Author Topic: Complete surrender  (Read 2363 times)

Hari

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Complete surrender
« on: November 03, 2011, 08:59:41 PM »
Please, explain me what is complete surrender. I have read we to not have any desires of our own. Does it mean to not have any desires? How could that happen? If one is hungry how can he/she eats without any desire? If one needs to have sex or have sex how can do it without desire? This is not clear to me and I would be happy if you help me. :) Thanks.
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Nagaraj

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Re: Complete surrender
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2011, 10:30:58 AM »
Not considering oneself the doer is complete surrender together with not seeking answers and accepting things as they are!
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Subramanian.R

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Re: Complete surrender
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2011, 12:53:09 PM »


Dear ramana,

Complete surrender is that when one submits ego totally to the Guru or God.  Thereafter, there is no doership or enjoyership
for him.  This does not mean simple things like eating food, bathing, talking spiritual things etc., also should not be there.
These minimum desires can be there and even that one should have with a feeling towards God or Guru, 'it is your wish and
so it is my wish.'   



Arunachala Siva.

Hari

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Re: Complete surrender
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2011, 06:54:57 PM »
Quote
Thereafter, there is no doership or enjoyership for him.

How can you not enjoy taste of the food, the beautiful smell of the flowers, the view of the magnificent mountains and forrests, the splendid Holies Scriptures, the beautiful sleep, the orgasmic statisfaction during sex, even the love to your wife or husband? How do you do that?
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Nagaraj

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Re: Complete surrender
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2011, 07:17:36 PM »
Dear ramana,

at all times, all enjoyments and experiences are only of the Self. It is only a mistake on our part to think that those experiences, enjoyments, pleasures are derived from that source, which is really not true! It is verily the experience of the Self. When you taste the food, the enjoyment truly is of the Self not the food, when you smell the flower, it is truly the joy of Self, and so on...

Why do you not want to enjoy the experience of self? Self Surrender is not some inert stone 'state'

Nothing changes, everything remains as is. Why imagine Surrender as something? which is really non existent.

A "Self Surrendered State" is really a myth. That state is not different from what you current are! We just need to shut the power to the mind. The Senses operate as it is, just don't become the Sense, don't take the senses as your identity!

Which is why, there is a tricky notion of surrendering and i made some humble musings here

http://www.arunachala-ramana.org/forum/index.php?topic=6583.msg22912#msg22912 (reply No. 24)

Infact After Surrender, the joy of having food is greater, the joy of the smell of a flower is greater, and so on...

We kiss a baby, not because it gives joy to the baby, but because, it gives JOY TO US. It is the experience of Self.

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Subramanian.R

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Re: Complete surrender
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2011, 07:29:05 PM »


Dear ramana,

One can enjoy the fragrance of the flowers, elegance of pictures, greatness of holy books etc., in a pure ego less state where
the Pure Mind alone is there. Pure Mind = the Self. In the state of freedom, a Jnani sees everything as the Self and loves everything.
Why not he love a flower for its fragrance, love a picture for its elegance, love a book for its holy contents?

Talks No. 204:

We say that the Self realized sage knows by his mind, but his mind is pure mind. Again we say that the vibrating mind
is impure and placid mind is pure. The Pure Mind is itself Brahman. Therefore it follows that Brahman is not other than
the mind of the sage.,



Arunachala Siva.   

Nagaraj

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Re: Complete surrender
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2011, 07:58:41 PM »
Before discernment, a person looks at the reflection of the cool moon in still pond, and out of the joy of the moon, he jumps into the water and goes looking for it, but never finds it, but then a Sage comes are tells him the truth, he no longer admires the reflection but verily the moon itself! Then he no longer had to jump into the water to seek the joy of the moon.

Kabir says 'Kasturi kundal base, mrig dhoondhe van mahi' - the kasturi is a (fragrance) is in naval of a particular specie of deer, but the deer having its fragrance runs in search of that in whole of forest), to whom it concerns?

In the same way, we imagine that the food, women, wine brings us pleasure, whereas, the joy derived through these are really of the Self. When a person truly discerns this, he no longer requires them for pleasure :)

Just so, the one pure Consciousness becomes
The enjoyer and the object of enjoyment,
The seer and the object of vision,
Without disturbing Its unity

Sweeter even than the bliss of liberation
Is the enjoyment of sense objects
To one who has attained wisdom.
In the house of bhakti (devotional love),
That lover and his God
Experience their sweet union.

 - Jnaneshwar

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta