Author Topic: Ramana Maharshi about cosmogony in Vedas  (Read 2051 times)

ramana_maharshi

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Ramana Maharshi about cosmogony in Vedas
« on: May 04, 2010, 01:00:08 PM »
Q: What is the purpose of creation?

A: It is to give rise to this question. Investigate the answer to this question, and finally abide in the supreme or rather the primal source of all, the Self.
The investigation will resolve itself into a quest for the Self and it will cease only after the non-Self is sifted away and the Self realized in its purity and glory.

There may be any number of theories of creation. All of them extend outwardly. There will be no limit to them because time and space are unlimited. They are however only in the mind. If you see the mind,time and space are transcended and the Self is realized.

Creation is explained scientifically or logically to one's own satisfaction. But is there any finality about it? Such explanations are called krama-srishti [gradual creation]. On the other hand, drishti-srishti [simultaneous creation] is yugapat-srishti. Without the seer there are no objects seen. Find the seer and the creation is comprised in him. Why look outward and go on explaining the phenomena which are endless?

Q: The Vedas contain conflicting accounts of cosmogony. Ether is said to be the first creation in one place; vital energy (prana] in another place; something else in yet another; water in still another, and so on. How are these to be reconciled? Do not these impair the credibility of the Vedas?

A: Different seers saw different aspects of truth at different times each emphasising one view. Why do you worry about their conflicting statements? The essential aim of the Vedas is to teach us the nature of the imperishable atman and show us that we are that.

Q: I am satisfied with that portion.

A: Then treat all the rest as artha vada [auxiliary arguments] or expositions for the sake of the ignorant who seek to trace the genesis of things.

Major Chadwick was copying out the English translationof the Tamil Kaivalya Navaneetha, when he came across someof the technical terms in it which he had difficulty inunderstanding. He accordingly asked Bhagavan about them,and Bhagavan replied. “These portions deal with theories of creation. They are not essential because the real purpose of the scriptures is not to set forth such theories. They mention the theories casually, so that those readers who wish to, may take interest in them. The truth is that the world appears as a passing shadow in a flood of light. Light is necessary even to see the shadow. The shadow is not worth any special study, analysis or discussion. The purpose of the book is to deal with the Self and what is said about creation may be omitted for the present.”

Q: I form part of the creation and so remain dependent. I cannot solve the riddle of creation until I become independent. Yet I ask Sri Bhagavan, should he not answer the question for me?

A: Yes. It is Bhagavan that says, `Become independent and solve the riddle yourself. It is for you to do it.' Again, where are you now that you ask this question? Are you in the world, or is the world within you? You must admit that the world is not perceived in your sleep although you cannot deny your existence then. The world appears when you wake up. So where is it ? Clearly the world is your thought. Thoughts are your projections. The `I' is first created and then the world. The world is created by the `I' which in its turn rises up from the Self. The riddle of the creation of the world is thus solved if you solve the creation of the `I'. So I say, find your Self.

Again, does the world come and ask you `Why do "I" exist ? How was "I" created ?' It is you who ask the question. The questioner must establish the relationship between the world and himself. He must admit that the world is his own imagination. Who imagines it ? Let him again find the `I' and then the Self. Moreover, all the scientific and theological explanations do not harmonise. The diversities in such theories clearly show the uselessness of seeking such explanations. Such explanations are purely mental or intellectual and nothing more.

Still, all of them are true according to the standpoint of the individual. There is no creation in the state of realization. When one sees the world, one does not see oneself. When one sees the Self, the world is not seen. So see the Self and  realize that there has been no creation.

Sources:

1) http://www.beasyouare.info/beasyouare.pdf

2) The Teachings of BhagavanSri Ramana Maharshi in His Own Words Edited by: ARTHUR OSBORNE

Subramanian.R

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Re: Ramana Maharshi about cosmogony in Vedas
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2010, 02:49:17 PM »

Is it not something wondrous that not only today, but also in
Bhagavan Ramana's days in the Asramam, many many were
interested in the creation theories.  Somehow they were not able
to believe that the world is "a thought", stemming from the first
thought - viz., "I-thought".  But people are so much addicted to
mind-body complex and it becomes difficult to shake off this
thought and also the ideas about the world-creation and other
unnecessary theories.

Sometime Bhagavan Ramana gave some humorous replies:

Once someone asked Him:   Bhagavan!  Are there Indraloka and
Chandraloka etc.,?  Bhagavan Ramana said: "Yes.  If this world
is true, then Indra loka and Chandra loka are also true.  In such
lokas (worlds), someone would be sitting like me and a group
of people like you would also be sitting before me and listening
to my conversations with you.

Arunachala Siva. 

ramana_maharshi

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Re: Ramana Maharshi about cosmogony in Vedas
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2010, 02:52:22 PM »
Subramanian garu,

i agree.bhagavan's reply regarding indraloka and other worlds are amazing and he revealed the truth in simple way.

Hatsoff to our bhagavan ramana !!!!!!!!!!

Whole conversation goes like this.

Quote
31st January, 1946

Someone enquired of Bhagavan some time back, “People talk of Vaikunta, Kailasa, Indraloka, Chandraloka,etc. Do they really exist?”

Bhagavan replied, “Certainly. You can rest assured that they all exist.There also a Swami like me will be found seated on a couch and disciples will also be seated around him. They will ask something and he will say something in reply. Everything will be more or less like this.

What of that? If one sees Chandraloka, he will ask for Indraloka, and after Indraloka, Vaikunta and after Vaikunta,Kailasa, and so on, and the mind goes on wandering. Where is shanti? If shanti is required, the only correct method of securing it is by Self-enquiry. Through Self-enquiry Selfrealisation is possible.


If one realises the Self, one can see all these worlds within one’s self. The source of everything is one’s own Self, and if one realises the Self, one will not find anything different from the Self. Then these questions will not arise. There may or may not be a Vaikunta or a Kailasa but it is a fact that you are here, isn’t it? How are you here? Where are you? After you know about these things, you can think of all those worlds.”

Source: Letters from Sri Ramanasramam VOLUMES I, II & Letters from and Recollections of Sri Ramanasramam By SURI NAGAMMA Translated by D. S. SASTRI



matthias

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Re: Ramana Maharshi about cosmogony in Vedas
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2010, 03:08:26 PM »
there are a group of questions that the buddha never answered (they have a special name wich I dont remember now)

one is about the reality of the world

anotherone about the reality of the atman

he always kept still, there are different accounts of this.....when I read these stories, I always have the strong conviction that buddha and ramana are one in there realisation...




Subramanian.R

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Re: Ramana Maharshi about cosmogony in Vedas
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2010, 03:59:25 PM »

Yes.  Both the Buddha and Bhagavan Ramana never answered
excepting in some humorous ways about the world.  They were
repeatedly dinning at the ears that the world is a thought, the world
is a thought etc.,

As regards Atman, while the Buddha remained silent, Bhagavan Ramana said:  It cannot be described.  Be still and inquire and realize
it yourself.

Arunachala Siva.