Author Topic: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough  (Read 759247 times)

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #585 on: February 20, 2011, 10:04:12 AM »
The Vichara ‘to know the Self’ is different in method from the meditation “Shivoham” or “Soham”, ‘Lord Shiva I am” or He I am.” I rather lay stress upon  Self-knowledge, for, you are  first concerned with yourself before you proceed to know the world and its Lord. The ‘Soham” meditation or ‘I am Brahman’ meditation is more or less a mental thought. But the quest for the Self I speak of is a direct method, indeed superior  to the other meditation; for, the moment you get into a movement of quest for the Self  and go deeper and deeper, the real Self is waiting there to take you in and then whatever is done is done  by something else and you have no hand in it. In this process, all doubts and discussions are automatically given up, just as one who sleeps forgets, for the time being, all his care.   

Devotee : What certainty is there  that something else waits there to welcome me ?

Sri Bhagwan: When one is a sufficiently developed soul (pakvi) he becomes naturally convinced.
                                                                               P-7&8, Sat-Darshana Vashya and Talks with Maharshi

Therefore, Vichara as taught by Sri Bhagwan is a radically different technique from other meditation, such as “He I am” or “ Shivoham” etc.  Such meditation is a mental thought. And, in my view, herein lies the greatest importance of the Gracious Teaching of the Master. “ I rather lay stress upon Self-knowledge, for, you are first concerned with yourself before you proceed to know the world and its Lord .”  Gracious Lord Sri Arunahala chooses to adopt a Human Garb within time and space  and teaches not to pay attention to thoughts and objects but instead on the thinker himself. Attention is effectively back on the Source from where  I got deflected at a tangent and started saying ‘I am a jiva.’ Self-attention is key to Self-awareness. So at long last, after millions of years in the oblivion away from the Blissful Supreme Abode, a great Guru comes and not only reminds us of our Home, turns our attention to It, but also charts out a Royal Highway to It.

All we have to do is to go sufficiently deeper and deeper. We have to put in efforts up to a certain stage only. Sri Bhagwan says that the real Self is waiting there to take us in. You do not have to do anything. After this stage whatever is to be done is done by the Higher Power. All are His cares from here onwards. If we do sadhana of the ‘Atma-Vichara’ as taught by Sri Bhagwan, all doubts and discussions come to end of their own accord. Besides, Sri Bhagwan says that whatever the previous development, Vichara quickens the development.

Thank you
     Anil         
                                                 

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #586 on: February 20, 2011, 04:12:31 PM »




Dear Anil.

Muruganar says this in two verses of Guru Vachaka Kovai:

710:  Deep rooted diseases will not be even slightly eliminated
by repeating the name of medicine, but only by consuming it.
Likewise, the fetter off samsara will not be sundered solely by
doing japa of maha-vakyas such as Sivoham that expound thje ultimate union.

712:  When the reality that is known as the Heart, gradually emerges from the Heart and expands as consciousness, it takes many thousands  names.  On investigation, the foremost of these
will be found to be 'I'.



Arunachala Siva.

 

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #587 on: February 21, 2011, 07:47:48 AM »
Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

It was divinely planned. It was divinely ordained. Coming of Sri Muruganar and Sri Ganapati Muni with Sri Bhagwan.  They were the great poets of Sri Bhagwan’s Royal Spiritual Court. They, ever immersed in deep devotion to the Guru, versified Sri Bhagwan’s Sublime Teaching in extraordinarily beautiful poetry  accurately . They are some of the greatest devotional poetry ever written. I  sometimes  also deeply feel, like so many other devotees, how  I can ever recompense the debt due to them.

The nature of my realization was such that the ‘I’ that asserts its own reality was revealed as false and disappeared, but not the ‘I’ that is the unique, pure non-dual Self that exists permeating all things equally.
                                                    V-86, Sri Guru Ramana Prasadam


How sublimely Sri Muruganar has expressed the ‘nature of his Realization’ ! ‘I’ that falsely asserts its own reality, but in truth being a mere abhasa ( reflection), takes to flight, but, nevertheless,  ‘I’, the Self, exist ever permeating all things equally. Such is the nature of my Realization.

