Author Topic: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)  (Read 304468 times)

ramana_maharshi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3557
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #255 on: October 14, 2011, 12:59:12 PM »
well said Subramanian garu i 100% agree with you.

This is exactly what i told to nagraj garu also in this post.

http://www.arunachala-ramana.org/forum/index.php?topic=6631.0

Bhagavan said that advaita and knowing that we are indeed self should be only in bhavana.

We need to acknowledge that in order to achieve this goal we need to  make use of our body.

ramana_maharshi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3557
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #256 on: October 17, 2011, 05:16:39 PM »
85. Question: What is the difference between the bound man and the one liberated?

Bhagavan: From the Heart, the Self-center, there is a subtle passage leading to the mind's center. The ordinary man lives in the brain unaware of himself in the Heart. The enlightened one lives in the Heart. When he moves about and deals with men and things, he knows that what he sees is not separate from the one Supreme Reality, the Brahman, (the impersonal Absolute Reality) which he realized in the Heart as his own Self, the Real.

Question: What about the ordinary man?

Bhagavan: I have just said that he sees things outside himself. He is separate from the world, from his own deeper truth, from the truth that supports him and what he sees. The man who has realized the Supreme Truth of his own existence realizes that it is the one Supreme Reality that is there behind him, behind the world. In fact, he is aware of the One, as the Real, the Self in all selves, in all things, Eternal and Immutable, in all that is impermanent and mutable.

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 47994
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #257 on: October 17, 2011, 05:24:56 PM »


Dear prasanth,

When the mind stays in the Heart, without jumping outside, it is called Aha mukham or Andhar mukham.  When the mind
jumps outside with thoughts about the world, jiva, and other beings. it is called Bhahir Muktam.  [Who am I?]




Arunachala Siva.

ramana_maharshi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3557
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #258 on: October 18, 2011, 10:05:31 AM »
86. Question: Some say that to make an effort for one's liberation is selfish, and that instead of that, one should do good to others by selfless service.

Bhagavan: Those people believe that jnanis (realized beings) are selfish and that they themselves are selfless, but this is not a true belief. The jnani lives in the experience of Brahman (the impersonal Absolute Reality) and the effect of this experience spreads all over the world. A radio transmission is done from one point but its effect can be felt all over the world. Those who would like to benefit from it can do so. Similarly, the Self-realization of the jnani spreads everywhere and whosoever wants can tune into it. This is not a lesser service.

ramana_maharshi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3557
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #259 on: October 19, 2011, 09:58:57 AM »
87. Question: How to maintain the thought that all is Brahman (the impersonal Absolute Reality) in the midst of worldly activities?

Bhagavan: When the harmonium is being played there is a constant note that is called the sruti. Along with that, other notes also come out. If the ear is fixed on this note that is constant, then, while listening to the other notes, that original note cannot be forgotten. Actually, that first note gives strength to all the other notes. So, the principle to understand is that the first note is the adhistana (substratum) while the other notes represent worldly activities. During worldly activities, if (awareness of) the note of the adhistana is continuous, whatever is spoken is then done with authority of this adhistana note. But an ordinary man does not keep his attention on the first note, the adhistana. He merely listens to the subsequent notes. Sukhdev (a sage of ancient India) used to keep such attention and maintain his awareness of Brahman. When the attention is fixed properly on the first note, the effect of the other notes will not be felt.

ramana_maharshi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3557
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #260 on: October 20, 2011, 10:03:02 AM »
88. Question: How much sleep does a Jnani (realized being) require?

Bhagavan: Sleep is necessary to one who thinks, "I have risen from sleep." But, to those who are ever in changeless Sleep, what need is there for some other sleep? When the eyelids feel strained, it will do to close the eyes for a while. The three states of waking, dreaming, and deep sleep are for the mind and not for the body.

ramanaduli

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 851
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #261 on: October 20, 2011, 12:46:28 PM »
Dear sir,

However the body grows from infant stage to older stage. It needs food as well as sleep and rest, Is not it? They say body is a jadam then how it grows?  When we have sound sleep, our mind and body becomes fresh. Gnani may not sleep.


Ramanaduli

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 47994
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #262 on: October 20, 2011, 01:01:25 PM »



Dear Ramanaduli,

Yes. The body is jadam, insentient. But how does it grow with food?  It is because of the "I" inside. Without "I" the body cannot
grow, nor can it get old, and become senile and ultimately die. In the scriptures, it is said that there is agni inside the stomach,
which creates hunger and thirst and which also does the work of digesting the food.  The Agni is "I".  And then, one says after a
long deep sleep that he slept nicely. Is he telling that 'during sleep'? He is telling that after getting up from sleep?  It is the "I"
which says that he had a sound sleep.

