Author Topic: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough  (Read 757033 times)

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4005 on: December 08, 2014, 10:50:44 AM »
"....And now He has come to quell the darkness of mere logic by providing a living example of abidance in Brahman (Pure Being)."
Sri Ramana Gita

A confirmed atheist came to Bhagwan. He was notorious for defeating in argument pious and spiritual people, demanding them to prove the existence of God: 'Is there God: can you prove the existence of God?' He shot his pointed questions at Ramana. Bhagwan smiled at him and said: "Why worry about God? Let Him worry about Himself! Find out who raises this question.?"The questioner was puzzled; Sri Bhagwan guided him to read the booklet 'Who am I?'. One who had come on a visit only for an hour stayed on for a few days! He came to Bhagwan one day and said: "Bhagwan! When I came here as an atheist, denying God, I was happy. But, now, after asking myself the question 'Who am I?' I am thoroughly confused. I feel I have deteriorated; therefore I am very unhappy."

Bhagwan is all compassion, gave him a benign smile and said: "Your confusion is not a state of deterioration. All these days you have been indifferent to the Truth behind your own existence. Now, you have raised the fundamental question; thereby you have moved away from indifference, it is only an improvement!  FROM  INDIFFERENCE  TO  CONFUSION,  FROM  CONFUSION   TO   CLARITY,  FROM  (INTELLECTUAL)  CLARITY  TO  EXPEREINCE  AND  FROM  EXPEREINCE  TO  ABIDANCE  IN  THE  SELF?THIS  IS  THE  ORDER  OF  ASCENDENCY  IN  SPIRITUAL  SADHANA." Bhagwan was the storehouse of all that is auspicious--His Presence pierced through the dense darkness of the ignorant and empowered them to receive His Grace which was offered in abundance.
Source: Purushottama Ramana 

 


Dear Devotees,

Such is the power, potency and efficacy of Sri Bhagwan's Atma-vichara ! 'Who Am I?' Enquiry awakens from deep slumber even confirmed atheists, materialists and polemics! Sri Paul Brunton himself, who was an atheist when he came to Sri Bhagwan, is another example.  People in general are blind and indifferent to the Truth of their own existence, and apparently they are satisfied with pains and pleasures destiny seems to contrive for each one of them. But we know no one is happy. How can one be? Source of happiness is oneself, but one is oblivious of one's true  Atma-swarupa , and is lost in this sorrowful , transient world. Sri Bhagwan's Atma-vichara has the potency to rouse one from the deep slumber and usher in dawn of enlightenment. In the state of ignorance, one is so sure of one's identity as a anil or a sunil or myriad names and forms, and remains indifferent to one's own reality. But if one, due to His Grace, asks the ultimate question 'Who Am I?', first it creates existential doubt as to who one really is, as happened in the case of the confirmed atheist above, in a matter of few hours or a few days. When such confusion as to one's true swarupa happens, questioning will be intense and profound, and  with Grace and perseverance, becomes spontaneous and automatic, and one thus ascends in sadhana of the Atma-vichara  gradually, from confusion to clarity, from clarity to experience, and from experience to Self-abidance, to Knowledge, Peace and Perennial Happiness !  When thus Grace and effort combine, what cannot be achieved?

Thanks very much.
Pranam,
  Anil             
« Last Edit: December 08, 2014, 10:58:43 AM by eranilkumarsinha »

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4006 on: December 08, 2014, 04:43:55 PM »
I hunt for the golden stag


I hunt for the golden stag.
You may smile, my friends,
but I pursue the vision that eludes me.
I run across hills and dales,
I wander through nameless lands,
because I am hunting for the golden stag.
You come and buy in the market
and go back to your homes laden with goods,
but the spell of the homeless winds has touched me
I know not when and where.
I have no care in my heart; all my belongings
I have left far behind me.
I run across hills and dales,
I wander through nameless lands --
because I am hunting for the golden stag.

Sri Rabindranath Tagore


eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4007 on: December 09, 2014, 09:54:54 AM »
"He is the elixir of Vedas, brilliant with various ingenious ideas;- He elucidated the teachings of Vedanta alone."
Sri Ramana Gita, Ch. 18, V. 16



Bhagwan Ramana demonstrated through His austere living that the highest state of Brahman was nothing but the 'I-I' in every one of us. The loftiest ideal felt as 'reserved' for the purest in spiritual attainments was thus brought to the immediate grasp of the lowliest ! How to experience this 'I-I', the ultimate Truth? Bhagwan said the way was to abide in the Heart. He showed the way too: the path to merge in the Heart--'Who am I?', that is self-enquiry. He ever lived in that state of Pure 'I-I'. His daily life of simplicity, spontaneity and perfection was only an outward reflection of the inner Glory. 

It happened many years ago. The Sringeri Sankaracharya was then His Holiness Sri Narasimha Bharati Swami. A young man from Chidambaram well versed in Sanskrit, wished to study Vedanta under His Holiness. Though he had intended to stop teaching, as a special case, he agreed to teach this aspiring pupil. Once, at the end of a session of highest Vedantic teaching, The Acharya was pleased to pay the following tributes to Bhagwan Ramana, then known as Brahmana Swami, and whom he affectionately referred to as the Bala Yogi of Arunachala. He said, "We sturdy scriptures and commentaries, but they are secondary. The main thing is one?s spiritual ripeness. One who is already spiritually evolved need not go through the scriptures and commentaries on them. Such a one gets illumined in a flash without their aids. The Bala Yogi of Arunachala is an instance here." The student was stunned to hear such profound appreciation of Ramana from the lips of his venerable Master, the great Acharya of Sringeri!
Source: Purushottama Ramana, Sri V. Ganesan






Dear Devotees,

Herein lies the greatness of Supreme Bhagwan Sri Ramana! He demonstrated unerringly, by Precepts and Examples, that the highest Vedantic Ideal "I am That" which was taught previously to the purest in spiritual attainment was, by His Grace and Compassion, brought within the grasp of ordinary mortal, like me and His countless devotees who besides being  house-holders were steeped deeply in the ways of the world. He revealed, and demonstrated  with perfect clarity, without any ambiguity whatever,  like in science, that Brahman or the True Self, or the Existence-Consciousness, or Satchidananda, is nothing but 'I-I' in every one of us.  Not only that, He revealed and enjoined a  Direct Path to It, and thus showed a Way too. He taught that the Way to experience the Ultimate Truth behind our existence , that is 'I-I', is to  reach the Heart enquiring  'Who am I?', merging in the Heart, and abiding in the Heart. He thus brought the highest Vedantic Truth within the grasp of everyone, for no one can say that one is unaware of his existence, that one is not acquainted with the subjective awareness of oneself.  We must remember that even in the state of ignorance, Existence-Consciousness is not fully veiled ! 

Thanks very much.
Pranam,
  Anil
 
« Last Edit: December 09, 2014, 09:59:05 AM by eranilkumarsinha »

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4008 on: December 09, 2014, 04:41:28 PM »
An excerpt from the editorial of the Mountain Path, July, 2013:


Bhagavan is an intimate, caring, tender friend but he is also a lion who is implacable in the face of deceit. Make no mistake-- it would be foolish of us to take him for granted or to confuse him with a historical personage. We will not find Bhagavan external to our self.
Bhagavan is not in a statue or a lingam or a photo. These are aids to help us focus, nothing more. Once he was a historical figure but not now--he isn't bound by any concepts we may cultivate. He is a force, a stream of consciousness and much like the measured tides of the ocean his authority is impersonal as it washes over us with benign intent or cool refusal to be deceived by our false pretences. We approach him with a receptive mind and a trusting heart. If we don't it is impossible for us to receive that unmistakable flow of grace that heals and enlightens. Bhagavan by definition does not withhold grace, it is we who waver on the banks of a perennial river of grace. "He lays no great burden upon us; a little remembrance of Him from time to time; a little adoration; sometimes to pray for His grace, sometimes to offer Him our sorrows, and sometimes to offer Him thanks for the benefits He has given us and still gives us, in the midst of our troubles....the least remembrance will always be acceptable to Him. You need not cry very loud; He is nearer than you think."




Quote: "He lays no great burden upon us; a little remembrance of Him
from time to time; a little adoration; sometimes to pray for His grace, sometimes to offer Him our sorrows, and sometimes to offer Him thanks for the benefits He has given us and still gives us, in the midst of our troubles...the least remembrance will always be acceptable
to Him. You need not cry very loud; He is nearer than you think."


Dear devotees, the quote above reminds me of the 'Practice of the Presence of God' and our dear Brother Sri Lawrence.

Pranam,
 Anil

« Last Edit: December 09, 2014, 04:46:20 PM by eranilkumarsinha »

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4009 on: December 09, 2014, 05:26:30 PM »
"What is seen is not the Truth
What is cannot be said
Trust comes not without seeing
Nor understanding without words
The wise comprehends with knowledge
To the ignorant it is but a wonder
Some worship the formless God
Some worship his various forms
In what way He is beyond these attributes
Only the Knower knows
That music cannot be written
How can then be the notes
Say Kabir, awareness alone will overcome illusion."

Sage Sri Kabir



Awareness alone will overcome illusion. That Awareness is only the Self-Awareness. Anil



Ravi.N

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4010 on: December 10, 2014, 06:46:46 AM »
anil,

Quote
Once he was a historical figure but not now--he isn't bound by any concepts we may cultivate.


I find the whole passage a mixed bag-Wonder who wrote that editorial.

Quote
"He lays no great burden upon us; a little remembrance of Him
from time to time; a little adoration; sometimes to pray for His grace, sometimes to offer Him our sorrows, and sometimes to offer Him thanks for the benefits He has given us and still gives us, in the midst of our troubles...the least remembrance will always be acceptable to Him. You need not cry very loud; He is nearer than you think."

Dear devotees, the quote above reminds me of the 'Practice of the Presence of God' and our dear Brother Sri Lawrence
.

It is indeed a quote from Brother Lawrence only.

Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4011 on: December 10, 2014, 06:50:33 AM »
Friends,
Here is a classic verse from sage Tirumoolar's Tirumanthiram:

தெளிவு குருவின் திருமேனி காண்டல்
தெளிவு குருவின் திருநாமஞ் செப்பல்
தெளிவு குருவின் திருவார்த்தை கேட்டல்
தெளிவு குருவுரு சிந்தித்தல் தானே.

theLivu guruvin thirumEni kANDal
theLivu guruvin thirunAmam ceppal
theLivu guruvin thiruvArththai kETTal
theLivu guruvuru cinthiththal thAnE.

Clarity is seeing the holy Body of guru;
Clarity is saying the holy Name of guru;
Clarity is listening to the holy Words of guru;
Clarity is contemplating on the holy Form of guru.

Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4012 on: December 10, 2014, 07:05:59 AM »
anil/friends,

Quote
Bhagavan is not in a statue or a lingam or a photo..... Once he was a historical figure but not now--he isn't bound by any concepts we may cultivate.

Bhagavan is not the statue or a lingam or a photo but he is very much in the statue or lingam or a photo.If this is not so,they will not  be worshipping the Lingam or do abhishekam to the Lingam in Sri Bhagavan's samadhi.
It is very clear that the one who wrote the editorial has a christian background and is bringing that baggage into his writings.

In one of his talks,an earnest devotee (I am not mentioning his name) cautioned:Do not read two journals-Spiritual magazines and Medical journal!(Ofcourse he only cautioned against the half truths and immature nature of the articles featured therein).

Namaskar.

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4013 on: December 10, 2014, 06:04:08 PM »
Quote:
"Bhagavan is not the statue or a lingam or a photo but he is very much in the statue or lingam or a photo.If this is not so,they will not be worshipping the Lingam or do abhishekam to the Lingam in Sri Bhagavan's samadhi."



Dear Sri Ravi,

We all know that Bhagwan is here, there and everywhere. But, all the same, ji, yes, in our present state, He is more accessible to us in Sri Ramanasramam than anywhere else; He is present in everything, but His Presence is more palpable when one gazes at Him in graced photographs. However, it is also true that one is more at peace with oneself when one experiences His Presence in one's heart, as Pure Awareness, as ones own Real Self, as the True 'I'.

Dear Sri Ravi Bhai Saheb, I am not perturbed over what the Hon'able Editor wrote, in the Mountain Path, regarding Sri Bhagwan's Presence in a statue or a Lingam. I feel that this is not a subject-matter of debate. I feel that one's understanding or outlook, in such spiritual matter, is according to one's level of maturity, and eventually, Unity alone prevails. However, what attracted my attention in the editorial was the quote,       

"He lays no great burden upon us; a little remembrance of Him
from time to time; a little adoration; sometimes to pray for His grace, sometimes to offer Him our sorrows, and sometimes to offer Him thanks for the benefits He has given us and still gives us, in the midst of our troubles...the least remembrance will always be acceptable to Him. You need not cry very loud; He is nearer than you think."


reading which I was very happy, and which indeed reminded me of our great Brother, dear Sri Lawrence, thanks to you.


Last but not the least, thanks very much, dear Sir, for posting the Classic Verse of Sage Sri Tirumoolar from Tirumanthiram, the essence of which is that upon which I always contemplate, irrespective of the fact that my heart and soul is in the Enquiry:

Clarity is seeing the holy Body of guru;
Clarity is saying the holy Name of guru;
Clarity is listening to the holy Words of guru;
Clarity is contemplating on the holy Form of guru.

Pranam,
  Anil

« Last Edit: December 10, 2014, 06:07:31 PM by eranilkumarsinha »

cefnbrithdir

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4014 on: December 10, 2014, 06:53:35 PM »


Dear Sri Anil and Sri Ravi

Did Bhagavan ever speak of Parabrahman or of something with an equivalent meaning?

How would Bhagavan have replied to the question that everything in consciousness is still  a manifestation. Would there not be  a source of consciousness which is quite unmanifest ? This would be completely 'nirguna' whilst  'nirguna' and 'saguna' that is applied to what is in consciousness may be useful but seems different.

I am reverting to my previous confusion over "I am" and "I-I" which despite an expression of Oneness (in consciousness) still seems  to be a manifestation. It also conveys knowledge (jnana) but  will not knowledge, however exalted, still ultimately  be separative from an absolute unity/an absolute source ?

In St John's Gospel " I am " is the Son "through whom everything that came into being came into being" ( I am not using the word "create" and but neither did the writer of this Gospel ! ) and this is so out of time. The "grace" and "glory" of the Son can be seen and known in Jesus, Bhagavan and all  others who are in complete unity/Oneness with the 'Truth'.
They may have for a time been in human form and then formless within consciousness.

But there is also the "Father"  "whom no one has ever seen" ( using the word "see" in very similar way to that meant by "jnana"). But the "Father" is made known through the "Son" and we become One with the Father through becoming "One" with the "Son". This may be  written in terms of the "jiva" -  but it is also true and what makes this 'economy' possible is that  the light enlightens all men and we all came into consciousness "born of God".

So I think my original question  could be put  another way which is  'How does  the "Father" come into Bhagavan's teaching ?'

With many thanks

Ravi.N

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4015 on: December 10, 2014, 06:57:42 PM »
Anilbhai,
Yes,I do not have any issue with the editor's personal beliefs-only when one is contributing something to a spiritual magazine that has a wide circulation and more so as an editor,this involves tremendous responsibility.What is written should make sense and tally with the teachings of the Great ones and not contradict it.It has to tally with what is practiced in the asramam.
Magazines have to bring out issues at regular intervals and there is a pressure to fill in the pages.They solicit articles from all and sundry.I have always felt that rather than reeling off something out of sheer fancy,it is better to bring out the teachings of the great ones,reminiscences,etc. Even repetition of such articles is okay.This is true of not just the mountain path but most other such spiritual magazines as well.
Namaskar.

Ravi.N

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4016 on: December 11, 2014, 07:45:29 AM »
cefnbrithdir,

You have asked:

Quote
Did Bhagavan ever speak of Parabrahman or of something with an equivalent meaning?

yes,in the appalam song he refers to Brahman.I give here the final verse :

In the Infinite Frying pan of Mauna Mudra
Heated by Jnana  fire -The Pure Ghee of Brahman;
In this, Deep Fry the 'I' as 'That'

To Revel Forever - The Self as The Self.... This Tanmaya ....appalam ittu paaru(Refrain)

Once something is deep fried ,it can never revert to its former status.The 'I' is fried to 'That'.Sri Bhagavan refers to 'pure Ghee' -this is called Gritham in the vedas and is a symbol for supreme clarity.

You have asked several questions and I may not have the time (also inclination!)to go into it.I will only comment on one statement of yours.

Quote
They may have for a time been in human form and then formless within consciousness

This is how we may view them,but from the perspective of the jnani it is totally different.Here is an excerpt from The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna:

Quote
MASTER (smiling, to Narendra): "Well, what do you think of me?"
NARENDRA: "You are a hero, a handmaid of God, and everything else."
These words fill Sri Ramakrishna with divine emotion. He places his hand on his heart and is about to say something.
He says to Narendra and the other devotees:
"I see that all things-everything that exist-have come from this."
He asks Narendra by a sign, "What did you understand?"
NARENDRA: "All created objects have come from you."
The Master's face beams with joy. He says to Rakhal, "Did you hear what he said?"

Sri Ramakrishna used to put this question to many of his disciples and this way guage their understanding of Truth,particularly whether they look upon him as just a person or as the Reality itself.

The Jnani sees every manifest thing within himself.He never identifies with his body or any form.Whether these manifestations are there or not there,he is ever identified with undifferentiated Truth.

This undifferentiated Truth is something that no one has been in a position to describe as 'this' or 'that' or beyond both-All these are just words or terminologies.This is how Sri Ramakrishna puts it:
Brahman cannot be expressed in words
"What Brahman is cannot he described. All things in the world - the Vedas, the Puranas, the Tantras, the six systems of philosophy - have been defiled, like food that has been touched by the tongue, for they have been read or uttered by the tongue. Only one thing has not been defiled in this way, and that is Brahman. No one has ever been able to say what Brahman is."
VIDYASAGAR (to his friends): "Oh! That is a remarkable statement. I have learnt
something new today."
MASTER: "A man had two sons. The father sent them to a preceptor to learn the Knowledge of Brahman. After a few years they returned from their preceptor's house and bowed low before their father. Wanting to measure the depth of their knowledge of Brahman, he first questioned the older of the two boys. 'My child,' he said, 'You have studied all the scriptures. Now tell me, what is the nature of Brahman?' The boy began to explain Brahman by reciting various texts from the Vedas. The father did not say anything. Then he asked the younger son the same question. But the boy remained silent and stood with eyes cast down. No word escaped his lips. The father was pleased and said to him: 'My child, you have understood a little of Brahman. What It is cannot be expressed in words.'

In verse 5 of Sri Arunachala pathikam,Sri Bhagavan mentions this very state.

More later...

Namaskar.



Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4017 on: December 11, 2014, 05:19:26 PM »
Dear cfenbrithir,

Sri Bhagavan in His stray verse has mentioned Paramathman. The following is that stray verse:


அரியாதி இதர சீவரது அக வாரிச குகையில்
அறிவாய் ரமி பரமாத்துமன் அருணாசல ரமணன்
பரிவால் உளம் உறுகா நல பரன் ஆர்ந்திடு குகை ஆர்ந்து
அ|றிவாம் விழி திறாவா நிசம் அறிவாய் அது வெளியாம்.

Arunachala Siva.

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4018 on: December 11, 2014, 06:22:22 PM »
Dear Sri cefnbrithdir,

Q.N. 1
"How would Bhagavan have replied to the question that everything in consciousness is still a manifestation. Would there not be a source of consciousness which is quite unmanifest ? This would be completely 'nirguna' whilst 'nirguna' and 'saguna' that is applied to what is in consciousness may be useful but seems different."

Q. N.2
"I am reverting to my previous confusion over "I am" and "I-I" which despite an expression of Oneness (in consciousness) still seems to be a manifestation. It also conveys knowledge (jnana) but will not knowledge, however exalted, still ultimately be separative from an absolute unity/an absolute source ?"




Dear Friend, the above two are quite valid and profound questions, related with Sri Bhagwan's Teachings, and for one who is walking the Path shown by Him, these questions will sure arise, sometime or later. I just saw your questions and became very happy, dear friend, that such questions are now arising in your mind. For, after such confusion, clarity and experience are sure to come your way. I have just returned from hectic activities to myself and I wish to respond to your profound questions, sometime on Sunday, when I will have ample free time to form my response. However, I wish to give you some clue through which, hopefully, you yourself would find the answer to your questions. 

Dear Sri cefnbrithdir, Absolute Reality is That which Is. It alone exists, unconditioned by space and time, and three states, that is our states of waking, dream and sleep. You may remember that Sri Bhagwan has taught that Self is Pure Consciousness in deep sleep state, during the transition period from the deep sleep state to waking state, Self manifests as Aham or 'I' or 'I-I', without 'idam' or this, and therefore it is pure. Sri Bhagwan has taught that this Pure Aham alone is the gateway to the Absolute Reality. This is also the Point of Convergence of all paths. Now, this Pure 'Aham' or 'I' or 'I-I' evolves or manifests as aham 'I' or the ego and 'idam' (this), in the waking state. Brahman or Absolute Reality or the Self cannot be apprehended as It is as It always Is, as in deep sleep. The Self is Pure Consciousness in deep sleep but has any become enlightened during deep sleep state? Brahman or the Self manifests as Aham or 'I' (pure )or 'I-I' without 'idam' or 'this' that it is possible to apprehend Brahman. Aham nama-abhawat. Therefore, It is the Gateway to Realisation of the Swarupa or the Self. Nevertheless, Aham or 'I' or 'I-I', obviously, is just prior to Absolute Reality, and this is the answer, I feel, to your main question. However, I would respond to your post, which contains many questions, adequately on Sunday.


Thanks very much, dear friend, Sri cefnbrithdir.
Pranam,
  Anil         

« Last Edit: December 11, 2014, 06:31:14 PM by eranilkumarsinha »

cefnbrithdir

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #4019 on: December 12, 2014, 12:01:45 AM »

Dear Sri Navi

Thank you for the reference to the Appalam song. I like 'That' and 'Thou art That' as a pointer  because it is so obviously an attempt on the impossible without any confusion of ego. The  story of the two sons works in a different way  and it is good to have had the verse from Sri Arunchala Pathikam highlighted.

 What you draw from your  excerpt from the Gospel of  Sri Ramakrishna I fully accept  - and in Johannine terms this is indeed the 'Son' who has all things within him including the 'Father'.

Thank you for your help.