Author Topic: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough  (Read 758274 times)

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1245 on: August 06, 2011, 08:45:48 AM »
Dear Devotees,

There is no knowing the Self.  The Self in the only One what always is. But, at present, Its knowledge is seemingly obstructed and this obstruction is called ignorance. However, the Self Itself has nothing to do with either the ignorance or the knowledge. Sri Bhagwan says in the ‘Spiritual Instruction’ that these are mere accretions which must be cleared away, just as by removing water plants, water beneath is revealed; or clouds cleared in a cloudy weather, blazing sun is revealed. The Upanishad says that ‘The Knower of Brahman is the Brahman’. Therefore, there is no such thing as realising the Self as a separate entity, different from the Self. Seeing is Being, i.e. Real Me . ‘I am the Self. I truly exist always as the Self only. Nothing more can be predicated of the Self than that It exists’. This is said to be the paradox of Advaita. All that is required is to give up the erroneous thought that ‘I am the body’ and give up all external thoughts of non-Self. These very thoughts are accretions which must be cleared away so that the Sun of Jnana is revealed unobstructed.
Now, Sri Bhagwan says that ‘the self-enquiry is the one infallible means, the only direct one, to realise the unconditioned, absolute Being that you really are’. ‘Who am I ?’ is not be repeated like the mantra. It is more than the repetition of any mantra. The very purpose of the Self-enquiry is to focus the entire mind at its source. It is not an empty formula, as Sri Bhagwan said. In fact, seeking the source of the mind or the ego serves as the means of getting rid of all other thoughts. Does it not ? Attention remains fixed on finding the source. When a thought arises, Sri Bhagwan teaches to ask, “To whom it occurs?” “To me.” Rise of thought is certain indication that attention is broken. So, “To whom it occurs ? To me” is a contrivance, a device, designed by Sri Bhagwa, to win back the attention from the burgeoning and proliferating thoughts. However, as sadhana progresses one need not do it every time attention in by now that one is already deep in the sense of the first person.  Therefore, vigilance is the watch-word.  Now, attention remains only on the ‘sense of our being’, i.e. ‘I am’, free from thoughts. Gradually, Self-attention is spontaneous which leads to the Goal of its own accord. From here on, the Guru’s Grace takes over which alone on a propitious day confers Self-Realisation.

 Sri Bhagwan : ‘I’ casts of the illusion of ‘I’ and yet remains ‘I’. Such is the paradox of Self-Realisation. But the Realised do not see any paradox in it.
Yes, in Truth, there is no paradox. Where the  spurious ‘I’ ( ego, or the ‘I’-thought) disappears, there appears ‘I-I’ by Itself. This is Infinite ( Purnam).

AND STATE OF NON-EMERGENCE OF ‘I’ IS THE STATE OF BEING THAT, ABIDING AS THE SELF, OR ‘I-I’.

Dear devotees, unlike in other systems in which the Guru holds back some secret to reveal to his devotees at the time of initiation, there is nothing secret in the Method of Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan.
Sri Bhagwan : There is nothing more to be known than what you find in the books. No secret technique. It is all an open secret in this system.
                                                             P. 325, Day by Day with Bhagwan

Thank you,
  Anil





eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1246 on: August 06, 2011, 09:06:06 AM »
In my last post, re. 1284, last three lines of the first paragraph should read :

'However, as sadhana progresses one need not do it or repeat it every time the attention is broken.The moment one becomes aware of this loss of attention from the first person, one is so tuned in by now that as soon as one becomes aware of this loss of the Self-attention, one is already deep in the sense of his being, in the sense of the first person. Therefore, vigilance is the watch-word. Now, attention remains only on the sense of our being, i.e. 'I am', free from thoughts. Gradually, Self-attention is spontaneous which leads to the Goal of its own accord. From, here on, Guru's Grace takes over which alone on a propitious day confers Self-Realisation.

Thank you,
   Anil

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43564
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1247 on: August 06, 2011, 02:51:26 PM »


Dear Anil,

Yes. To bring back our attention to the Self within, may be difficult only
in the beginning. After some practice and with Sri Bhagavan's grace,
placing the attention towards the Self will become easier. Thereafter,
an occasional jumping mind and consequential thought can be easily
overcome.



Arunachala Siva.   

