Author Topic: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough  (Read 280881 times)

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #165 on: November 29, 2010, 11:01:50 AM »



Dear Anil,

Young or old, devotees of Bhagavan Ramana can always attain their
goals.  For some the devotion and faith comes about at very young
age and for others, it comes later.  Perhaps, only advantage is that
as one gets old, he invariably has got some ailments, and this if
properly understood, will help him to give up his body consciousness.

Bhagavan Ramana's direct devotees are a class by themselves.  Apart from seeing Him personally, they have also  heard His direct
teachings and have seen how He led His life for 54 years in
Tiruvannamalai.  But at the same time, the Presence is important
than the bodily form.  This, Bhagavan Himself, repeatedly told them.
There are today, many Bhagavan's devotees, who have come to Him
after 1950.  It is the Presence which has attracted them.

Perundurai or Tiru Perundurai is a village in Pudukottai district,
and there is a Siva temple.  It is here, Saint Manikkavachagar had
his first darshan of Siva, who came in the guise of a brahmin and
gave him pada-diksha, touch by the feet.  Saint Manikkavachagar
who was a Minister in Pandya Kingdom, left his job and went to several temples in Tamizh Nadu, and finally merged with Siva in
Chidambaram.  In between, there were many 'tests' for him.  He stood the pains and miseries of these tests.  Saint Manikkavachagar has written two groups of poems, one is Tiruvachakam, with about
550+ songs and then Tiru Kovaiyar, a continuous set of 400 poems.  Saint Manikkavachagar was to Siva, what Muruganar was to
Bhagavan Ramana.  Muruganar followed the style and pattern of
Saint Manikkavachagar's pomes in his works.

Estoerically Perundurai = Periya [Big] turai [Shore], means the
Heart, where the Self is realized, where the ego becomes quiescent and rests with the Self.     



Arunachala Siva.

ramanaduli

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #166 on: November 29, 2010, 02:58:52 PM »
Dear Subramaniyan ji,

Thank you for giving the meaning of Thruperundurai. For all these days, I thought, Thruperundurai means, the town which has a big shore that is why Manikkavachakar went to buy the horses. Now you explained the inner meaning of Thruperundurai.
All ego should reach and merge in the shore of aham i.e. "Self"

Ramanaduli

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #167 on: November 29, 2010, 05:05:19 PM »



Dear Ramanaduli,

In a way you are correct.  Tiruperundurai is a town in Pudukotta
District on the east coast of Tamizh Nadu.  This is actually near
the sea shore only.  Hence the name.  Pandya King, under whom
Saint Manikkavachagar [his original name was Tiruvadavurar, a man
who hailed from Tirvdavur near Madurai.], was a Minister, was asked to go to the eastern coast near Tiruperundurai, and buy some Arabic horses, that were coming in ships for sale.  But the saint was attracted by Siva who gave pada diksha.  Then, the saint changed his mind and started building a temple for Siva.  All the money held for buying horses were spent on this.  The king knew this through secret agents, brought the saint and imprisoned him.  Then Somasundara, Siva in Madurai came at the night and said that
money had not misused and the horses will come in a day or two, as he is the horse agent.  The saint was released.  The horses,
good Arabic breed came after 2 days and they were kept in the stable.  On the third night, the horses became jackals and broke open the stable and rushed here and there with howling sounds!  The Pandya King became doubly angry and he again imprisoned the saint.  He punished him by making him walk on the hot sands of summer Vaigai river which had no water, with hot bricks held on the head.  The saint put up with these ordeals and obeyed the King and hoping that Siva would do something.

Suddenly floods came in Vaigai and the banks were breached.  Every citizen was asked to fetch some baskets of sand and place it on the breached banks.  There was one Pittu Vani, an old lady selling Pittu i.e rice flour mixed with jaggery paste.  She was quite old and she could not do her portion of the job.  Siva appeared before her and told that he would do her portion of the job and asked Pittu as a collie.  The old lady did that.  Siva simply lied under a tree shade and slept.  The King came suddenly and asked the old Pittu Vani why she did not do her work.  She said one young boy was doing her work in proxy.  The king searched for the boy who was sleeping.  The king took his leather leash and hit him.  When the blow fell on the boy's back, everyone got the pain in Madurai including the king.  The king was wondering. Then Siva appeared before him and said: Please release the saint.  He is my devotee.  The breached banks of Vaigai river would be covered by my bhuta ganas this night.  Go back peacefully.  Then the King prostrated before Siva and also sought forgiveness of the saint.

Then the saint left Madurai and started visiting temples and sang the glories of Siva.  Unlike other Tevaram saints, he did not visit many places but only a few.  He sang Tiruvachakam and Tiru Koviyar on his way at various temples and Siva came as a brahmin and took notes of all the poems.  Then he reached Chidambaram.  There Siva told Anabhya Chozha to have the scripts and call the saint.  The Chozha King called the saint and next day at the sanctum sanctorum of Chidambaram temple, he prostrated before the saint and asked for the meanings of the poems.

The saint said looking at Nataraja:  Meaning.  The meaning and purport of all these poems is He.  He then merged with Siva Nataraja as a huge light.

The King then ordered the scripts to be written in gold plates and kept them underneath some steps, which even today you see, at the left entrance of Nataraja's inner sanctorum.



Arunachala Siva.                   

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #168 on: November 30, 2010, 06:23:44 AM »
DJear Sri Subramanian Sir, thank you so much for captivating narration of Sri Manikkavachakar's story. The tales of great Tamil sages like Sri Manivakkavachakar,Sri Jnana Sambandhar and Sri Appar are very cdptivating and inspiring. These and influence of Tevram has shaped the spiritual consciousness of the devotees from the time immemorial. Thank you so much,sir.I have temporarily lost access to computer due to field posting. At present I am trying to maintain the thread of discussion by the mobile net. Anil

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #169 on: November 30, 2010, 09:01:36 AM »



Dear Anil,

Bhagavan Ramana has narrated the stories of all four saints, i.e.
Tiru Jnana Sambandhar, Tiru Navukkarasar [otherwise called Appar,
since the first one who was a child-saint called the second one as
Father, Appa, in Tamizh], Sundaramurty Swami and Manikkavachagar
on different occasions in His conversations with the devotees.
He used to shed tears and stopped the stories in between on those
occasions.  Only a true Brahma Jnani can be an ardent devotee too.
Once He was narrating the story of Tiru Jnana Sambandhar and wept uncontrollably.  After sometime, He said, Is He not Siva's
son?....

Kavyakanta Ganapati Muni has said in Sri Ramana Gita:  He was
born as Tiru Jnana Sambandhar to spread bhakti marga, and then
as Kumarila Bhatta to spread karma marga, and now He is born
as Sri Ramana to spread jnana marga.  All the three are Skanda's
[Murugan's] avatara.

Sri Sankara in his Sri Soundarya Lahari has said:  O Mother!  Your
son Skanda has taken birth as Tiru Jnana Sambandha and has taken your breast milk.  Sambandha when he was three year old, and when he went to temple tank in Sirkazhi with his father, cried suddenly and Mother Uma came with Siva and gave her breast
milk.  He started singing songs on glories of Siva thereafter.



Arunachala Siva.   


eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #170 on: November 30, 2010, 06:37:05 PM »
   Dear Sir, Sri Bhagwan often narrated the tales of the four most famous saivite saints of the Periapuranam and often sobbed uncontrolably. He said that the devotion of Sri Sundramurthy to the Lord is that of a friend, of  Sri Manikkavachakkar that of the beloved, of  Sri Appar that of a servent and Sri Sambander that of a son. But sir, I wish to know whether the great saint and poet  Sri Thayumanavar is not one of the 63 saivite saints of the Periyapuranam? Sri Thayumanavar sang "Ego disappearing another I-I spontaneously manifests in full glory." Again, " Glory to Thee for enabling meto discuss so much and follow Thy words so far !" Regards, Anil.

soham3

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #171 on: November 30, 2010, 09:47:35 PM »
Where is the need for self-enquiry when you are already Brahman ?
O Divine, lead me to dizzy heights of sublimity & loftiness

Vladimir

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #172 on: November 30, 2010, 09:57:02 PM »
Quote
Where is the need for self-enquiry when you are already Brahman ?

If you're really convinced that you're Brahman, there's no need for anything.
Self-enqiry is a way to be convinced in it.

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #173 on: December 01, 2010, 07:14:07 AM »



Dear soham3, Vladimir,

Yes.  We are already Brahman, no doubt, but we do not realize
it.  Our eyes are okay.  But there is cataract which hides the eyes.
If the cataract, the growth of unwanted ego/thoughts are removed,
then our eyes become clear.  The eye-surgeon is the guru, who
removes the cataract.



Arunachala Siva.

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #174 on: December 01, 2010, 09:12:42 AM »
   Dear soham3, yes,whatever exists is Brahman alone whose nature in essence is pure consciousness. But we assign reality to the mind and its creation that we empirically know as the world amd even enjoy it little realising that it is mere shadow chasing. Non-duality is jnana,duality is samsara. If we can do away with duality, Brahman alone rdmains, and we discover ourselves to be that Brahmam. But to make this discovery  continuous effort is needed, as Sri Subramanian sir so beautifully ellaborated by the example of cataract in the eye. Eye surgeon is needed to remove the cataract of the ego. And that surgeon is the Guru. Thank you. Anil

eranilkumarsinha

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #175 on: December 01, 2010, 10:17:40 AM »
  Dear Sri Vladimir, I felt very happy indeed when I read your nice,beutiful and the very apt posts. Indeed, Self-enquiry and   the Surrender to the Sadguru, as Sri Bhawan revealed, are the only two adepuate and infallible means to be convinced in to the great and only truth that indeed we all are Brahman only. Thank you so much for a very nice post. Anil

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #176 on: December 01, 2010, 10:30:05 AM »



Dear srkudai,

Yes.  Only a true Brahmajnani can be an ardent bhakta.  Bhagavan
Ramana was once reading Tamizh Ramayanam.  He could not go
beyond a few pages.  He started shedding tears and kept the book
away.  Then He said:  I am wondering, how these people wrote
Ramayanam.

Whenever a scripture is written either Valmiki or
Vyasa or Kamban or Ehuthacchan had to 're-enact' the whole story,
they should have "the feelings" of Ravana or Kamsa or Duryodana,   whenever they wrote about Ramayana or Maha Bharatam.  This is very very difficult but at the same time, they had to do these, to depict the stories in language.  This is what Brahmasri Nochur Venkataraman says.

Bhagavan Ramana has said:  Bhakti is Jnana Matha.



Arunachala Siva. 
 

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #177 on: December 01, 2010, 10:37:18 AM »



Dear Anil,

Saint Tayumanavar's time is only 17th century.  He is not one of the
63 Saints.  Tayumanavar, Pattinathar, and KaNNudaiya VaLLalar
all came around 17th and 18th century.  Their works speak about
Advaitam. 

Saint Tayumanavar was a Siva devotee.  His guru was one Mouna
Guru, who never spoke anything!  He said:  "That religion which
teaches me the state where thoughts get killed, in Silence, is my
religion."  Bhagavan Ramana used to quote this on a few occasions.



Arunachala Siva.   

soham3

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #178 on: December 01, 2010, 11:49:08 AM »
Quote
Where is the need for self-enquiry when you are already Brahman ?

If you're really convinced that you're Brahman, there's no need for anything.
Self-enqiry is a way to be convinced in it.

Irrespective of whether you are convinced and know it or not of being Brahman, you are indeed Brahman. In view of this fact, you can do any thing including murder & rape or you need not do any thing including your social duties to family or personal duty of attending call of nature.
O Divine, lead me to dizzy heights of sublimity & loftiness

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #179 on: December 01, 2010, 01:29:53 PM »



How can the cataract be removed unless you go to an eye surgeon.
Because of cataract [mind, which includes desire, anger, greed, hate
all these do murders, rape etc.,.].  The eye surgeon will remove
your cataract.  He is the Guru and his process of surgery is the
self inquiry or self surrender.  Then there are no thoughts.  But without thoughts, how can one do family work, going to office etc.,?
These will be done by the chitta-suddhi, [clean eye without cataract] which confers you a pure mind with which you will do all these household, office and personal duties. A clean eye is the Wisdom insight which shall not go anywhere near murders, rapes and other evil deeds.



Arunachala Siva.