The grace of the Lord will open the eyes of those who love him, and before the thought of him can ever arise in the heart, will speak to them inwardly saying, ‘ Behold it is I !’
Lending sharpness to my sight and directing my gaze to his holy feet it kept me close by his side, the grace of my Lord.
                                                       V- 976, Sri Guru Ramana Prasadam


Ji. Yes. To one who loves Him, His Eye says, ‘Behold it is I !’ if he gazes without and of course  to such a one who loves Him, He will speak to him saying, ‘Behold it is I !’ from within.

Thank you so much sir.

Regards,
   Anil                               


eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #588 on: February 21, 2011, 08:39:50 AM »
The aham vritti is different from Aham Sphurti. The former is the activity of the ego, and is bound to lose itself and make way for the latter, which is an eternal expression of the Self. In Vedantic parlance this Aham Sphurti is called Vritti Jnana. Realization or Jnana is always a vritti. There is a distinction between Vritti Jnana or Realization  and Swarupa the Real. Swarupa is Jnana itself, it is Consciousness.

Swarupa is Sat-Chit which is omnipresent. It is always there Self-attained. When you realize it, the realization is called Vritti Jnana. It is only with reference with your existence, that you talk of realization or Jnana. Therefore, when we talk of Jnana, we always mean Vritti Jnana and not Swarupa Jnana; for Swarupa itself is Jnana ( Consciousness ) always.
                                                  Sri Bhagwan, P-20&21, Sat-Darshana Bhashya and Talks with Maharshi 

The word ‘Realization’ is a vritti and , therefore, cannot be Swarupa Itself. Swarupa is ‘Pure Knowledge’, or ‘Pure Awareness’ and is present in each and every experience. It is ‘Whole’. Even to say ‘it is Whole’ violates Its Wholeness. I am Swarupa, or Jnana Itself. When I am Jnana Itself, where is the question of Its Realization and non-Realization. Sri Bhagwan’s Statement that  ’one is ever realized’ should, in my view, be understood  in this light. This is why Sri Bhagwan says that when we talk of Realization, or Jnana, we always mean Vritti Jnana and not Swarupa Jnana. I am a man is a fact. Do I need to assert this fact ? When I say I am not a man, will it make any difference to me being a man ? So, this is the true  meaning and implication of the ‘Summa Iru’, or ’Be Still’. I AM THAT I AM. That is all. How ? “ Be still and know that I am God”. So long as we are discussing things, It is Vritti Jnana.

Thank you,
    Anil                                       

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #589 on: February 21, 2011, 09:00:09 AM »



Dear Anil,

Sri Bhagavan mentions about three aspects.

Aham Vritti - The I thought and many many subsequent thoughts.

Aham Sphurti - The quelling of the mind, and attaining Swarupa
Jnana.

Aham Sphurna  - Permanent abidance in Swarupam.  In Sahaja
Stithi, the Brahma Jnani is ever in permanent abidance of Swarupam
and all his daily activities are done by Swarupam.



Arunachala Siva.
 

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #590 on: February 21, 2011, 03:06:02 PM »
Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

Vritti is a mode of the mind. With vritti one sees or experiences  knowledge. Sri Bhagwan says that one should not confound and mistake vritti with Knowledge, Jnana Itself.  Vritti  is only a phenomena  and operates in the realm of abhasa ( reflected consciousness ). Knowledge is beyond vritti in which there is no subject and no object. Vritti belongs to rajasic mind (active mind). Satvic mind is free from the vrittis.

Aham Vritti :-Sri Bhagwan says in Talk-307 that the Self , or ‘I’ is perceived associated with the body on waking. Such associated ‘I’ is Aham vritti.

Aham Sphurana :-When Aham represents the Self only it is Aham Sphurana. It is our True Nature underlying the three states of waking, sleep, and dream.

Akhanakara vritti, or  ( Unbroken Experience ):-Self uninterrupted by waking, sleep, and dream is the Akhadakara vritti, or the Unbroken Experience. Sri Bhagwan says that this should not be understood to be literally a vritti. Vritti is a function of the mind. The Unbroken, Continuous Consciousness transcends the mind. This natural and primal state of the Jnani is the Akhandakara vritti or the Unbroken Experience.