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1248 on: August 06, 2011, 04:01:21 PM »
Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

Ji, yes, you have very rightly mentioned that only in the beginning, transferring the attention from the thoughts to the thinker may be difficult because hidden thoughts will come to the surface due to the inherent vasanas or the mental tendencies. Sri Bhagwan says that it is only natural, otherwise, how else they would be destroyed ? Hence, the device "To whom ? to me. Who am I?" was desined  to hold the attention to the I-feeling in the beginning stage of the sadhana. At this stage attention to the I-feeling with effort is a mental activity. With repeated practice and attention on the I-ness, I-thought paves way for the subjective experience of mere being or 'I am' albeit for breif period. As practice matures this experience intensifies and becomes intermittent and even stays for a longer period. In this experience individuality and associated thoughts are absent. But I understand that this is not the goal itself, for residual mental tendencies causes the I-thought to rise again. And Self-Realisation is that State in which absolutely there is no I-thought. Repeated practice fermly establishes one in this experience. But Enquiry, after this stage is reached, is no longer a mental activity. And, therefore, mental effort is not necessary, for it may take away the attention from the awarenness of one's natural satate of being and may even prove counter-productive. However, the repeated experience of the awareness of one's own state of natural being destroys the remainig vasanas. So, Self reveals only when the effort ceases. From this, it can be understood why Self-Realisation is said to be being rather ther than doing, for Guru's Grace alone reveals It.

Thank you,
   Anil       

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43564
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1249 on: August 06, 2011, 04:28:27 PM »


Dear Anil,

That is why Sri Bhagavan has said that discrimination alone would be sufficient. When the mind
runs out to the world, it should be brought back with discrimination, stating that the world is not
the self. I am not the body, I am not the mind - contemplating on this truth is also discrimination.

This misery is not permanent. This happiness is not permanent. This pain is not permanent.
This pleasure is not permanent, only the Self is eternal and permanent.  This is also discrimination.



Arunachala Siva.     

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1250 on: August 06, 2011, 06:09:03 PM »
 Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

Ji. Yes, of the four essential qualifications, Sri Bhagwan lays emphasis only on discrimination as the essential pre-requisite for practicing Self-enquiry.
Transitory nature of the world and phenomena cannot be understood unless something permanent is held. There is the wrong identification of the Self with the body, mind senses etc. So, the Vedas teach to discard all these as not ‘I’ and remains silent. The Silence is eloquent and points out to the Real. Sri Bhagwan says that this can be done by holding on to the one which cannot be discarded.

But so far as I am concerned, neti-neti also culminates in Self-enquiry.
I am not the body.
I am not the mind.
I am not the senses.
I am not the prana.

If I am none of the above, WHO AM I ? As Sri Shivprakasham Pillai asked from Sri Bhagwan In 'Who am I ?'

Thank you so much, sir.

Regards,
  Anil

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43564
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1251 on: August 06, 2011, 07:00:09 PM »


Dear Anil,

 The,  'I', 'I', cannot be described excepting with the neti neti method.. When it is positively known
it is experiential and goes beyond description.  That is why Sri Bhagavan said that Self experience
can never be described.  Such a realized person, is like a thief who has been stung by scorpion
at midnight, in a house where he had gone to steal.  He can neither cry nor describe to the householders.  He has to simply put up with, of course, it is not pain, it is bliss.



Arunachala Siva.   

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1252 on: August 06, 2011, 08:08:05 PM »
"So, the Vedas teach to discard all these as not ‘I’ and remains silent. The Silence is eloquent and points out to the Real."

Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

Very nice, sir. This is exactly what I meant by the above lines, quoted here from my last post. The 'I-I' cannot be pointed out except by 'neti'. It cannot be described except by 'mouna Vyakhya' ( Discourse in Silence). "In a 'svyamvara' the maiden goes on saying 'no' to each one until she faces the man of her choice and then she looks downwards and remains silent." Her silence is eloquent and points out to the man of her choice in no ambiguous terms. Yes, Self-realisation is experiential and goes beyond description.

Thank you so much, sir.

