Author Topic: Making a Difference  (Read 10864 times)

ramana_maharshi

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #30 on: April 25, 2012, 12:17:14 PM »
well said subramanian garu.

Bhagavan Ramana said, whenever social reformers and political reformers came to Him:  First reform yourself.

RaviJi,

Below are Swami Vivekananda's views about charity

Quote
THE PRACTICE OF RELIGION (Delivered at Alameda, California, on April 18, 1900)
Volume 4, Lectures and Discourses

Charity is great, but the moment you say it is all, you run the risk of running into materialism. It is not religion. It is no better than atheism - a little less. ... You Christians, have you found nothing else in the Bible than working for fellow creatures, building . . . hospitals ? . . . Here stands a shopkeeper and says how Jesus would have kept the shop! Jesus would neither have kept a saloon, nor a shop, nor have edited a newspaper.

Street-cleaning, hospital-building, and all that? Good works, when you do them with a pure mind.

Practical religion is identifying myself with my Self.

We may convert every house in the country into a charity asylum, we may fill the land with hospitals, but the misery of man will still continue to exist until man's character changes.


So pure mind without having ego and not looking for pride,fame is required for good works.

Raviji and nagaraj garu If love,compassion and care towards other humans is the best path then mother theresa  has shown more love and social service than bhagavan?

Subramanian.R

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #31 on: April 25, 2012, 01:28:21 PM »

No two great persons can be compared. Sri Bhagavan's life and teachings were towards Jnana. He did not decry social service
or philanthropy.  In Jnana marga, these are all not essential, and this was He meant. Again take Bhakta Vijayam saints. They used
cymbals and sang various songs aloud on Panduranga. Sri Bhagavan said that chanting god's glory is also fine but silence is the
most potent weapon to attain godhead.

So is the case with Mother Teresa. It was destined for her to do service to leprosy affected people in Kolkata. Not that she was
not praying to Jesus or meditating. She did all those things but her prime duty was service to the sick.

I think, one cannot and should not compare and contrast great persons.   
   

sanjaya_ganesh

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #32 on: April 25, 2012, 03:33:37 PM »
BHagavad Gita Chapter 2 Verse 57 in response to Arjuna's question on Who is a Sthithaprajna.

Quote
yah sarvatranabhisnehas tat tat prapya subhasubham
nabhinandati na dvesti tasya prajna pratisthita

He who is everywhere without attachment, who neither rejoices nor despises on meeting with anything - good or bad, his wisdom is established.
Salutations to Bhagawan

Ravi.N

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #33 on: April 25, 2012, 03:44:55 PM »
Friends,
I will again point to Nagaraj's original post to have the context in sharp focus.In the absence of a context we will only be contesting on the basis of what we have in our mind and not what is posted.Where did anyone talk about charity?This is another subject-Charity is lauded in sanatana dharma as well.There is always a right way of doing these things and a wrong way.We cannot outright dismiss charity.I will post from the talks of the sage of Kanchi on this.Dismissing charity because it may engender pride is like throwing the baby with the bath water.Nothing can be more regrettable than this.
Here is a quotation from Swami Vivekananda:
“Do not stand on a high pedestal and take 5 cents in your hand and say, "here, my poor man", but be grateful that the poor man is there, so by making a gift to him you are able to help yourself.It is not the reciever that is blessed, but it is the giver.Be thankful that you are allowed to exercise your power of benevolence and mercy in the world, and thus become pure and perfect.”

Namaskar.

sanjaya_ganesh

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #34 on: April 25, 2012, 03:53:51 PM »
:) At least to me the SUBJECT "Making a Difference" trapped. We have an organization of same name here and they call themselves in short MAD :)
Salutations to Bhagawan

Nagaraj

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #35 on: April 25, 2012, 05:55:16 PM »
Uyir Ezhuthu   ஆத்திசூடி   English translation

அ   அறம் செய விரும்பு       Desire the righteous deeds
ஆ   ஆறுவது சினம்             Anger is to be controlled
இ   இயல்வது கரவேல்        Help others in ways you can
ஈ   ஈவது விலக்கேல்           Never refrain from charity (Always be charitable)
உ   உடையது விளம்பேல்    Do not boast about what you have
ஊ   ஊக்கமது கைவிடேல்   Do not give up hope/effort
எ   எண் எழுத்து இகழேல்     Respect learning
ஏ   ஏற்பது இகழ்ச்சி              Accepting alms (begging) is despicable
ஐ   ஐயமிட்டு உண்              Before you eat, share your food with the needy
ஒ   ஒப்புர வொழுகு             Act virtuously
ஓ   ஓதுவது ஒழியேல்         Do not give up learning
ஒள   ஒளவியம் பேசேல்     Do not talk bad about others
ஃ   அஃகஞ் சுருக்கேல்          Never cheat on grains (Food)


(Avvaiyar)

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Ravi.N

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #36 on: April 25, 2012, 10:10:09 PM »
Nagaraj,
No one is born who is wiser than Grandma avvai.Her AthichchooDi is taught to pre-school children.(I hope it continues;not sure!).
Tamizh is such a glorious language and is rich in culture and wisdom-with works like TirukkuraL,nAladiyar,pura nAnooru,aga nAnooru,tirumanthiram,nalAyira divya prabhandam,tevAram,tiruvAchakam,tiru arutpA,etc,etc...the list is truly endless.
There are two words closely related one is ஐயமி(aiyyam) and the other one is 'pitchai'(Bhiksha)-Bhiksha(accepting alms) is considered a Blame.

Now what avvai is recommending is not 'pitchai'-Giving alms when another person begs for it.She is recommending 'aiYYam'-means that which is given without the other person asking!This is the true spirit of 'Giving' and the very essence of sanatana Dharma.

In TiruppAvai the Great Saint AndAl recommends both-'ayyamum,pitchaiyum' in verse 2.
vaiyaththu vaazhveergaaL naamum nampaavaikku(ch)
cheyyum kirisaigaL kELeerO paaRkadaluL
paiya(th) thuyinRa paramanadi paadi
neyyuNNOm paaluNNOm naatkaalE neeraadi
maiyittu ezhudhOm malarittu naam mudiyOm
seyyaadhana seyyOm theekkuRaLai(ch) chenROdhOm
aiyamum pichchaiyum aandhanaiyum kai kaatti
uyyumaaReNNi ugandhElOr empaavaay.

Translation:
O ye people all
Living in the world
Hearken to the code we've set
for our penance chosen:
singing the praise of the feet of the absolute,who is in gentle slumber
in the ocean of milk.

We shall forswear ghee and milk:
taking our bath in the pre-dawn time,
we shall not apply collyrium to our eyes
nor plait our tresses
with flowers of any kind.

We shall not do what should not be done
and we shall not voice around malefic complaints;
charity we shall extend
even when it is unsought,
apart from Giving away
to those who seek aid;
and this our hand shall do
to the extent of resource
.

Thus are we Gladdened
to have ascertained
the way to liberation.


In the above verse 2 ,AnDaL lays down the basis and foundation for what is called 'nOnbu' in tamizh and 'vrata' in sanskrit.It is only when a seeker follows these disciplines with Diligence that he can aspire to tread the spiritual path.This is the very heart of sanatana dharma .all religions emphasize this .
Namaskar.



Ravi.N

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #37 on: April 25, 2012, 10:17:59 PM »
Friends,
The King Krishna deva RAyA was a great devotee of Saint AndAl-he wrote Amukta malyada ,the life of AndAl who was so dear to the Lord,that it is said that the Lord accepted and wore only the Garland that was worn first by AndAL.The story of AndAL is truly inspirational and there is hardly any composition that can match the beauty of TiruppAvai.TiruppAvai is not just a Hymn of praise but also a perfect prescription as a Sadhana-wonderfully laid out in 30 verses of dazzling poetry in sangath tamizh!
Namaskar.

