Author Topic: Tamil Scriptures  (Read 84584 times)

Nagaraj

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #45 on: December 06, 2012, 07:22:13 PM »
The following 2 verses in Vinayaka Aghaval are very mystical and I doubt whether a normal human mind can understand the deep import of these verses .
Quote
சத்தத்தின் உள்ளே சதாசிவம் காட்டிச்
சித்தத்தின் உள்ளே சிவலிங்கம் காட்டி

Sri Atmavichar,

This may be of help:

tapas

"If one watches whence this notion I springs, the mind is absorbed into that. That is tapas."

When a mantrA is repeated, if attention is directed to the source whence the mantrA sound is produced, the mind is absorbed in that. That is tapas.


(bhagavan to gaNapati muni)

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Subramanian.R

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #46 on: December 07, 2012, 10:16:07 AM »
Dear atmavichar100 and Nagaraj,

Sattham + sound. In Siva Raja Yogam, when the kundalini rises almost to reach the crown, one would hear various sounds,
one being the sound of anklets of Nataraja. Manikkavachagar says one hears the sound conch shell, water falls, bell ringing etc.,.


Sittham = Heart. At that time simultaneously one experiences Siva Lingam in Heart.

Not only sound, one gets the taste of milk, honey, sugarcane juice etc. in the tongue. This is kanumutri ninra karumbulle kaatti...
the ripe sugar cane from which the juice oozes out! 

This is called Sadasiva Yogam.

Arunachala Siva.
 

Nagaraj

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #47 on: December 07, 2012, 10:28:02 AM »
The invocatory verse is as follows:

திகட சக்கரச் செம்முக மைந்துளான்
சகட சக்கரத் தாமரை நாயகன்
அகட சக்கர வின்மணி யாவுறை
விகட சக்கரன் மெய்ப்பதம் போற்றுவாம்.

Here, thikadachakkara should be split as thigazh + thasakkara. This means Vinayaka has got ten hands.  dasam means ten.

With his five faces (chemmukam einthulAn) he has got ten hands.  The other lines are easy to understand. He has got a
chakrayudham. He is is seated in lotus. akatachakkara = agazh + chakkra = broad Space where all  stars. suns, galaxies are
contained. He is spread everywhere there.  Vikata chakkaran  + with that chakram, he makes all sports. Let us pray to his
PAdam which is padam = seat of liberation.

Now the controversy is how thikadachakkara could mean thigazh + dasa + kara. The audience said even Tolkappiyam,
Nannool etc., do not mention it. sandhi ilakkanam - it is called - where words can be combined only in a particular fashion.

Muruga came to the Sabha and showed a book of grammar called Veera Sozhiyam, which was not known to many.
There it is mentioned that zh+dha = ta. Hence thigazh + dasa means thikatach!  The audience then got satisfied.
 
Muruga who had come as a poet disappeared!               

Dear Sir, what a beautiful expression, this is the ultimate description of that supreme. In the Ganapati Atharvaasheersha (Veda mantra) we find similar expressions.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

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உயிர்மெய் வருக்கம்
« Reply #48 on: December 07, 2012, 10:32:57 AM »
கண்டொன்று சொல்லேல்
Say not something other than what you see. (Don't bear false witness.

ஙப் போல் வளை.
Bend like ங. [i do not know how to convey this in English - Nagaraj]

சனி நீராடு.
Bathe daily. (Take an oil-bath every Saturday.)

ஞயம்பட உரை.
Talk pleasantly.

இடம்பட வீடு எடேல்.
Do not build a spacious house.

இணக்கம் அறிந்து இணங்கு.
Make friendship after knowing compatibility.

தந்தை தாய்ப் பேண்.
Protect your father and mother.

நன்றி மறவேல்.
Forget not gratitude.

பருவத்தே பயிர் செய்.
Do farming according to seasons.

மண் பறித்து உண்ணேல்.
Do not eat from land-grab.

இயல்பு அலாதன செய்யேல்.
Do not go against nature.

அரவம் ஆட்டேல்.
Do not pick and shake the snakes.

இலவம் பஞ்சில் துயில்.
Sleep on cotton bed.

வஞ்சகம் பேசேல்.
Talk not deceit.

அழகு அலாதன செய்யேல்.
Do not do  the inelegant.

இளமையில் கல்.
Learn while young.

அரனை மறவேல்.
Forget not the God

அறனை மறவேல்.
Forget not righteousness.

அனந்தல் ஆடேல்.
Avoid excessive sleep.