Regards,
  Anil     

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1253 on: August 07, 2011, 08:10:50 AM »
Dear Devotees,

In the early stage of the Self-enquiry, it is necessary that one keeps the attention maintained on the thinker with efforts. But mind is certain to wander due to rise of thoughts in the early stages. Sri Bhagwan says that it is only natural and even desirable that hidden thoughts come to the surface from their hiding places. ‘How else will they be destroyed?’ So, the device, ‘To whom has this thought come ? To me. Who am I?’ Sri Bhagwan taught this contrivance so that one is able to keep on transferring the attention to the thinker himself from the thoughts in the initial stage of the sadhana of the Self-enquiry. In this way one learns to hold on to the feeling of ‘I’-ness or I-feeling as long as possible. This is holding on to the I-feeling with effort and the purpose is to remain continuously aware of this feeling.

Dear devotees, as has been aptly suggested by many able and competent devotees of Sri Bhagwan, in the early stages, Self-enquiry is a mental activity. For, in the beginning effort to keep the attention on the I-feeling is either of the form of a thought or a perception. It is still not completely the subjective experience of the I-feeling.  However, as the practice advances, with ceaseless practice with perseverance, one starts to experience the being, one starts to experience subjectively the feeling of I-ness as the natural and effortless state of mere being , albeit momentarily in the beginning. I-thought or the thinker merges in this subjective experience of the state of the natural being. The sense of individuality and the associated thoughts are absent for the time-being. But initially this experience is very short-lived indeed. However, with practice, duration and frequency of the experience increase. It gradually becomes easier to reach this state and maintain it. But, since I-thought at this stage has not been irreversibly destroyed, the experience of being is intermittent. Therefore, it is not Self-Realisation. Self-Realisation is that State in which I-thought does not rise again, in which absolutely there is no I-thought. We are aware that I- thought rises due to the presence of residual inherent vasanas (tendencies). However, repeated and frequent abidance in the natural state of being ‘I am’ destroys the remaining mental tendencies or vasanas completely. Sri Bhawan says that when one makes serious quest for the Self, the I-thought disappears and something else from the depth takes hold and that is not the ‘I’ which commenced the quest. That is the self, true import of ‘I’; no the ego, but the Supreme Being Itself. This is what is known as the Atma-Swarupa, or the final and irreversible State of Self-Realisation.
 Therefore, Self-enquiry is to abide in the Source of the aham vritti or the I-thought and become aware of one’s Natural State as opposed to the ‘I am not the body’ idea.

Dear devotees, Sri Bhagwan, in this context, often taught that one can put in effort up to a certain stage only. What is that stage ? SO LONG AS INNER AWARENESS OF I-FEELING HAS NOT BEEN FIRM OR EFFORTLESS, EFFORT IS NECESSARY. When in the final stages of the Self-enquiry, when one is established firmly in the awareness of his own being, further effort is not necessary and may prove even counter-productive. Why so ? Because effort in this higher stage may swerve the attention away from the experience of Natural Being.

Dear devotes, it follows from the above discussion that so long as the effort is required Self-enquiry is mental. But effort does not reveal the Self.  CESSATION OF EFFORT REVEALS THE SELF AND THEREFORE SELF-REALISATION IS NOT THE RESULT OF ANY ‘DOING’ BUT SIMPLY BEING.
                                                     To continue

Thank you,
   Anil           

Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43564
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1254 on: August 07, 2011, 01:37:08 PM »


Dear Anil,

Self enquiry is only Self attention. The Who am I? question should
not be converted into a mental exercise.  It is only probing into oneself,
enquiring into the "I" persistently by fixing attention only on the I-thought,
it sinks into its Source. One gets in direct touch with the inner Reality,
the Self, the "I"-"I".

The measure of seriousness and one pointedness with which one delves
within to be 'I am" is also the measure of how rewarding it will be.



Arunachala Siva.     
   

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1255 on: August 07, 2011, 03:38:24 PM »
“Dear devotees, as has been aptly suggested by many able and competent devotees of Sri Bhagwan, in the early stages, Self-enquiry is a mental activity. For, in the beginning effort to keep the attention on the I-feeling is either of the form of a thought or a perception.”
“Dear Anil,

Self enquiry is only Self attention. The Who am I? question should
not be converted into a mental exercise. It is only probing into oneself,
enquiring into the "I" persistently by fixing attention only on the I-thought,
it sinks into its Source. One gets in direct touch with the inner Reality,
the Self, the "I"-"I".

The measure of seriousness and one pointedness with which one delves
within to be 'I am" is also the measure of how rewarding it will be.



Arunachala Siva.”

Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

The Self-enquiry, as taught by Sri Bhagwan, should certainly not be converted in to a mental exercise. If ‘Who am I?’ question is converted into a mental exercise, it would not be of much value. It, indeed, is not a mental process.
What I simply meant to convey is that in the initial stages, when one begins to enquire into the source of thoughts, there is a perception of ‘I’ which is associated with a form, say a body.
Dear sir, broadly speaking, Self-enquiry starts from the ‘Who am I?’ question to the Realisation of Pure Self, but, nevertheless, Sri Bhagwan says :
‘It (to go on rejecting thoughts) may be a stepping stone. But really Vichara begins when you cling to your Self and are already off the mental movement, the thought waves.
Devotee : Then Vichra is not intellectual ?
Sri Bhagwan : No, it is antra vichra, inner quest. Holding the mind and investigating it is advised for a beginner.
                                                 P. 65, Be As You Are

Therefore, from the above discussion, it follows that real Vichra is not at all a mental exercise. Real Vichra begins when one is already of the metal movements, the thought waves. However, in the early stages, when Vichra has not gone ‘antra’ (inner), when one is fighting to be off the mental movement and thought-waves, one cannot, in my view, be completely free from the mental movement and perception. This is how I felt when I took up Self-enquiry some 7 years back. Then I had many doubts, now I have none. For, as the practice of the Enquiry progresses and one reaches the source and becomes aware of the natural state of being, one is effectively off the mental thoughts, movements and perceptions as well as the reflection. Real Vichra begins and that is the inner quest (antar vichra) Sri Bhagwan speaks of. This is not mental and effort can be put in thus far only.
“WHEN QUESTION OF IDENTITY (WHO AM I?) TAKES STRONG HOLD ONE CANNOT THINK OF OTHER THOUGHTS.
                                                         (to continue)

Thank you so much, sir.

Regards,
  Anil
     




Subramanian.R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 43564
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1256 on: August 07, 2011, 05:15:06 PM »


Dear Anil,

Once the Self attention becomes strong enough resulting in Self-
abidance, then no thoughts can arise. Sri Bhagavan used to say:
"You are all telling that you are not able to vanquish your thoughts.
I am saying that I am not able to bring about any thoughts!"

Then the question arises, as to how Sri Sankara and Sri Bhagavan
who were ever in Self abidance, could write poems etc.,  The answer is
given by Muruganar. "Such self realized Jnanis, when they write treatises
and slokas and poems, it is the Self which makes them do those things.

This is called Inspired outpourings of a Jnani.

Once, again, if a Jnani has understood that the Self within, then there
is no need to read any books either. When Kunju Swami said that he
would go to Tirukovilur Math, to study Vedanta, Sri Bhagavan laughed and
said: Now you will study Vedanta, then puranas, then tarka sastras....
Where is the end? Try to understand yourself first. Then all sastras even
without reading can be understood.  This is what Sri Bhagavan says in
Atma Vidya Kirtanam, Verse 3.  After listening to Sri Bhagavan's words,
Kunju Swami dropped the idea and forgot about it.

Today is Kunju Swami's Liberation Day.  He merged with Sri Bhagavan,
on 7th August 1992, at a ripe age of 95.  His book Living With Master,
is a wonderful collection of his experiences with Sri Bhagavan. It
came originally as a Tamizh book Enathu NinavugaL, my reminiscences.



Arunachala Siva.

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1257 on: August 07, 2011, 05:46:45 PM »
"Once the Self attention becomes strong enough resulting in Self-
abidance, then no thoughts can arise."

Dear Sri Subramanian Sir,

Ji. Yes. Thank you so much. When Self-attention becomes spontaneous and natural, nay, when only attention remains, one is free from the mental movement, free from the thoughts. This is, in my view, because when the mind is introverted through the Enquiry, vasanas become extinct. Awareness of and abidance in the Consciousness 'I Am', first intermittent, goes on becoming firm and effortless, and finally irreversible State of Self-Realisation is experienced.Then one understands that Realisation is not the result of any doing but simply 'Being'. So, Sri Bhagwan taught only 'Summa Iru' to some of the ripe devotees only.

It is very nice to know that today is Sri Kunju Swami's liberation day. There is no doubt that Sri swami was a great devotee and he seved Sri Bhagwan for a long time. I have read his book 'Living with The Master'. This is a very important book on Sri Bhagwan.

Regards,
  Anil   

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1258 on: August 08, 2011, 08:21:28 AM »
The second person and the third person,
manifesting as multiplicity,
appear after the first person,
the foremost of the foremost, arises.
When it disappears by knowing its source,
along with it, the other two
simultaneously vanish in that place.
The light of that source which then shines
Is the indivisible fullness
That is one’s own true form.
                                L. 425-28, Sri Ramana Puranam
(This idea is the same as taught by Si Bhagwan  in V.14 of the ULLadu Narpadu .)

For those whose compassionate gaze
is that which sees without seeing,
           through the glorious clarity
           in which the ‘I’, the form of the ego
           ceases to exist, 
           having become a prey to the Lord,
you are the comely vision of Siva Loka,
established as pure consciousness alone,
not only here but everywhere.
                                   L. 429-32, Ramana Puranam         

Thank you,
   Anil     

eranilkumarsinha

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3576
    • View Profile
Re: Self-enquiry as taught by Sri Bhagwan is enough
« Reply #1259 on: August 08, 2011, 08:44:26 AM »
Dear Devotees,

Sri Bhagwan says that ‘I am’ is the Realisation. To pursue the clue till Realisation is Vichara. Vichara is the process and the goal also. ‘I am’ is the goal and the final reality. To hold it with effort is Vichara, and when spontaneous and natural, it is Realisation.

‘I Am’ is the Self, or our Natural State of Being. But before we hold It, either with efforts or spontaneously and naturally, there are thoughts to be tackled.
Devotee : But you have often said that one must reject other thoughts. But when one begins the quest, the thoughts are endless. If one thought is rejected, another comes and there seems to be no end at all.
Sri Bhagwan : I do not say that you must go on rejecting thoughts. Cling to yourself, that is, to the I-thought. When your interest keeps you to that single idea, other thoughts will automatically get rejected and they will vanish.
Devotee : And so rejection of thoughts is not necessary ?
Sri Bhagwan : No. It may be necessary for a time or for some. You fancy that there is no end if one goes on rejecting every thought when it rises. It is not true, there is an end. If you are vigilant and make a stern effort to reject every thought when it rises you will soon find that you are going deeper and deeper into your inner self. At that level it is not necessary to make an effort to reject thoughts.
Devotee : Then it is possible to be without effort, without strain.
Sri Bhagwan : Not only that, it is impossible for you to make an effort beyond a certain extent.
Devotee : I want to be further enlightened. Should I try to make no effort at all ?
Sri Bhagwan : Here it is impossible for you to be without effort. When you go deeper, it is impossible for you to make any effort.
These are very important Statements of Sri Bhagwan regarding thoughts and which I have quoted here from the ’Sat Darshana Bhashya’ and Maharshi’s Gospel.

Dear devotees, the above quoted Statements of Sri Bhagwan leave no ambiguity with regard to rejection of thoughts by the means taught by Him. If one firmly and vigilantly makes stern effort to reject every thought when it rises, one soon enough finds that one is going deeper and deeper into one’s inner Self. One becomes aware of the ever-present ‘I am’, the Natural State of Being. And once this happens, Sri Bhagwan says that it is not necessary to make an effort to reject thoughts. All one then need do, at this level, is to abide and remain continuously aware of this State till the Self is revealed.

When by Enquiry one goes deeper, becomes aware of the inner feeling of mere being ‘I am’, and holds on to It, it is impossible to make effort at this level. ONE NEED NOT MAKE ANY EFFORT TO ABIDE IN THE NATURAL STATE. Ego-based life is unnatural and therefore requires mental effort to pretend to be what we are not though we may not be conscious of this fact. So, Sri Bhagwan says that here it is impossible to be without efforts and when one goes deeper and holds on to ‘I am’, it is impossible to make efforts. 

When mind is sufficiently introverted by enquiry into the source of the ego-mind, the vasanas become extinct. When there is no vasana, there is no desire, there is no thought; and therefore there is no rise of I-thought. Awareness and abidance in one’s natural state of being becomes effortless. One is off the mental movement and perception. This continued awareness and abidance, on a propitious day, results in Revelation of the Self.

Thank you,
    Anil