Brahmasri Nochur Venkataraman used to give an example.  Suppose one meets with an accident, and in the process, he has to
lose one of his arms or legs.  The arm or leg is amputated and kept in a basin in  a chemical.  Now, the person, who is awake
after the surgery, after all anaesthesia, says: Thank God, I am alive!  Now the amputated leg or arm will not say anything, neither
I am dead or I am alive. So the 'remaining' body of the person, after amputation, which says I am alive, says due to the "I" within!

Sri Bhagavan says that animals and plants also do have this 'I' sense. When you cut off the branch of a tree, or pluck a flower,
they also feel the pain due to the I inside. But only difference is that they do not speak it out.
That is why Sri Bhagavan says that you should pluck the fruits with a mild act and not use knife or long stick and beat the trees.
The flowers should be taken only when they fall down and you should not pluck the flowers.   



Arunachala Siva.   
 

ramana_maharshi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3557
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #263 on: October 20, 2011, 01:04:21 PM »
Dear Subramanian garu,

Well said sir.

Bhagavad Gita also says the same

Bhagavad Gita Ch15 Text 14

I am the fire of digestion in every living body, and I am the air of life, outgoing and incoming, by which I digest the four kinds of foodstuff.


Body is jadama and all activities of the body are taken care by material nature(mother shakthi).

It requires food,sleep etc to sustain..

However self does nothing and we should know that we are not the body and rather use it as a tool.

Bhagavad Gita Ch2 Text 25

It is said that the soul is invisible, inconceivable, immutable, and unchangeable. Knowing this, you should not grieve for the body.

Bhagavad Gita Ch13 Text 30

One who can see that all activities are performed by the body, which is created of material nature, and sees that the self does nothing, actually sees.


Jnani's body also sleep and it is confirmed by bhagavan but rather they utilise their dreams to purposeful manner like they dream of visiting temples,thinking of gods etc.

ramanaduli

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 851
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #264 on: October 20, 2011, 01:44:11 PM »
Dear Subramaniyan ji,

Thanks for the reply.  The "I" which is inside us. So the agani in the stomach is also the same "I".  When people get sick, they say "I" do not want to eat. Doctors say some reason. Ultimately the agni which is inside the stomach becomes dull so there is no hunger. When the man says we think Mr. or Mrs. so and so says the problem but it is not. the "I" who witness the agni says there is no hunger. The same "I" knows everything what is happening inside the body i.e. pain and discomfort except death. Ordinary people i.e. the same "I" cannot say  the time of death but gnani says to his deciples. 
Why does it happen?

2ndly regarding the flowers... they say the flower which is fallen on the ground is not good to offer, We should pluck flowers in a such a way for offering. (1) the plants to be watered by us. We should not pluck from other's garden. (2) we should pluck in the morning.
we should  not disturb the bees when it sucks the honey. we should not pluck the buds. we should pluck without doing harm to the plants. fresh flowers should be plucked. It should be frangerant. while plucking we should not talk so our saliva may fall on the flowers.
Lastly we should carry the flowers in the basket which should be above our naval.

Thanking you,

Ramanaduli

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 47994
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #265 on: October 20, 2011, 02:18:58 PM »


Dear Ramanaduli,

Firstly, a Brahma Jnani has no body and mind. He lives as Swarupam, the Self. It is this Self which makes him write poems, speak to
people etc., For the living Jnani, the body is like a shirt or a sari. He knows when to remove the shirt. Whereas the ajnanis, who
are considering that their bodies are their real 'I' do not know when he will kick the bucket.

Regarding flowers and fruits, Sri Bhagavan has said that only to say that the plants and trees have also got like, the I inside,
and they also have pain. So fruits must be plucked with minimum discomfort to the trees. Flowers fall due to wind etc., And only
such flowers should be used. But in real life, we do not do this. So the concession is: Pluck the flowers with minimum discomfort
to the plants, when bees have not taking honey etc., And also leave some flowers in the plants since God would be happier if
they remain in the plants as ornaments than on one's head or on God's image. But we do not follow these.

One lady wanted to do some puja with one lac bhilva leaves. In the Hill, she went on plucking leaves from bhilwa trees
in as much as the trees were tonsured. Sri Bhagavan said: Why do you do these? Instead, if you want to do Siva Puja
with a lac of bhilwa leaves, you pinch your thigh a lac of times.  Then you will know the pain!

 


Arunachala Siva.             

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #266 on: October 20, 2011, 04:14:12 PM »
This body is just one among those plants and trees in the nature. This body is 'prakruti'

This body grows but not 'I' ;  I remains the same during all avasthas, right from being a child, boyhood, youth, man, etc...

the body grew but not 'I'

Bhagavan gave the example of how body traveled from train, then from a cart and reached the Ashram, but throughout the 'I' remained unmoved.

Whether or not we are able to believe or perceive that the Body is not us, we have to believe blindly that we are not the body, doesn't matter if the body pains and we also experience the pains, it is ok. But The Great Sages have said that the Body is not ours, so that is the truth. It does not matter if we know it as yet. Our attitude should be that = "if the sages have said, it has to be true, so I believe" with the awareness that the intellect is never supreme.

