Author Topic: Various quotes and musings in the light of Vedanta  (Read 173986 times)

cefnbrithdir

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #90 on: April 05, 2012, 03:33:11 PM »
Gospel of John (Jn) 8.57  " You are not yet fifty years old and you have seen Abraham !" 8.58 "Jesus said to them "Truly I say to you before Abraham was born, I am"

Just after this is the wonderful Chapter 9. This is ostensibly about Jesus healing a blind man, but under the surface there are deeper resonating meanings.

First Jesus is asked why the man was born blind. His reply is not that he has sinned or his parents but that the works of God may be displayed in him.

Jesus sends him off to a Pool in Jerusalem to wash - which might have been quite some way for a man who was blind.

When he comes back seeing, there is almost a pantomine discussion between people as to whether this is the same man they had seen previously as a beggar. Some say yes some say no. This all leads to him replying  (in exactly the same Greek words as Jesus just before in Chapter Eight)  "I am ".

There is then a long discussion between  him and the religious authorities as to how he can now see and whether Jesus who has done this is himself a sinner or not because this healing happened on the Sabbath which broke the religious laws.  The religious authorities disbelieve him and send for his parents who say that he is of age he can speak for himself !

The man who is now full of confidence says "You don't know where he (Jesus) comes from yet he opened my eyes.... Not since time began (or could be translated "out of the eternal")  has it been heard that anyone opened the eyes of a man born blind".

This  resonates back to the original "fall of Adam" in the Garden of Eden.

This has been traditionally interpreted as Adam's disobedience in eating, with his wife, the apple of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, which of all the food in the Garden, God had told him not to eat.

But in Advatic terms  the problem lay in Adam and Eve considering themselves separate from God before they ate anything. How else could the serpent have persuaded them that somehow God was withholding something from them and that they would become God if they ate from this Tree ? The irony is huge because Good and Evil only exist  as "realities" in a state separate from God.

But to return to the poetry of the story... when  they ate the apple "their eyes were opened they knew they were naked". That is they had a Body Consciousness. They were ashamed and  covered themselves with fig leaves and hid themselves from God.

Later God came looking for them  "Where art thou ?". Adam says "I was afraid because I was naked and I hid myself". God says "Who told you that you were naked ....."

Now to return to John Chapter 9.

Jesus' opening of the blind man eyes is the undoing of  Adam's problems  in Genesis.

See also  the Gospel of Thomas Logion 37  "His disciples said; On what day wilt thou be revealed to us and on what day shall we see thee ? Jesus said : When you unclothe yourselves and are not ashamed and take your garments and lay them beneath your feet like little children and tread upon them and then shall  ye see the Son of the living One, and ye shall not fear".

In John Chapter 1 (after the prologue) there is a  progression of titles for Jesus.

The progression starts with the disciples referring to him as Master/Rabbi/Teacher  then moves on to Christ/Messiah/Anointed One.  But the progression  ends with Jesus referring to himself as the Son of Man. The chapter concludes  with Jesus saying  "I tell you the truth, you shall see heaven open and the angels of God ascending and descending on the Son of Man".

This clearly refers to the story - again in Genesis - of Jacob's Ladder. Jacob dreams of a ladder set up on earth and reaching to heaven and the angels of God ascending and descending on it. God stood above it and said " I am the God of Abraham ....and  in they seed shall all  the families of the earth be blessed".

When Jacob woke up, he said "Surely the Lord is in this place and I knew it not. How awesome is this place. This is none other than the house of God and this is the gate of heaven".

So Jesus as Son of Man is  the passageway from earth to heaven and for a new realisation of the earth.

See also in Luke 17.21 Jesus says  "the Kingdom of God will not come with observation (of external things) nor will they say "Look here it is" or "There it is "  (advaita !) for the Kingdom of God is within you". 
Gospel of Thomas Logion 3  "But the Kingdom is within you and it is outside of you. When you know yourselves then shall you be known and you shall know that you are the sons of the living Father. But if you do not know yourselves, then you are in poverty and you are that poverty". 
And later Logion 113 " His disciples said to him: On what day will the kingdom come ? Jesus said; "It cometh not with observation. They will not say Lo here ! or Lo there! But the kingdom of the Father is spread out upon the earth and men do not see it ".

But again to return to John Chapter 9.

The same progression of titles is here as in Chapter 1. First Rabbi,  then (only as an aside)  Christ,  and finally on the momentous occasion when the  man (the second "I am") meets again and sees for the first time Jesus.

Jesus says to him   "Do you believe in the Son of Man ? "  The man says " I believe Lord " and he worshipped him.

The Greek verb used  here  - proskunew - is terribly strong in John. It is only  used for worship of God. So this is the first and only time in the Gospel that Jesus is worshipped.  And by a devotee who prostrates himself before the person who has made him one with himself.

Gospel of Thomas Logion 106  " Jesus said:  When you make the two one, you shall become Sons (plural) of Man (singular) and when you say: Mountain be moved, it shall be moved".

Amen.






« Last Edit: April 05, 2012, 03:45:24 PM by cefnbrithdir »

Hari

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #91 on: April 13, 2012, 10:16:05 PM »
Quote
1. And he said, "Whoever discovers the interpretation of these sayings will not taste death."

2. Jesus said, "Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find. When they find, they will be disturbed. When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all. [And after they have reigned they will rest.]"

The Sacred Gospel of St. Thomas

Lord Jesus again says that we should seek the Kingdom of God which is God Himself, the Self and we should not stop until we find It. Only then we will be in rest. There are many impediments in our life but whatever happens we must continue our quest whatever it takes.
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Subramanian.R

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #92 on: April 14, 2012, 01:41:53 PM »

Dear ramana and others,

The Kingdom of God is within.

Arunachala Siva.

nonduel

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #93 on: April 14, 2012, 07:07:14 PM »
Dear Ramana,

Quote:
"Lord Jesus again says that we should seek the Kingdom of God which is God Himself, the Self and we should not stop until we find It. Only then we will be in rest. There are many impediments in our life but whatever happens we must continue our quest whatever it takes."

The searching is made by the mind. You can never find what you are, you can only BE it.

You are conscious of existing, of being aren't you?. Do you have to search to find your consciousness? How do you find your consciousness?

You can search for something, but you can only find an object, not the searcher.

Forget about the impediments, they are only pictures appearing on the screen, in consciousness. 
Oh Arunachala, blazing fire of Jnana, in my heart I pray and think of Thee from afar, root out the ego, merging me in the Self.

Hari

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #94 on: April 14, 2012, 07:13:21 PM »
Yes, sir. Self-inquiry also advocates us to search the the ego which is non-existent (the ego). These are just different ways to describe dualistically daily sadhana which we must do. Find the Source of the ego (prescribed by Ramana) is the same as Lord Jesus' words "Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find". What would we find? That there is nothing to be found. That's why Lord Jesus says "When they find, they will be disturbed. When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all."

Best wishes, ramana1359
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Hari

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #95 on: April 14, 2012, 07:16:48 PM »
Quote
     Lord's prayer or Pater noster (Our Father)

    "Our Father in heaven,
    hallowed be Your name.
    Your Kingdom come,
    Your Will be done,
    on earth as it is in heaven.
    Give us this day our daily bread,
    and forgive us our debts,
    as we also have forgiven our debtors.
    And lead us not into temptation,
    but deliver us from evil."
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Hari

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #96 on: April 17, 2012, 10:39:39 PM »
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How terrible it will be for anyone who causes others to sin. Temptation to do wrong is inevitable, but how terrible it will be for the person who does the tempting.
Matthew 18:7


What will happen to happen. Temptation and everything will come when it is their time. The reason for bearing the consequences (fruits) is our identification with the doer. "How terrible it will be for the person" says the Lord. The person is the key word here. When there is no person, how can be temptation or whatever? Why Lord Jesus wasn't tempted? The answer is clear for you. It is absolutely in alignment with what Eastern religions teach.

Glory to the Lord and all jnanis and bhaktas from all religions in the world!
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sanjaya_ganesh

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #97 on: April 18, 2012, 08:00:08 AM »
Friends, Personally, among all the best and closest advise in Bible is "Kingdom of God is within you". Is it not the same advice that Sri Bhagawan also wanted us to understand? Amazing to see how so distant and diverse Jnanis realized the SAME TRUTH, which itself is a proof for so called "Atheists" that TRUTH IS ONE AND SAME irrespective of caste, creed, geography, religion etc.