(avvaiyAr)

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Subramanian.R

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #49 on: December 07, 2012, 11:05:20 AM »
Dear Nagaraj,

Nice. Only two observations. Sani neeraadu means take bath in cold water. sani = cold; cool. Not Saturday.
Aranai maravel - aran here is Haran, i.,e Siva and merely God.

Thanks.

Arunachala siva. 

Nagaraj

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #50 on: December 07, 2012, 11:08:22 AM »
Thanks for the corrections Sir, it makes so much more sense.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Ravi.N

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #51 on: December 07, 2012, 11:19:10 AM »
nagaraj/friends,
I had posted a talk on pillaiyar and pattiyar by kanchi mahaperiyava;therein he mentions the benefit of chanting vinayakar agaval on fridays!You may look up the post in the vinayaka chaturthi thread started by prashant in this very section.
Namaskar.

Nagaraj

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #52 on: December 07, 2012, 11:27:32 AM »
thanks for reminder Sri Ravi, i would have passed over it, i had wanted to read it at leisure. I have known some, whose lives changed for the better by their sincere and devout chanting of Vinayakar agaval. This Agaval has some charm in it.

॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

atmavichar100

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #53 on: December 07, 2012, 12:51:12 PM »
Dear atmavichar100 and Nagaraj,

Sattham + sound. In Siva Raja Yogam, when the kundalini rises almost to reach the crown, one would hear various sounds,
one being the sound of anklets of Nataraja. Manikkavachagar says one hears the sound conch shell, water falls, bell ringing etc.,.


Sittham = Heart. At that time simultaneously one experiences Siva Lingam in Heart.

Not only sound, one gets the taste of milk, honey, sugarcane juice etc. in the tongue. This is kanumutri ninra karumbulle kaatti...
the ripe sugar cane from which the juice oozes out! 

This is called Sadasiva Yogam.

Arunachala Siva.
 

Thanks Subramaniam Sir

There is a book called "Siddhargal Illakiyam" by Mi.Pa.Somu and that has lot of explanation for Vinayakar Aghaval and I will have to go through it again . It is a long time I read it  regularly and I once wrote it daily mainly times as a Sadhana . Good to be back to Vinayakar Aghaval but the thing is Vinaygar Aghaval is Yoga Sastra and while it has its own merits I feel it conflicts with Bhagwan Ramana's Vichara Marga where things like Kundalini , Chakras etc are not given importance .
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #54 on: December 07, 2012, 12:55:00 PM »
Quote
அரவம் ஆட்டேல்.
Do not pick and shake the snakes.

Can someone explain this ? First of all one needs Guts to even touch a snake ,leave alone picking it up and shaking it .


However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

Ravi.N

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #55 on: December 07, 2012, 12:58:10 PM »
Atmavichar/Friends,

"Everybody belongs to Pillaiyar and Pillaiyar belongs to everyone. He is related to the poor and downtrodden too. Even unread people and poor urchins have a direct access to this 'common man's God'. The 'sidaru thengai' are meant for poor children mainly. They have a right over the pieces of coconut so distributed in His presence. As an infant-God, He is very popular with children. He is also very close to woman folk, as He is very dear to the Mother's instinct in every woman. As Avvai Paatti is a woman, they have a direct special right on this sloka. So, it is in the rightness of things that, woman and children, should all learn this 'Vinayagar Agaval'. You need not worry if the meaning is somewhat difficult and the pronounciation in places is slightly tough. Avvaiyar's words have the power to directly appeal to the inner self. By the time it becomes committed to memory, the import will be known to your heart! That will benefit the family, community, country and the world at large!
Say there is a beautiful box containing gems but whose key has been misplaced. Will we forsake the box for this reason? 'Let the key be found in its time'. In the meanwhile, we will keep the box very safe, 'is it not so? As otherwise, even if the key is found later, there will be no gain! Vinayagar Agawal, is such a box of Yoga Sastra gems. It does not matter if we presently do not have the necessary understanding and grasp. We will keep chanting it. Slowly the inner meanings will reveal itself. Pillaiyar will grant us the 'key' of understanding."