Sri Bhagwan says that Aham vritti is the broken ‘I-thought’. Aham Spurana  ( the light of  ‘I-I’ )is unbroken, continuous.

Thank you so much sir.

Regards,
   Anil   

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #591 on: February 21, 2011, 04:28:18 PM »


Dear Anil,

Yes.  Nochur Venkataraman says that Sri Bhagavan has also mentioned about Aham Sphurti, which is in between Aham Vritti
and Aham Sphurana.  I am not able to readily find out the source of
this conversation.  Aham Sphurti is experienced when the I thoughts are totally quiescent, for a small period of time, where there is foretaste of the Self.  If abidance in Aham Sphurti is firmly established, then it becomes Aham Sphurana.




Arunachala Siva.

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #592 on: February 22, 2011, 07:45:13 AM »
Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

Ji. Yes. Sri Bhagwan says that in Vedantic  parlance Aham Sphurti is called Vritti Jnana. However , He says that there is a distinction between Vritti Jnana or Realization and Jnana,  Swarupa the Real. Sri Bhagwan says that when we talk of realization or Jnana, we always mean Vritti Jnana and not Swarupa Jnana; for Swarupa itself is Jnana ( Consciousness ) always. The meaning and implication becomes obvious when Sri Bhagwan Sayss that it is only with reference to your existence that you talk of realization or Jnana.

From the above, therefore, there is no doubt that Aham Sphurti is in between Aham Vritti and Aham Sphurana and is experienced as a foretaste of the Self, as you so significantly said. Firm abidance in Aham Sphurti  is Aham Sphurana,  Swarupa the Real.

Thank you so much sir.

Regards,
   Anil 



eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #593 on: February 22, 2011, 07:49:32 AM »
Devotee:  Enquiry into the Self seems to take one into the  subtle body (puriashtaka, ativahika, or jivatma). Am I right ?

Sri Bhagwan : After some time the subtle body or the jivatma will disappear and there will be the ‘Eka’ (One) only. 
                                                               Talk-629

Sri Bhagwan says that there are two kinds of vrittis. Vishaya vritti (objective) and Atma vritti (subjective). The first must go away and give place to the second. The practice of Atma-Vichara takes one first to puriashtaka, or the jivatma ( subtle body)  and then to the One Self.
Sri Bhagwan says that Atma vritti or the subjective vritti is the same as jnanam.
Sri Bhagwan says in Talk-624 that the common man is aware of himself only when modifications arise in the intellect; these modifications are transient; they arise and set. The subject (knower) is only a mode of mind. Though the mode (vritti) passes, the reality behind does not cease. The background of the mode is the ‘I’ in which the mind modes arise and sink.

Sri Bhagwan says that “ to be in one’s natural state on the subsidence of thoughts is bliss; if that bliss be transient –arising and setting –then it is only the sheath of bliss, not the pure Self. So, what is needed here is to fix the attention on the pure ‘I’ after the subsidence of all thoughts and not to lose hold of it. SRI BHAGWAN SAYS (TALK-624) THAT “ THIS HAS TO BE DESCRIBED AS AN EXTREMELY SUBTLE THOUGHT; ELSE IT CANNOT BE SPOKEN OF AT ALL, SINCE IT IS NO OTHER THAN THE REAL Self. WHO IS TO SPEAK OF IT, TO WHOM AND HOW ?”

Thank you,
    Anil
 

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #594 on: February 22, 2011, 07:54:55 AM »
Devotee : So far I understand . But what about the body ? How could I feel this Vritti Jnana in the body ?

Sri Bhagwan : You can feel yourself one with the One that exists. The whole body becomes a mere power, a force-current. Your life becomes a needle drawn to a huge mass of magnet and as you go deeper and deeper , you become a mere centre and then not even that, for you become a mere Consciousness; there are no thoughts and  cares any longer-they were shattered at the threshold –it is an inundation. You, a mere straw, are swallowed alive, but it is very delightful, for you become the very thing that swallows you. This is the union of jiva with Brahman, the loss of ego in the real Self, the destruction of falsehood, the attainment of Truth.
                                                                P-21, Sat-Darshana Vashya and Talks with Maharshi   

Thank You,
     Anil

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #595 on: February 22, 2011, 10:53:54 AM »



Dear Anil,

This is the question that many people ask.  A Brahma Jnani is
Sahaja Stithi, where there are no thoughts, not even the I-thought,
the prime vritti, can eat, sleep, attend to nature calls, attend to various activities like cooking, talking etc.?

Muruganar answers this point in two ways.

1.  The Self which is within, will do all these work, since there
is not kartrutvam.

2. Saiva Siddhantis, however have got a slightly different view.
They say [and Muruganar also says] that a Brahma Jnani's mind
becomes Suddha Manas or Pure Mind or Sattvic Mind.  This Sattvic
Mind which is nothing but pure manifestation of the Self,   
would do all these work.

See Guru Vachaka Kovai, Verses 1139, 1140 and 1149.
See also Guru Vachaka Kovai, Verse 924.



Arunachala Siva.

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #596 on: February 22, 2011, 12:24:13 PM »
Dear Subramanian Sir,

I never wished to know how does a Brahma Jnani eats, acts etc. To such a question, Sri Bhagwan always advised the questioner to realize first. His Statement that such question would not arise after Realization is adequate for me.

Action is insentient ( V-1, Upadesa Saram ). Self is Pure Knowlddge, or Pure Intelligence, or Pure Awareness. Therefore, the Self must be present in every action, every experience as the Intelligent Principle.

But, nevertheless, question remains as to how works are performed, and who and why performs them?

Dear sir, these questions do not bother me. Why? Because I believe, " All is your jugglery, Oh Lord ! "

However, I wish to say a few words regarding 'three gunas' (nature), which are responsible for works, in my next post.

Thank you so much sir.

Regards,
   Anil

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #597 on: February 22, 2011, 01:35:32 PM »
Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

A Brahma Jnani is ever rooted in the Self.

" Just as the moon seems to move when the clouds around her move, so also the Self seems to the undiscriminating to be active, when actually, the senses are active. "
        V-19, Atmabodha

" Just as men do their duties in the light of the Sun ( but the Sun does not participate in them ), so also the body, the senses etc. function in the light of the Self without its participating in them."
          V-20, Atmabodha

Thank you so much sir.

Regards,
    Anil

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #598 on: February 22, 2011, 04:22:55 PM »



Dear Anil,

When Sri Bhagavan was asked in the Commission of Inquiry [related to Perumal Swami's case]:  "Do you follow Sri Sankara's philosophy?" Sri Bhagavan answered:  "I am following my experience.  Later, I found that it tallies with Sri Sankara's."

If you study Atma Bodham of Sri Sankara [Sri Bhagavan has done it
verse by verse in verse], you will be surprised that it is all Bhagavan's life and teachings. But Sri Bhagavan never read anything on Sri Sankara, before His self realization!



Arunachala Siva. 
 

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #599 on: February 23, 2011, 07:22:08 AM »
Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

“ Can Sankara, the enlightener of the Self, be different from one’s own Self ? Who but he, does this day, abiding as the inmost Self in me, speak this in Tamil language ?”
                                                                                                                     Sri Bhagwan

Ji. Yes. Philosophical aspect of Sri Bhagwan’s Teaching tallies with Sri Adi Sankara’s. Enlightener of the Self cannot be different from the Self. Adi Guru Sri Dakshinamoorti, Sri Adi Sankara and Sri Bhagwan are One, the Self. To think of Them other than the Self is gross ignorance, living in the darkness.

However, dear sir, I wish to say that Sri Bhagwan was Lord Sri Arunachala manifested. His True and most potent Teaching is through Silence. Therefore, He is better identified with Sri Dakshinamoorti.

“ They who know the ‘I’ as body, breath, senses, intellect, or the void, are deluded like children, and the blind and the stupid and talk much. To him who destroys the great delusion produced by ignorance; to him who removes the obstacles to knowledge, the Guru Dakshinamoorti, may this obeisance be !”     
                                                V-6, Sri Dakshinamoorti Stotram

Sri Bhagwan has removed the obstacles to Knowledge through His potent Silence as well as the Sacred and Revealed Words like Sri Dakshinamoorti. Sri Dakshinamoorti and Sri Bhagwan, the Self, the Father, have a south-facing form.

Thank you so much sir.

Regards,
  Anil