Author Topic: Rough Notebook-Open Forum  (Read 315050 times)

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #390 on: November 05, 2012, 08:30:12 PM »
Jewell,
Yes,Bhakti does call for a Great purity of Heart to reach the required intensity.Here is an excerpt from The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna:

"Nishtha leads to bhakti; bhakti, when mature, becomes bhava; bhava, when concentrated,
becomes mahabhava; and last of all is prema. Prema is like a cord: by prema God is bound
to the devotee; He can no longer run away. An ordinary man can at best achieve bhava.
None but an Isvarakoti attains mahabhava and prema. Chaitanyadeva attained them".
[hr
The Higher rungs of Bhakti are not at all easily accessible to the vast majority of aspirants.
Namaskar.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2012, 08:42:11 PM by Ravi.N »

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #391 on: November 05, 2012, 09:11:05 PM »


Friends,
Here is a wonderful photograph of Sri Ramakrishna in samadhi in Keshab Chandra sen's House.He is gently supported from behind by his nephew Hriday.

The State of Ecstatic samadhi is quite a rare thing and is beyond the bounds for most teachers who teach jnAna;Some of them explain  this away as a 'mental state'!This is understandable as they hardly know anything about it,still less attain to such Heights of parabhakti.

Namaskar.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2012, 09:13:41 PM by Ravi.N »

Jewell

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #392 on: November 05, 2012, 10:01:36 PM »
Dear Sri Ravi, How Beautiful picture!!! I never saw it. Thank You Very much! With love and prayers,

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #393 on: November 06, 2012, 06:26:43 AM »
Jewell,
Yes,the Master is extremely charming and quite a beautiful person.There is this interesting article that swami vidyatmananda compiled on the photographs of the Master.Here is an excerpt:
A devoted lady of the Bhowanipore section of Calcutta,who was the wife of achal Kumar Maitra,a solicitor,and an initiated disciple of Swami Brahmananda(Rakhal maharaj,the spiritual son of Sri Ramakrishna),occasionally used to come to visit Maharaj at Balaram Bose's house.From there she would usually go to the Holy Mother's house at Udbodhan office.Swami Saradananda(Direct disciple of sri Ramakrishna ,who wrote his biography-Sri Ramakrishna Leela Prasanga),who lived at the udbodhan office had a great affection for the devoted lady.In due course,the woman conceived the idea of having a marble statue of Sri Ramakrishna made for herself;she sought the advice of swami saradananda about the matter.At that time a well known Maharashtrian sculptor was working in the Jhautala section of Calcutta.The woman went to the studio of this sculptor and placed an order for the statue,asking him to make the statue as prompt as possible.
After that the Lady went occasionally to the Udbodhan office to report on the progress of the statue.
When the clay model was ready,she went to the Udbodhan office and requested swami Saradananda to go to the studio and approve the model.
Shortly after this conversation,Swami Saradananda one morning appeared at Balaram Bose's house to tell Maharaj(Swami Brahmananda)the whole story of the statue.He appealed to Maharaj to go to the studio and approve the model.
On hearing about the statue from Saradananda,Maharaj kept silent for a while and then asked:"Sarat(former name of Saradananda),which figure of the Master should I approve?Even on the same day I saw the Master in many forms.Sometimes one would find him lean and emaciated,sitting silently in a corner.Again,after sometime one would notice him singing Kirtans,all the time clapping his hands,totally forgetful of his body and dress.Sometimes he would be lost in deep samadhi;then there would be a wonderful expression in his face,which beamed with celestial Bliss,while his body radiated a divine Light.At times,he would be found to possess a stature much taller and stronger than the usual one and to move from one end of the southern portico to the other with big,long steps."
Swami Saradananda humbly replied:"Maharaj,I mean that particular figure of the Master which he himself said would be worshipped in every house;you are to approve the model of that form."
Maharaj with a smiling face replied:"All Right,I shall go."
That very afternoon arrangements were made for Maharaj to go to the studio.Swami saradananda,Swami Shivananda(another direct disciple of Sri ramakrishna)and many other sadhus accompanied him.Golap-ma and Yogin-ma(Direct women disciples of Sri Ramakrishna)also went.
Maharaj scrutinized the model minutely.Then he pointed out to the sculptor,"You see,you have the Master bending forward a bit."
"Yes" Replied the Sculptor,"You see Sir,if anyone sits in that posture,with his hands clasped in front of his legs,he is bound to have to bend forward a little."
Maharaj Replied:"We never saw the Master sitting like that.What you say is applicable to ordinary individuals,but was not true in the case of the Master.He had very long arms(It is said that Lord Sri Rama also had very long arms-Ravi).His hands reached to his knees."
Further Maharaj pointed out to the sculptor something about the Master's ears."You see ,generally the ears of people begin above the eyebrows and you have modelled the ears of the Master in the same way.But the Master's ears began from below the line of his eyes."
The people present were extremely interested to hear these detailed facts about Sri Ramakrishna's appearance.The Sculptor agreed to correct the model according to Maharaj's instructions.He said,"Please come after a week and I will have completed the model by that time."
After one week Maharaj and his party went to the studio again.Looking at the model,Maharaj expressed deep satisfaction with the remark:"Now it is quite exact."
The Model was so vivid that everybody who accompanied maharaj on that day felt the Living presence of the Master in the Model.

You may read the complete article here:
http://www.ramakrishna.org/catalog/photohistory/SriRamakrishna_1.htm

Even persons who have moved with the Master may not be able to notice the minutest details of the Master;it is only the few like Swami Brahmananda who can bring out such aspects!How much more so when it comes to the Teachings!
P.S:Udai,This post had to be keyed in;no copy paste here! I tought it will interest some to know how the Master looked like physically.
Namaskar.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 06:37:28 AM by Ravi.N »

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #394 on: November 06, 2012, 08:51:27 AM »
udai,
So far I have seen only 'I'(Ego,a Big one!)and no sign of Truth. :)
I have pointed out on earlier occasions as well;but you seem to take it as if I am making a 'Personal' Reference to you.Let me make it clear;I have no means of Knowing you as a person.Whatever I am saying is based on what is 'Projected' here!
The 'I' always imposes its point of view,and never is bothered about understanding the standpoints of 'Others' which it assumes as inferior to its own.It is only concerned about making statements to impress,not to see whether it is relevant to others.I am referring to your response to 'Swayam' in another thread-that included a list of names(Excluding Udai,who obviously do not belong to that impressive List!)and your subsequent justification of that Statement!Did you ponder to see whether it answered Swayam's question.I think not;You are carrying on your monologue here ;you are free to do that.Just wish to sound you that this 'BIG I' is not Self. :)

Namaskar

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #395 on: November 06, 2012, 09:02:17 AM »
udai,
"When I say Everyone stands free... its not big I, its Very BiG I "

Yes,indeed;I am questioning the 'I' that says this;may be very small 'I' that one need not bother about,especially the rest of us. :)

Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #396 on: November 06, 2012, 09:20:34 AM »
udai,
Let us understand what is meant by 'Bound'.What does this mean?
Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #397 on: November 06, 2012, 09:59:15 AM »
udai,
My definition is quite simple;All that I am bothered is that as long as you are required to take care of the Body,you are bound.I am least bothered whether your vedanta accepts it or not and whether you 'Identify' with your body or not.
Now tell me,whether you are bound or not. :)
Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #398 on: November 06, 2012, 10:34:00 AM »
Udai,
Forget Sri Bhagavan.With all the 'Ifs and Buts' it becomes conditional! :)
Where is the question of freedom?

This is what Sri Ramakrishna says:
"It is possible for me togive up the body in samadhi; but I have a slight desire to enjoy the love of God and the company of His devotees. Therefore I pay a little attention to my body".

Elsewhere also he says:""I have gone on suffering so much for fear of making you all weep. But if you all say: 'Oh, there is so much suffering! Let the body die', then I may give up the body."

This is Freedom,that one may decide to 'Drop' the Body at will.

Are we free like  this?Otherwise Freedom is  'imagination' only. :)

This is quite as simple as this.I know most 'jnAnis' will not pass this test. :)

Namaskar.

ramana_maharshi

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #399 on: November 06, 2012, 02:02:21 PM »
Quote
Even better: A person who does not see taking care of the body as bondage ... nor does he see that falling apart of the body as bondage is a free person.
A person who is free from these notions of bondage is free!

Dear udai,

Perfect quote regarding the advaita attitude and i agree with you.

advaita attitude does not mean we should not take care of the body.. remember even bhagavan ramana took care of his body though he did not take ownership of the same.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #400 on: November 06, 2012, 02:25:38 PM »
prashant/Friends,
Here is an excerpt from The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna:

Paths of knowledge and devotion

A NEIGHBOUR: "Revered sir, what are the doctrines of Vedanta?"

MASTER: "The Vedantist says, 'I am He.' Brahman is real and the world illusory. Even the
'I' is illusory. Only the Supreme Brahman exists.

"But the 'I' cannot be got rid of. Therefore it is good to have the feeling, 'I am the servant of
God, His son, His devotee.'

"For the Kaliyuga the path of bhakti is especially good. One can realize God through bhakti
too. As long as one is conscious of the body, one is also conscious of objects. Form, taste,
smell, sound, and touch-these are the objects. It is extremely difficult to get rid of the
consciousness of objects. And one cannot realize 'I am He' as long as one is aware of
objects
.

"The sannyasi is very little conscious of worldly objects. But the householder is always
engrossed in them. Therefore it is good for him to feel, 'I am the servant of God.'"

To say 'I am not identifying myself with the Body' is just another idea and this does not take one anywhere.The acid test is whether one is conscious of the Body;If so whether he is free to shed it at will?Both Sri Bhagavan and sri Ramakrishna had spent atleast 6 months without being conscious of the Body(and hence the world of objects).The Unreality that they talk of is something that they have actually experienced;not a concept understood by a mind through ratiocination.
This is Freedom.In their case,it is the Divine Providence which took care of the Body;there was no sankalpa-'I should take care of the Body'.Most of the time they never knew whether the Body was there or not,and hence the way they dressed-more for others than for themselves.

I am not suggesting that we should ignore the Body.I am just saying that as long as we have to care for the Body ,we are within the jurisdiction of Shakti and cannot boast of our freedom.We are puppets only.
Namaskar.

ramana_maharshi

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #401 on: November 06, 2012, 02:51:23 PM »
oh yes ravi garu agreed.

Even ramana guru said the same thing that there will be no end if one starts to take care of his body so preceisly..

But minimal care is surely required and even both the sages u mentioned and many others like swami sivananda,swami prahupada etc have done the same..

they all ate food on daily basis but to the minimum extent which is necessary to maintain the body and dont have desires to eat "A" particular type of food and on huge quantities...

that is the catch we need to take over from their lives..

but nothing wrong in following our own tradition we r raised.. like jesus followed his tradition and ate non-veg and drank wine, sri ramakrishna ate fish and smoked etc..

though i argued earlier but i think even i agree now that it is very hard to come out of the traditions we are raised and no sage is exception..

Subramanian.R

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #402 on: November 06, 2012, 03:14:22 PM »
Dear Tusnim,

Sri Bhagavan said: Bhadha vasana is one which shall create bondage and would cause rebirths. Bhoga vasana is one which
does not create bondage, and which is destined. For example Sri Bhagavan used to like chilli powder and til oil for idli.
He insisted on this for many years. So also when Malayalam type kanji and aviyal (a mixture of vegetables with curd and
heated in coconut oil was served one day, for a change He asked for a second helping and enjoyed the kanji + aviyal.
These are bhoga vasanas. Detailed description is there in Talks in many of His conversations, eg/. Talks Nos: 344, 349, 390, 394,
398, 401 etc.,

I do not know the occasions when Kanchi Mahaswami had spoken on this topic.

Arunachala Siva.   

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #403 on: November 06, 2012, 03:25:54 PM »
udai/Friends,
I am not going to throw cold water on someone's aspirations and ideas of Freedom. :)
I just indicated what Sri Ramakrishna has said.
Sri Bhagavan's complete talks can be downloaded from the asramam website.I hope it is available for download.

Kanchi MahaswAmi's talks are wonderfully translated by Sri KTSV Sarma and posted here:
http://advaitham.blogspot.in/

Kanchi Mahaswami's select articles on advaita sadhana are available for downloading as a pdf:
http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/downloads/sadhana.pdf

His wonderful commentary on soundarya lahari is available as a pdf here:
http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/downloads/sadhana.pdf

Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #404 on: November 06, 2012, 03:36:19 PM »
udai/Friends,
Please download kanchi mahaswami's discourses on soundarya lahari here:
http://www.advaitin.net/Articles/Soundaryalahari1.pdf
Namaskar.