The Sages are always right!

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 47994
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #267 on: October 20, 2011, 05:39:19 PM »


In this connection, Nochur Venkataraman used to tell a story:  One grandfather, say of 80 years old, was showing his younger days
photographs to his grandson. Say, 10 year, 25 years etc., The grandson said: Thatha!  These photographs are not you. You are     
different now. You have to walk with a stick, you have lost most of your teeth. Your hair has grown white and cottony. Your face is
wrinkled. It is not you who is in these photographs.  The grandfather said: Yes., It is only 'I". Only the body has become old and teeth
have fallen, and hairs have become white and cottony.   But it is "I" only.

Yes. As Nagaraj said, "I" does not grow. It is all pervading, where can it further grow?  We are always the "I" and not the body.



Arunachala Siva.   

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #268 on: October 20, 2011, 06:13:27 PM »
Dear Friends,

When the sages refer the body as "inert" it simply does not mean a 'stone'; Inert is an english substitute for Jada. it does not means just a stone, it does not means just something like "numb", "unintelligent" or, even, we cannot just say, that which is not chaitanya, because the Self alone is the Chaitanya which is all pervading, CAN THERE BE ANYTHING ELSE WITHOUT CHAITANYA. IS THERE SOMETHING THAT IS "NOT SELF" CAN THERE BE SOMETHING THAT IS INERT? Self is Everything! To say that that is stone, it is inert and this is body, it is inert is also in a way wrong only. Well it is initially said so to the Sadhaka who has strong identification with the body! Can the body operate without the Chaitanya of Self? Can the tree grow without water? without the rains? Can the body grow without the will of the Chaitanya to feed it with the fuel of food?

Inert refers to avidya, ignorance. Inert, Jada also refers to the perceptions of duality, perception of "the other"

The root is this there is no "two" no "other" How can there exist 2 chaitanya? There is only One Chaitanya, the Self. Any other perception, of the 'other' is only referred as "Inert" or Jada and not the body itself!

Friends, you all would remember how JadaBharata was referred as a "Jada" Jada is that which is void of life, or chaitanya. In the same way like how some small kids threw stones on Bhagavan when he was in Deep Samadhi thinking him to be a jada!

Inert, Jada only refers to avidya. It can be considered as the 'mirage' 'illusion'

In the Snake-Rope phenomenon, the snake refers to "jada" as it is really not there, "the perception of existence of snake" is referred as Jada, which is Avidya. In the same spirit, the body is referred to as jada. as long as the perception of snake is, so long we need to protect ourselves and be careful, and so long, the perception of body is, so long we will remain identified with it.

All the lives chaitanya is just the same.

The same Chaitanya is present in everything. Even to say 'present' is wrong because, to be present there has to be "the other" Therefore what is is only Chaitanya. Not even saying present. Like the spirit of "Isavasyam idam sarvam yat kim ca jagatyam jagat, tena tyaktena bhunjithah ma gridhah kasyasvid dhanam" The entire universe is indwelt, enveloped, covered by the Supreme Being, whatever this world be – moving or non-moving, living or otherwise.

'I' am the Self in Everything said Krishna. Therefore there is no another Self or another 'I' or another 'chaitanya' and to believe so is referred as Jada.

For the one who has strong body identification, is referred to as a Jada.

In the case of Jada Bharata, while he was immersed in supreme bliss of Self, others who were 'Jada' themselves with identification with their bodies as Self, called Jada Bharata as 'Jada' such was the irony of other people in that incident.

Friends, more over, while we have to be aware that body is not us; at the same time it is very important to also realise that body is not different from the Self. The body is not different and the Self is not different. Self is everything without any distinctiveness.

When we see the stone, the attitude should be that that Self is the stone, and that Self am I That stone is not different. Here there is no question of "jada" at all, what is, is just Self alone. what is Jada. It dawns that 'Jada' is our own avidya. Jada is the snake in snake rope phenomenon.

To say that the body is inert or Jada, itself, denotes the existence of a body? like denoting the existence of a snake in the snake rope phenomenon, like the belief in existence of a mirage. Hence this illusion in ourselves is referred to as "Jada" and to call the body as Jada/inert is wrong really, when we look deeply and discern.

.....some musings :)

Salutations to Bhagavan
« Last Edit: October 20, 2011, 07:09:32 PM by Nagaraj »
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Nagaraj

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5130
    • View Profile
Re: Daily Message From AHAM (The Association of Happiness for All Mankind)
« Reply #269 on: October 20, 2011, 06:36:58 PM »
Friends,

Made several corrections. Just acknowledging changes made by this post here. If you have already read, please re-read, as previously, before the changes, the essence was not communicated properly. Thank you.

Salutations to Bhagavan
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta