Author Topic: Rough Notebook-Open Forum  (Read 357399 times)

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #240 on: September 27, 2012, 02:40:12 PM »
Tushnim,

Quote
"Happiness is when mind is free from compulsions of desires and urges: yes. I presume when desires are fulfilled, mind is free from the urge of the desire"

This is not correct.We have already seen how when the peace experienced in sleep manifests as happiness in the waking state,without the need to achieve anything.

Do you mean to say that Happiness can be experienced only if desires are fulfilled and something achieved?
There may follow a fear that whatever desire has been fulfilled may have to be consolidated and should not be lost.Fulfillment of desires does not guarantee happiness.

 
Quote
"How does buddhi recognize this state of happiness ? : not sure if buddhi recognizes it! Buddhi is the interpreter. isnt it ?"

Happiness is one's own nature and no 'interpretation' is called for.The Buddhi knows this directly.
 
Buddhi is the Determining Faculty,and decides based on the inputs that the manas operating through the senses presents.

Please do not bring in ' baggage ' from what you have read in books!Just understand directly what we are discussing.

Namaskar.



Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #241 on: September 27, 2012, 03:09:35 PM »
Tushnim,
I have clearly pointed out what Happiness is.
Please do not bother to 'define';Let us understand directly without definitions.Please go through what we have discussed.
What is your doubt now?
Namaskar

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #242 on: September 27, 2012, 04:38:32 PM »
Tushnim,
"sir the question is:how is desire fulfillment giving happiness now ?"

Why discuss about something that does not serve our purpose?I am not saying that we should not discuss it at all.It demands time and does not yield anything.

Are we not now interested in how to secure this Happiness?That is fruitful.

We already know the way.It just means that the mind that was travelling the way of desire for objects needs to be trained to travel in the opposite direction.

Is this clear?

Namaskar.

Subramanian.R

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #243 on: September 27, 2012, 06:25:02 PM »
Dear Tushnim,

Any desire (apart from natural desires like hunger, thirst etc.,) will only grow on fulfillment. Sri Bhagvan says it is like
trying to quench the fire with petrol.,

The only way to conquer desires is dispassion. It is Vairagya. And discrimination, vivekam,).   

It is like stopping smoking. Suppose you smoke 10 cigarettes per day. You can not stop it by 9.8.7 etc., If you stop it
in one go. No cigarettes from tomorrow. That is the only way to stop it. One can never quit smoking otherwise.

Arunachala Siva, 

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #244 on: September 27, 2012, 09:41:16 PM »
Tushnim,
Sorry.I could not continue the discussion for want of time.I will certainly come back at the earliest.
Thanks very much.
Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #245 on: September 28, 2012, 12:26:11 AM »
Tushnim,
We have understood now that happiness is when the mind is freed from compulsions by way of Desire,cares and worries.This has to be done through disciplining it and weaning it from its wanton ways.The Very fact that we have understood what we are after,this in itself will give us a certain purpose and Determination to secure it.This will check the mind when it tries to run along the usual way of pleasure seeking.

The mind cannot be all on a sudden made to quit its wanton ways;trying that will only make the mind resist the change all the more and what is worse,go back to its ways with a vengeance.This is true with powerful urges like the sexual urge for instance.For most people(sadhakas)it is advisable to marry and experience this in a disciplined way.What do we mean by 'Disciplined'?To experience this in a deep way,by going through this experience with awareness;just flowing with it as slowly as possible and not get swept away.Instead of operating at an instinct level,one switches over to the feeling level-a very refined one,quite subtle.Instead of viewing the spouse as an object of desire,to treat him or her as a 'being'.

The refined feeling is one where there is a sense of Responsibility and genuine consideration towards the spouse.This may take some time to master,but it can certainly be done.

I have discussed just one aspect of 'Disciplining' the mind.The Key point is that one should learn to live more deeply at a feeling level than at the instinct Level.As this refinement is pursued more and more,it will become easier to check the mind and bring it back to the Stable,so to say.

Checking the mind from its wanton course is what is called vairagya.This is something that grows with repeated Practice.This may be called the 'No' or Negative Practise.
There needs to be a Parallel 'Yes' or  Positive Practise as well.This is the Desire to get back to the State of happiness.If we recall,Happiness itself is a state free from Desire,but to get there one does need to have Aspiration.

This is where Spiritual Practice Begins.We will proceed after I hear from you.

I would say that in general every seeker needs a Guru and Guidance to traverse this path,and at the same time use all the intelligence that he can muster.
Earnestness,Patience and Perseverance,are strong aids.

Namaskar.




Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #246 on: October 01, 2012, 02:19:28 PM »
Tushnim,
Thanks very much,Friend for your immediate cooperation.
I have not continued our discussions further.You have asked-" Please continue on how we can find that happiness"
If we have recognized what Happiness is and found its source already ,why are we asking this question? :)
Namaskar.

Subramanian.R

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #247 on: October 01, 2012, 02:39:12 PM »
Dear Tushnim,

Just because you are presently unhappy, you want to know  how to find that happiness that is fruitful.
Now analyze, what are the reasons of your unhappiness? Is it health, wealth, lack of direction in life.
Find out and try to solve them.

Arunachala Siva.

Subramanian.R

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #248 on: October 01, 2012, 02:47:17 PM »
Dear Tushnim,

Grin and bear with it not constantly thinking about it. If you ignore it, it will not bother you. I am having knee pain
since 10 years. I have stopped bothering about it. Nor do I want a knee replacement surgery.

Arunachala Siva. 

Subramanian.R

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #249 on: October 01, 2012, 02:53:27 PM »
Dear Tushnim,

How does a cashier handle currency notes for giving to and taking from others? Does he ever think that the cash belongs to
him?  Like that you function in the world, ignoring various thoughts (excepting those related to work).

Arunachala Siva. 

Subramanian.R

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #250 on: October 01, 2012, 03:00:01 PM »
Dear Tushnim,

You won't fall back if you continue to live like that. Leave the doership and
enjoyership.


Arunachala Siva.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #251 on: October 01, 2012, 03:15:48 PM »
Tushnim,
It is indeed true that The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna is available online.Posting it here does two things.It makes me read what is there for one more time.It also may be useful to someone stumbling on it in this site when he or she visits this site.There will be greater chance of someone who does not know these wonderful teachings to be introduced to them when they chance to see it here.
As for my Manana,it is simply in this,that I use them to view anything posed as a question,and find that the Master has already answered in his inimitable way in The Gospel;that too so simply and with an emphasis on the Practical aspects.
Till date,I have not come across anything that has not been covered here as far as spiritual sadhana is concerned.

As to how I experience Sri Ramakrishna,I am reminded of Swami Vivekananda's words:
" Truly, I tell you, I have understood him very little. He appears to me to have been so great that, whenever I have to speak anything of him, I am afraid lest I ignore or explain away the truth, lest my little power does not suffice, lest in trying to extol him I present his picture by painting him according to my lights and belittle him thereby"
If swamiji says this, what to speak of a nonentity like me.
I feel like the Way 'M' the recorder of the Gospel said(you may go through this open thread to find it):
"‘I am an insignificant person.  But I live by the side of an ocean and I keep with me a few pitchers of sea water.  When a visitor comes, I entertain him with that.  What else can I speak of but his words."

You may find a nice article about 'M'(Mahendranath Gupta or Master Mahasaya)here:
http://www.kathamrita.org/mbionit.html

The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna is an accurate record of what Sri Ramakrishna has said.Ofcourse what is not recorded or caught in words may exceed this;yet what is recorded is more than enough for me.If i am satisfied with this pitcher ,why should I bother about what is there in that Ocean.Let me first drink whatever is here and assimilate that.

You may find an interesting article on how the Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna came to be written in this Rough note book thread.You may find other articles on Sri Ramakrishna as well.
For your kind information,I did not start the thread on The gospel of Sri Ramakrishna.That was started by another member who no longer visits this site.He calls himself silentgreen.

Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #252 on: October 01, 2012, 04:00:12 PM »
Tushnim,
"Did you visit the Dakshineswar temple and walk at the same place where sri ramakrishan walked? touch the same stones that Sri Ramakrishna touched ?"
This is a question that I always love to answer.I am copying what I wrote here in this thread as well as  in another Blog.
Yes,I have been to Kamarpukur,Birth place of Sri Ramakrishna and jayarambAti,birth place of our Holy Mother Sri Saradamani Devi.It was in 1979 when I was in calcutta on official work for a duration of 3 Months.On weekends I will be mostly in Dakshineswar and thAkur's small room used to be my favourite haunt after paying obeisance to Divine Mother KAli.An absolutely charming Place,although crowded and the path leading to the temple is as dusty and dirty and crowded as well.Yet who cares about all that -to sit in the place haloed by the feet of the Great Master is a Great boon.It was during that time I decided to visit Kamarpukur and Jayarambati.I boarded a Rickety bus that took me to kamarpukur -what a privilege to see the Master's birthplace and his parental house!After spending 2 hours in that place I proceeded to Jayarambati reaching there around 18:30 hrs when the evening Arati(vespers)was going on.(In this place,and it is the only one in which the Arati is performed not for Sri Ramakrishna but to The Holy Mother.)I just sat in front of the Mother's temple after the vespers were over and decided to spend the night there.Jayarambati and kamarpukur are small villages with mud houses.
The Swamiji who was in charge of the Ramakrishna Mutt noticed my sitting there and asked me about my whereabouts.I simply told him that I have come to visist Holy Mother's birthplace and do not mind spending the Night in the temple.I told him that I would return the next day.The Swamiji was all kindness and took me inside the ashram opposite the Shrine and gave me a room and I took it as Holy Mother's blessing .The swamiji gave me some fruits and sweets and that was my dinner.In the Morning ,after a bath I asked to be shown Holy Mother's hut made of clay and Haystack!What a magical place and what a joy to visit the Birthplace of our Simple and Beloved Holy Mother!One of her Great grand nephew was there and how lovingly he touched my chin and kissed.This is how Our Holy Mother would greet her children.What a simple setting and how blessed is that place!I Returned to calcutta after this wonderful trip.
Yes I have visisted Belur Math and Dakshineswar .As you say,the very remembrance is purifying and in itself is sadhana.My earliest recollection of Thakur goes back to 1960 when I was a boy of 5 and my father was posted in Calcutta and had taken me to Dakshineswar and Belur Mutt.We were in calcutta for 2 years then.I remember how I called him as Ramakrishna paramahimsa and this became a joke:-)

I like your poem  and share the sentiments.
Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #253 on: October 01, 2012, 05:40:21 PM »
Tushnim,
Yes,He is ever with us.Nice to read your experience at Dakshineswar.
Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« Reply #254 on: October 01, 2012, 05:45:56 PM »
Tushnim,
Yes and No!Like the Gopis who knew that Lord Krishna is the supreme paramatman,yet he was there krishna Kaniah!
The Infinite is inexhaustible.
Namaskar.