Kanchi mahaswami on vinayakar agaval

atmavichar100

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #56 on: December 07, 2012, 01:25:25 PM »
Atmavichar/Friends,

"Everybody belongs to Pillaiyar and Pillaiyar belongs to everyone. He is related to the poor and downtrodden too. Even unread people and poor urchins have a direct access to this 'common man's God'. The 'sidaru thengai' are meant for poor children mainly. They have a right over the pieces of coconut so distributed in His presence. As an infant-God, He is very popular with children. He is also very close to woman folk, as He is very dear to the Mother's instinct in every woman. As Avvai Paatti is a woman, they have a direct special right on this sloka. So, it is in the rightness of things that, woman and children, should all learn this 'Vinayagar Agaval'. You need not worry if the meaning is somewhat difficult and the pronounciation in places is slightly tough. Avvaiyar's words have the power to directly appeal to the inner self. By the time it becomes committed to memory, the import will be known to your heart! That will benefit the family, community, country and the world at large!
Say there is a beautiful box containing gems but whose key has been misplaced. Will we forsake the box for this reason? 'Let the key be found in its time'. In the meanwhile, we will keep the box very safe, 'is it not so? As otherwise, even if the key is found later, there will be no gain! Vinayagar Agawal, is such a box of Yoga Sastra gems. It does not matter if we presently do not have the necessary understanding and grasp. We will keep chanting it. Slowly the inner meanings will reveal itself. Pillaiyar will grant us the 'key' of understanding."

Kanchi mahaswami on vinayakar agaval

Ravi

Thanks for Kanchi Mahaswami's words on Vinayakar Aghaval .I have read it before and feel good to reread it again .
There was a time I was worried that I did not understand the meaning of some Tamil Works like Thiruvachagam , Thevaram ,Aghaval , Siddhar Padalgal etc and whatever meaning I read from available sources were not quite convincing or appealing to me , added to it was my lack of proper knowledge of classical Tamil . Then an elderly  relative of mine who actually belongs to a Mystical Cult but they follow the Siddha Lineage and they strictly follow the Tamil works and he said that one can never understand these verses from books and one needs the Guidance of a relaized master for the same .He will never give meaning for the verses but will throw some questions to me  as a "zen koan" and ask me to dwell on it . His basic thing is you need to make yourself "eligible" for receiving the meaning and the problem is that everyone expects things to be handed over on the plate like ordering food in the hotel  :)
For eg : The 2 verses of Vinaygar Aghaval I remember he gave me many years back and asked me to contemplate on the same and still now I have not got the final meaning  :)
சத்தத்தின் உள்ளே சதாசிவம் காட்டிச்
சித்தத்தின் உள்ளே சிவலிங்கம் காட்டி

But he told me that the first step to make yourself eligible to get the meaning of any holy  text is to daily chant it or write it daily and  and have it stored in your memory and sow the seeds there and keep it nourishing daily and later it will grow and give you the fruits at the right time .
He was echoing the same as what Kanchi Paramacharya did only that he was quite blunt with regard to not giving the meaning .
I am right now doing the same for Bhagwan's Tamil works as well as other classical works in Tamil/Sanskrit .
Om Peace .
« Last Edit: December 07, 2012, 01:36:58 PM by atmavichar100 »
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

atmavichar100

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #57 on: December 07, 2012, 01:41:17 PM »
 The following verse from திருவாசகம்- சிவபுராணம்
Quote
ஆராத இன்பம் அருளும் மலை போற்றி
is familiar to many people but most of the translations I have seen have given just literal meanings to this verse but not the real inner meaning for the same .
Can someone guess what its inner meaning is ? I will share the same once I get some response from others  :)
However many holy words you read, however many you speak, what good will they do you if you do not act on upon them? - Buddha

Jewell

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #58 on: December 07, 2012, 02:04:25 PM »
Quote
அரவம் ஆட்டேல்.
Do not pick and shake the snakes.

Can someone explain this ? First of all one needs Guts to even touch a snake ,leave alone picking it up and shaking it .
Dear atmavichar100, How i understood,the meaning is,dont ask for truble when there is none. Dont invente truble,or situation when there is no need. Snakes are familiar with defensive behaviour,and bite only when atacked. Thats the way i see it.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2012, 04:06:21 PM by Jewell »

Subramanian.R

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Re: Tamil Scriptures
« Reply #59 on: December 07, 2012, 03:18:46 PM »
Dear atma vichar 100,

Araadha inbam arulum malai potri - means the malai = Arunachala, which gives limitless bliss to one who contemplate on It.

Swami Dandapani Desikar (of Dharmapuram Adeena,) who has written a 3000 pages commentary on Tiruvachakam, says
here, that the malai here should be construed as Waterfalls (Ekadesa Uruvaha Ani - it is called) and one should interpret
the line as 'the waterfalls that showers limitless bliss'.

Arunachala Siva.