Subramanian.R

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #38 on: April 26, 2012, 02:22:23 PM »
Dear Ravi,

The post about AndAl makes me write a few things connected with AndAl and TiruppAvai:

1. It was Kanchi Maha Periyava who wanted to popularize both TiruppAvai and TiruvembAvai, with young boys and girls
(school going children) and he issued free booklets of these two books and made every family to encourage their children
sing these songs especially in Dhanur month. (Margazhi). He did this with another purpose of Saiva and Vaishnava unity.

2. AndAl uses two words, 'ukkam' 'thattoLi' in Verse 2. Even many Tamizh teachers of today may not know the meanings
for these words. ukkam actually means hand fan.  thattoLi means mirror. thattu + oLi, a plate with light. In those days,
there were no chromium plated mirrors as we use today. So they instead used highly polished bronze or brass or silver
plates which will reflect the objects  placed before.

3. Again in Verse 19, AndAl says Nappinnai kongai mel, vaithu kidantha malar mArba!  Kannan is sleeping with his chest
on the breasts of Nappinnai.  Hence Nappinnai cannot be AndAl. AndAl  must be a different devotee who also merged with
Ranganatha in Sri Rangam.  But she is not among the ashta patnis, eight wives of Krishna.

4. In both Tiruppavai and TiruvembAvai, there are each one verse, which should be chanted everyday, not merely in Margazhi
month. In TiruppAvai it is Verse 29, ChiRRam siRu kAle vandhunnai sevithun..... In TiruvembAvai, it is Verse 10, PathAlam Ezhinum
keezh soR kazhivu pAda malar.....  These are called Nityanusandhana verses, i..e to be chanted daily.

Arunachala Siva.
           

Nagaraj

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #39 on: April 27, 2012, 08:47:11 AM »
Dear i,

thank you for elaborating the subtle essence of ஐயமி (aiyyam) and Bhiksha. If anybody is able to practice just any one of these Athichudi, as Tapas, that itself is enough to bestow deliverance. Aandal stories is one of the most inspiring ones. Especially, it shows that spirituality does not just revolve with the men alone.

Over the last few days, i have been on the move, had to attend a wedding, and i happened to meet one elderly gentleman in the wedding, who was talking about the Sampradayas of wedding, etc... and somehow, the topic deviated and landed on to Kanchi Mahaswami, where he mentioned, that, in one of the camps, somewhere, in the late evenings, the attendants came and stood before the Mahaswami with heads down and with a very low voice reported to him that the entire ration has been done with and that there is no rice or vegetables at all. They were worried at the increasing crowd and being unable to feed the people who were coming there. Kanchi Mahaswami, who heard this, immediately, dismissed them off saying something like "Poda poda, ellam avan paathuppaan". Carelessly, he dismissed them off and their worries.

Everybody knows well, how strict Mahaswami is with regard to taking donations etc... and he laid out strong instructions to the math people not to ask anybody for anything. People were worried, nautrally.

Within about the next few hours, many bags of rice and vegetables arrived there, everybody were wonder struck!

this exactly was an illustration of the essence you have conveyed in
Quote
aiYYam'-means that which is given without the other person asking!This is the true spirit of 'Giving' and the very essence of sanatana Dharma.

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

ksksat27

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #40 on: April 27, 2012, 10:07:11 AM »
Friends,
What is wrong about  feeling happy in seeing that the needs of other beings are met?He who finds happiness in other's happiness is doing genuine Sadhana even if he is not conscious of doing Sadhana!Where did 'Charity' come in?Why are we equating happiness and satisfaction  with Pride?Why shy away from 'Doing Good' out of a  False Fear of courting Pride?Are we better off by avoiding these things(seems to be a convenient option!)?
Why do we do Self enquiry?What is the need?
Happiness is the very reason why we do sadhana.This is what sri Bhagavan clearly says in his very opening Paragraph of 'naan yaar'(Who am I)that all beings are after 'Sukam' only.

Namaskar.

The problem is with the moods of the sadhakas Ravi.   Myself,  Subramanian sir, few others are fed up with the world as a whole and doing this good and that good.    It is not because of fear of pride,  but a distaste comes in automatically ,  giving the vague empty feeling that everything is maya.

So we tend to focus on sadhana,  bhakthi or jnana alone and not of any karma yoga simply because,  we are not the right candidate to do nishkamya karma.

May be we have burnt our finger enough number of ways.

People may call it spiritual re-creation or shutting of the world connnections,  but that is what we want all the time.

This mind is a mysterious mad object one can live with all the time.   I am realising how painful to keep an enemy of mind with me and how tough it is to live the life.

sanjaya_ganesh

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #41 on: April 27, 2012, 10:36:40 AM »
Dear Krishna

In my opinion, Vairagya and sadness are different. I am not sure which one you are referring to. If it is former it is great - but that does not make you sad.

May be I am too naive - not as well read as many. If everything around you including the mind which is thinking as you say - are the Supreme Brahman itself. If there is no place for anything to stand other than the Supreme one. If everything you think, in fact happens only inside that Supreme One (as there is no second one) - then why not happily follow the way that Supreme one takes you. As Acharya Swamigal's Nirvana Shatkam says "Na Punyam Na Papam Na Soukhyam Na Dukham Na Mantro Na Tirtham Na Veda Na Yajna. Aham Bhojanam Naiva Bhojyam Na Bhokta Chidananda Roopa Sivoham Sivoham". But never read this line with your mind / ego (Warning!) :)

Is not sadness and feeling fed up the circus of ego? What Karma is right? Who is enemy? Who is friend? All are interpretations of mind alone. I am trying hard to see the Supreme Brahman in "Fancy Dress competition" everywhere. And Practicing to see that way everything gives you infinite bliss.

My personal life is hell for last 4 years (which I dont want to elaborate here :)) and still I find infinite peace inside when you see everything in this light of drama where every character, every dress and every stage and everything is He alone. 

My humble submission if it helps

Peace
Sanjay
Salutations to Bhagawan

Nagaraj

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #42 on: April 27, 2012, 11:25:19 AM »
The problem is with the moods of the sadhakas - are fed up with the world as a whole and doing this good and that good.    It is not because of fear of pride,  but a distaste comes in automatically ,  giving the vague empty feeling that everything is maya.

So we tend to focus on sadhana,  bhakthi or jnana alone and not of any karma yoga simply because,  we are not the right candidate to do nishkamya karma.

May be we have burnt our finger enough number of ways.

People may call it spiritual re-creation or shutting of the world connnections,  but that is what we want all the time.

This mind is a mysterious mad object one can live with all the time.   I am realising how painful to keep an enemy of mind with me and how tough it is to live the life.

Dear i,

This is so with everybody, one has to look beyond the good and the bad and remain in Dharma. In Navamani Malai -

அண்ணா மலையாய் அடியெனை
ஆன்ட அன்றெ ஆவி உடல்
கொண்டாய் எனக்குஓர் குரைஉண்டொ
குறையும் குணமும் நியல்லால்
எண்ணம் எதுவொ அதுசெய்வாய்
கண்ணெ உன்தன் கழலிணையில்
காதல் பெrறுக்கெ தறுவாயெ
That moment when as Annamalai you called me and made
me your own, you took sole charge of my spirit and my
body. What more do I want? Merit or defect I know none
apart from you. My very life you are. Do with me what you
will. Only, only give me ever increasing love for Your twin
Feet.

The way is to transcend our disgust feelings by love. We all can easily love our loved ones, it is easy to love good things, but what is great about it? it is just like giving alms to a very rich man. Really loving the needy, the ones who are really disgusting, who are really the odd persons out, they are the ones whom we need to transcend their hate by our love (infact they are verily ourselves). How is this possible, when we really look from the other persons shoes, why one is like that, then we will be fully filled with Karuna-Bhava, we will understand why a person is bad, why the world is bad, the world needs Hitham, compassion.  We ought to love even the bad, just for ourselves ultimately.

Why everybody felt bliss before Gurus such as Shirdi Sai Baba, Ramakrishnar, Ramanar? because they were absolutely unconditional, they looked upon everybody as the same. Bhagavan looked at Perumal Swamy, Ganapati Muni, Muruganar as the same. Is it not the same pain and disgust feeling that we experience, es experienced by others also?

The solution for disgust cannot be disgust, if we also get disgusted, then there is no end to these :) is it not so? But, in a group of people, where all of them is vexed up, disgusted, throwing words, out of insecurity, if we are able to transcend them all by love, how nice would it be? All that people expect is love.

First and foremost, is to drop our judgmental attitude. We are vexed with our country, we blame the politicians, we blame the government, we get angry at the cops and govt. officials taking bribe, etc... the problem is that we become judgmental, and naturally hate creeps within, causing vexation, disgusting.

How can we ourselves transcend this, without making a difference not for anybody else, but just for oneself, yourself, ourselves. Try to transcend the anger feelings by love, we need to transced our vexed feelings in to divinity. When whole world is throwing acid, how nice it would be if we threw flowers? Forget the happiness you would be bringing to others, would it not bring happiness to you, more than anybody else?

One of the descriptions of Sri Rama is MruduBhashine namaha - soft spoken,

All the descriptions of Ambaal - Mathru Rupinya, etc... one should inculcate, and not just leave it all for just praising the God. All the great attributes of God, one has to inculcate, that is the real spirit behind chanting the Ashtottaras.

We have seen in the Puranas, for instance, when Vishmamitra sent forth many weapons and arrows at Vasishta, all these weapons turned into flowers, the real essence is that Vasishta was indifferent to the insults thrown at him by Vishwamitra.

We have to cultivate being indifferent to good and bad

I am reminded about Sir Rajagopalachari, who composed the famous song "Kurai ondrum illai marai murthy Kanna". Sri. Rajagopalachari was in distress due to some personal family problems, he came to Tirupathy to blurt all his pains and problems to the Lord and when he stood there, miraculously his glance turned towards the entry door (perhaps this was the leela of Venkateshwara, that he look at the door) He saw an outcaste, who stood outside at considerable distance and praying with great devotion to Perumaal(Temple entry was still practiced then). Tears rolled over Sri Rajagopalachari's eyes and he was so embarrassed about himself, and he composed this song looking at that outcaste and as though that outcaste is singing this great song, who cannot even look at the Lord inside - -

குறை ஒன்றும் இல்லை மறை மூர்த்தி கண்ணா
குறை ஒன்றும் இல்லை கண்ணா
குறை ஒன்றும் இல்லை கோவிந்தா

kurai ondrum illai marai moorthy kanna
kurai ondrum illai kannaa
kurai ondrum illai GOvinda

கண்ணுக்கு தெரியாமல் நிற்கின்றாய் கண்ணா
கண்ணுக்கு தெரியாமல் நின்றாலும் எனக்கு
குறை ஒன்றும் இல்லை மறை மூர்த்தி கண்ணா

Kannukku Theriyaamal nirkinraay kannaa
kannukku Theriyaamal ninraalum enakku
kurai onrum illai marai Moorththy kanna

There is no grievance - Lord of Wisdom
There is no grievance - krishna
There is no grievance - govinda

You are omnipresent - kanna
Even though you are not visible for my naked eyes
There is no grievance - Lord of Wisdom

வேண்டியதை தந்திட வெங்கடேசன் நின்றிருக்க
வேண்டியது வேறில்லை மறை மூர்த்தி கண்ணா
மணிவண்ணா மலையப்பா கோவிந்தா கோவிந்தா

