is nothing you can do about this flow, but at the same time, this flow of thoughts need not be a problem.

Be the Self, be the peace that is your real nature, and it will not matter what comes up. Walk, eat, drink, sleep, meditate, but never think that you are the one who is doing these things. The thought that you are doing something is the thought that is poisoning your life.

Because once you think that you are doing something, you will start to think that you need to be doing something else to put yourself in a better situation. You don't have to do anything to experience the nectar of the Self. All you need to do is drop the idea that you are doing anything at all.

p. 95
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2358 on: January 25, 2018, 09:03:53 AM »
ANNAMALAI SWAMI ? FINAL TALKS

During sleep, you have no likes and dislikes. Jnanis and babies manage this while they are awake. Baby mind is good; jnani mind is good; 'I am the body' mind is very, very bad.

Question: It's a poisonous thought!

Annamalai Swami: Yes, yes. The 'I am the body' thought is just as poisonous as a cobra. 'All is my Self.' 'All is the nectar of my own Self.' These are the great affirmations that counter the 'I am the body' thought.

Holding on to one of these sayings is the equal of millions of punyas. If we continuously meditate on the truth of these statements, if we hold on to the truth that they are pointing
towards, countless punyas will accrue to us.

There are many other mantras, but none are as useful as these. Rihhu Gitu says, 'All is one. All is the Self.' This is the truth that you have to hold onto. To the real ?I? nothing is foreign in the entire universe. If you know you are everything, there will be no desire to pursue some things and not others. Do you like or desire your arm more than your foot? When your body is the whole universe, likes, dislikes and desires will be absent.

FT-97
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

Nishta

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2359 on: January 26, 2018, 04:16:52 AM »
Annamalai Swami: Yes, yes. The 'I am the body' thought is just as poisonous as a cobra. 'All is my Self.' 'All is the nectar of my own Self.' These are the great affirmations that counter the 'I am the body' thought.


Maharshi discouraged repeating such sentences. Annamalai Swami encouraged doing so. How to reconcile the difference?
Each will go in the direction they gravitate. 
 
And, I am sure you aware,
I believe Annamalai encouraged such repetition only if you were unable to undertake Vichara.
But for the person who favours Vichara, such repetition goes against the grain, as they are acutely aware that thoughts are a mirage.

atmavichar100

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2360 on: January 30, 2018, 06:43:32 PM »
Meditation

If we do not resolve to attack the deadly enemy in every nook and corner of our daily life, we shall never get rid of this ghost which we have pampered unconsciously for so long. But what is the means?

There is only one way to overcome the ghost .... to watch it.
Do not fight, do not resist. Only try to watch it, quietly but ceaselessly.

In other words, develop an unconcerned witness-consciousness towards men, things and happenings without, but particularly towards yourself within. It means to carry on the calmness of the mind gained in your meditation to cover your whole day. You will distinctly feel it as an undercurrent of peace and detachment.

- Lucy Cornellsen, 'Hunting the 'I'
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2361 on: February 17, 2018, 07:42:05 AM »
HEAVEN IS A WASTE OF TIME

Visitor: It is said in the scriptures that by doing virtuous deeds people are assured of heavenly enjoyments after death.

Bhagavan: Maybe. But are you sure that what all you do are virtuous actions only? Even then after heavenly life, you have to experience the fruits of actions which had not yet fructified. One would have to roll again and again, endlessly, in the cycle of birth.

V: That is why I sought Bhagavan's clarification.

Bh: Our aim should be the attainment of eternal bliss by realizing the truth. How can you aspire for karmic results?

V: Without proper understanding, many people are mad after heavenly enjoyments.

Bh: One might think that heaven is a place of enjoyment. However, things are not very different from this world there. Attachments, prejudices, jealousies etc. are there too. That enjoyment too is perishable for everything is centered on the ego. Because of pleasures, one's mind would not then turn inward in search of truth.

It is such a waste!

After the good karma which gave one the enjoyments of heaven are over one has to return.

What needs to be done is to inquire: 'for whom is this desire for heavenly enjoyment?' Such an inquiry is an absolute necessity.

V: People wrongly superimpose permanence on heavenly enjoyments.

Bh: How can it be? Everlasting bliss can be obtained only by eliminating the cycle of birth and death. Heaven is not the place for the realization of truth.

V: It means that we should not aspire for the fruits of actions but surrender them to God. This also implies we should make an attempt to attain self-knowledge here and now.

Bh: We do not know where heaven is nor as to how it is.
But we aspire for unknown things. In contrast, all the requirements for self-knowledge is ready at hand.
Why bother about unknown things when the wise ones
have shown us the way to attain Self-knowledge here itself?

- N.N.Rajan, More Talks With Ramana Maharshi,
13.4.42 afternoon
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2362 on: February 18, 2018, 08:16:44 PM »
Atmavichar/Friends,

"Annamalai Swami: Yes, yes. The 'I am the body' thought is just as poisonous as a cobra. 'All is my Self.' 'All is the nectar of my own Self.' These are the great affirmations that counter the 'I am the body' thought.
Holding on to one of these sayings is the equal of millions of punyas. If we continuously meditate on the truth of these statements, if we hold on to the truth that they are pointing towards, countless punyas will accrue to us.

One who is clear on  Vichara  will not see any difference between what Bhagavan is pointing out and what Annamalai Swami is pointing out.

What Annamalai swami is pointing out is to give up wrong identification...The Root thought is 'I am the Body' identification...To recognize this and give it up is vichara...The 'I am the Self' is not intended to be repeated mindlessly but as a useful 'Reminder' to counter the 'I am the Body' thought...i.e to stop the identification in its tracks as it were.

This is how Sri Ramakrishna points out the same Truth through the parable of the grass eating tiger:
Parable of the grass-eating tiger
Master:"Before you came here, you didn't know who you were. Now you will know. It is God who, as the guru, makes one know.
"Nangta told the story of the tigress and the herd of goats. Once a tigress attacked a herd of goats. A hunter saw her from a distance and killed her. The tigress was pregnant and gave birth to a cub as she expired. The cub began to grow in the company of the goats. At first it was nursed by the she-goats, and later on, as it grew bigger, it began to eat grass and bleat like the goats. Gradually the cub became a big tiger; but still it ate grass and bleated.
When attacked by other animals, it would run away, like the goats. One day a fierce looking tiger attacked the herd. It was amazed to see a tiger in the herd eating grass and running away with the goats at its approach. It left the goats and caught hold of the grass-eating tiger, which began to bleat and tried to run away. But the fierce tiger dragged it to the water and said: 'Now look at your face in the water. You see, you have the pot-face of a tiger; it is exactly like mine.' Next it pressed a piece of meat into its mouth. At first the grass-eating tiger refused to eat the meat. Then it got the taste of the meat and relished it.
At last the fierce tiger said to the grass-eater: 'What a disgrace! You lived with goats and ate grass like them!' And the other was really ashamed of itself.
"Eating grass is like enjoying 'woman and gold'. To bleat and run away like a goat is to behave like an ordinary man. Going away with the new tiger is like taking shelter with the guru, who awakens one's spiritual consciousness, and recognizing him alone as one's relative. To see one's face rightly is to know one's real Self."

Sri Ramakrishna stood up. There was silence all around, disturbed only the by the gentle rustling of the pine-needles and the murmuring of the Ganges. The Master went to the Panchavati and then to his room, talking all the while with M. The disciple followed him,fascinated.

« Last Edit: February 19, 2018, 07:31:54 AM by Ravi.N »

atmavichar100

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2363 on: February 19, 2018, 09:47:21 PM »
Quote
What Annamalai swami is pointing out is to give up wrong identification...The Root thought is 'I am the Body' identification...To recognize this and give it up is vichara.

Dear Sri Ravi

Thanks for your reply . Today I was going through the "Daily Readings" of Swami Sivananda and today's message was the same as quoted above i.e root cause of all problems is "Identification with the body,mind"
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

srkudai

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #2364 on: February 20, 2018, 11:59:51 AM »
Annamalai Swami ji is pretty clear : stop believing that i am this body or the mind. There is no "I" in the body/mind.
Bhagavan : the body and mind have no person "in" them. Awareness does not either. see where is the "I" .
Sri Ramakrishna: it is like peeling an onion, if you keep on peeling there is no "center". if you search for i there is no i

All of them are saying just the same thing.
Just the same Truth... different styles of expressing.

if instead i say ... ill concentrate, ill please a god or ill stop my thoughts etc ... well ... they would say that i may continue these practices until one day by the grace of God i see what they are saying and drop off. :)

Love!
Silence