I vividly remember now the story of an atheist meeting Sri Bhagawan and telling him that he does not believe in all these things. To his surprise Sri Bhagawan agreed with him that He is also like that and He agrees with Atheist. Sri Bhagawan asked : "Forget all, But do you believe you exist?". Atheist replied yes of course. And then Bhagawan told him that he is no longer an Atheist, but a theist like Bhagawan :). What a nice one... Sorry I could not reproduce the story as is from memory
Salutations to Bhagawan

Hari

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #98 on: April 19, 2012, 12:15:53 AM »
Absolutely! The problem is that almost everyone is not looking for the truth but to justify his/her theology and belief. Are most religious followers looking for God? On my observation - no. They are just using God and His Word to justify their egoistic tendencies. We are witness how Bible was used for killing of many women declared to be witches, black africans to be inferior race, starting "holy" wars. Even the structure of the church with its bishops, popes and so on is just human creation and is result from externalisation of the Bible. There is nothing wrong with church, the problem is within its followers.
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Nagaraj

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #99 on: April 19, 2012, 11:13:57 AM »
Absolutely! The problem is that almost everyone is not looking for the truth but to justify his/her theology and belief.

Dear i,

no need to worry about everyone :) , Bhagavan always has said, attend to your self, the purpose for which each one has come. We are not here to correct anybody, or, uplift anybody, we are here just, absolutely for ourselves. We are not saviors of Christ teachings, or saviors of Vedas or any other scriptures. If we are blessed with the true purport of the scriptures, bible, vedas, then it is our good fortune, only for us to strengthen our sadhana further.

What matters is not where everyone is looking for truth, not whether most followers are looking for God, but, what matters is our own selves. Because, if we look outside, we are not looking within.

Outside, hundreds of things may go on, the true wisdom is only to look within, no matter what goes on externally.

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

sanjaya_ganesh

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #100 on: April 19, 2012, 11:40:04 AM »
Absolutely "I sir". Cannot agree more with you. And every religion / scripture is there to explain Triputi only. A religion has to fundamentally explain 3 things - (1) Jiva (2) Jagath (3) Eshwara. And the reality as Bhagawan says is encompassing all these three. So without getting lost in Maya's great Triputi game - let us progress. And I am yet to come across a religion which is not based on explaining this Triputi and that is power of Maha Maya :)
Salutations to Bhagawan

Subramanian.R

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #101 on: April 19, 2012, 06:10:08 PM »
Dear sanjaya_ganesh,

Sri Bhagavan clearly says in Verse 9 of Ulladu Narpadu, that the dyads and triads are are dependent only on the ego. If one
examines what is that ego, which is the basis of dyads and triputis, then they will disappear. One who realizes the Truth.
They will be never deluded by the same.

Arunachala Siva.

Hari

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #102 on: April 19, 2012, 07:45:03 PM »
Quote
What matters is not where everyone is looking for truth, not whether most followers are looking for God, but, what matters is our own selves. Because, if we look outside, we are not looking within.

Dear, Nagaraj,

Truth, The Self, Brahman, Love, God and so on are synonymous. That's what I mean by Truth - to be your Self, to find the Kingdom of Heaven.

Quote
no need to worry about everyone :) , Bhagavan always has said, attend to your self, the purpose for which each one has come. We are not here to correct anybody, or, uplift anybody, we are here just, absolutely for ourselves.

I just tried to explain to sanjaya_ganesh that the religion is not something rigid. It is not a dogma or whatever. It is an interpetation of a Holy Book by a group of people. That every religion has "externalized version" and mysticism. Mysticism is the inner path to God (the Self).
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Nagaraj

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #103 on: April 19, 2012, 11:00:39 PM »
religion is not something rigid. It is not a dogma or whatever. It is an interpetation of a Holy Book by a group of people. That every religion has "externalized version" and mysticism. Mysticism is the inner path to God (the Self).

true.. :)

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Hari

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Re: Bible and christian quotes in the light of Advaita
« Reply #104 on: April 21, 2012, 03:02:47 PM »
   

Quote
Psalm 123

A song of ascents.

1 I lift up my eyes to You,
   to You Who sit enthroned in heaven.

2 As the eyes of slaves look to the hand of their master,
   as the eyes of a female slave look to the hand of her mistress,
so our eyes look to the LORD our God,
   till He shows us His mercy.

3 Have mercy on us, LORD, have mercy on us,
   for we have endured no end of contempt.

4 We have endured no end
   of ridicule from the arrogant,
   of contempt from the proud.
   
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