Vendiyathai thannthida Venkatesan endru irukka
Vendiyathu Verillai marai Moorthi kannaa
Manivannaa malaiappaa Govinda Govinda

When Lord Venkatesa is always there to give what I want
I dont need anything else lord of seven hills

திரையின் பின் நிற்கின்றாய் கண்ணா
உன்னை மறை ஓதும் ஞானியர் மட்டுமே காண்பார்
என்றாலும் குறை ஒன்றும் எனக்கில்லை கண்ணா

Thiraiyin pin nirkinraay kannaa - (2)
Unnai marai Odhum Nyaaniyar mattume kaanpaar (2)
endraalum kurai onrum enakkillai kannaa

Krishna, you are standing behind the veiled curtains
You can be seen only by vedic scholars
still, There is no grievance dear krishna

குன்றின் மேல் கல்லாகி நிற்கின்ற வரதா
குறை ஒன்றும் இல்லை மறை மூர்த்தி கண்ணா
மணிவண்ணா மலையப்பா கோவிந்தா கோவிந்தா

Kundrin Mel kallaagi nirkindra varathaa
kurai onrum illai marai Moorthy kannaa (2)
Manivannaa Malaiappaa Govinda Govinda

You are posing like a idol over a hill
There is no grievance dear krishna
Father to these hills

கல்லினார்க்கு இறங்கி கல்லிலே இறங்கி
நிலையாக கோவிலில் நிற்கின்றாய் கேசவா
குறை ஒன்றும் இல்லை மறை மூர்த்தி கண்ணா

Kalinnaar-kiranngi kallile irangi
Nilayaaga Kovilil nirkindraai Kesavaa (2)
kurai onrum illai marai Moorththy kanna

In this Kalyug, you have come
and entered and staying in the santum of tirumala
Though i dont see you,
There is no grievance dear krishna

யாதும் மறுக்காத மலையப்பா உன் மார்பில்
ஏதும் தர நிற்கும் கருணை கடல் அன்னை
என்றும் இருந்திட ஏது குறை எனக்கு
குறை ஒன்றும் இல்லை மறை மூர்த்தி கண்ணா
மணிவண்ணா மலையப்பா கோவிந்தா கோவிந்தா

Yaathum marukkaatha malaiyappaa - un maarbil
Ethum thara nirkum karunai kadal annai
endrum irunthida Ethu kurai enakku (2)
ondrum kurai illai marai Moorthi kannaa (2)
Manivannaa malaiappaa Govinda Govinda

You dont refuse sincere prayers lord of hills
When Mahalakshmi is there with you
living in your chest
There is no grievance dear krishna
I have no complaints whatsoever Govinda

Salutations to Bhagavan
« Last Edit: April 27, 2012, 11:33:59 AM by Nagaraj »
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Subramanian.R

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #43 on: April 27, 2012, 11:56:39 AM »
Dear Nagaraj,

It is easy to love the  good things but to love the bad ones too is difficult. - Nice words.

Once a rishi was observing a scorpion struggling in the stream of  water. He picked it up to save it. As soon as it was brought out,
the scorpion stung the rishi and when rishi was in pain, the scorpion fell into water. The rishi again took it out and left it on the
bank. The scorpion stung the rishi again. Again it jumped into water. Thus it happened many times. An onlooker who observed this
said: Swami, why do you take it out again and again in spite of that creature stinging you again and again? The Rishi replied:
Yes. It is my dharma to save it from drowning. It is scorpion's dharma to sting when touched. Each one, according to one's own
dharma!"

Arunachala Siva.           

Nagaraj

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Re: Making a Difference
« Reply #44 on: April 27, 2012, 11:59:37 AM »
Dear i,

what a story to sum it up? very happy to hear this story now, at this very moment. What a beautiful message in it!

Thank you

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta