Author Topic: Self-enquiry-Surrender  (Read 24616 times)

DRPVSSNRAJU

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Self-enquiry-Surrender
« on: August 20, 2008, 07:27:02 PM »
What is the role surrender in self-enquiry.
pvssnraju

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2008, 12:01:48 PM »
Dear Raju,  For people who are not having enought determination
to do Self Enquiry, Bhagavan suggested Surrender, the total
surrender, like the King who was about to place his right foot
on the right stirrup of the horse, and but asked to wait by
the Guru for next command!

Arunachala Siva.

nonduel

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2008, 04:04:42 PM »
Dear Raju-ji and Subramanian-ji,

I believe that surrender is much much more important than I used to think, In all the teaching of Sri Ramana. It goes hand in hand with bhavana.
Oh Arunachala, blazing fire of Jnana, in my heart I pray and think of Thee from afar, root out the ego, merging me in the Self.

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2008, 04:21:40 PM »
Dear non duel,  Absolutely correct.  Surrender is not an easy
joke.  We are all doing partial surrenders.  Total surrender is
as difficult as self-enquiry, but it opens the gateway to the Self.
By surrender, Bhagavan always meant - Surrender of the individual
soul - Atma Samarpana.  Surrender is the mother of self enquiry,
as devotion is mother of knowledge.  It is because of the Surrender,
the Grace of Guru flows or we become a fit vessel to the everflowing
Grace of Guru.

Arunachala Siva. 

DRPVSSNRAJU

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2008, 04:31:46 PM »
Dear nonduel,
                   You got it.Your understanding is supreme in this regard.If there is surrender there is subsidence of mental activity and self-enquiry is a cake walk.Many feel that surrender is not required in this path but nonsurrendered mind will not find it's source of "self"easily.If we are devoted to self
it's magnetic attraction pulls us inside and we easily posit in self because we love it.I feel that surrender and self-enquiry must go hand in hand
for best results and distractions will be less in whom there is surrender.
pvssnraju

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2008, 04:34:58 PM »
Dear Raju, your post, giving additional insights is really adding
ghee to the rice.

ArunachalaSiva.

nonduel

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2008, 05:18:07 PM »
Dear Raju-ji and Subramanian-ji,

And since we added some Garam Masala yesterday, the rice should be perfect.  ;D
Oh Arunachala, blazing fire of Jnana, in my heart I pray and think of Thee from afar, root out the ego, merging me in the Self.

DRPVSSNRAJU

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2008, 04:51:31 PM »
Dear srkudai,
                 Nicely said.I feel they are complimentary.
pvssnraju

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #8 on: August 22, 2008, 06:27:36 PM »
Dear srkudai and Raju, Both are complientary and do not
contradict each other.  But to think surrender is easier than
self-enquriy is not correct.

Arunachala Siva.

SANKAR

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #9 on: August 22, 2008, 09:40:02 PM »
Dear non duel,  Absolutely correct.  Surrender is not an easy
joke.  We are all doing partial surrenders.  Total surrender is
as difficult as self-enquiry, but it opens the gateway to the Self.
By surrender, Bhagavan always meant - Surrender of the individual
soul - Atma Samarpana.  Surrender is the mother of self enquiry,
as devotion is mother of knowledge.  It is because of the Surrender,
the Grace of Guru flows or we become a fit vessel to the everflowing
Grace of Guru.

Arunachala Siva. 

DEAR SIR

COULD YOU PLEASE EXPLAIN ME WHAT IS SURRENDER AND PARTIAL SURRENDER.

SIVA SIVA
KANNAN MEERA SANKAR

SANKAR

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2008, 05:47:01 AM »
Dear Sankar,
            :) If i may be allowed to explain that:
Partial surrender is where we take the help of a "thought" to surrender.

Complete Surrender is independent of thoughts.

Love!
Silence

THANK YOU SIR,

FIRSTLY WE ANNIHILATE THOUGHTS WITH THE "WHO AM I"INQUIRY / THOUGHT, FINALLY TO BECOME THOUGHTLESS.
IN COMPLETION OF INQUIRY ONLY TOTAL SURRENDER STAGE ONLY VISIBLE. HUM.

SO WHEN WE ARE REALISED WE ARE SURRENDERED  TO SELF WITHOUT FAILURE. HUM.

SIVA SIVA
SILENCE
KANNAN MEERA SANKAR

DRPVSSNRAJU

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2008, 09:27:16 AM »
Dear sankar,
                 In partial surrender still we want things to go according to our wish.There is trust in God but it is not complete.If everything
goes well it is ok,otherwise we will complain to him.Still there are reservations from our side.Still we believe in the ego to some extent
though we have devotion towards God.Thought is quite active in partial surrender.Whereas in complete surrender there is complete
submission of the ego to the God and whatever happens even if it looks negative to others he will accept it as a benediction.
In total surrender no other religious discipline is necessary because in the first step itself ego is sacrificed.Then what remains is contentless
mind with pure consciousness.
pvssnraju

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2008, 12:23:18 PM »
Dear srkudai,  We are always the Being.  But since we are all
the time doing the thinking and acting, we do not realize the
Self.  Bhagavan says "Stick to one thinking, Who am I? and banish
all other thinking. 

Dear Sankar and Raju,  Partial surrender is asking for the
cake and leaving the God after the cake is given.  Or shouting
at the God, if neem leaves are given instead of the cake!
Manikkavachagar says:- "We shall receive anything that
you give, O Siva, without thinking that, this is good and that is
bad."  (Tiruvachakam).  There is a beautiful English translation
by G.U. Pope, an English Jesuit Father, who came to Tamil Nadu,
to spread Christianity, during 19th century.  He was Bishop of
Tirunelveli Diocese in southern Tamil Nadu.  He learnt Tamil
and read many religious works in Tamil and he was immensely
attacted by Tiruvachakam.  Before he died, he asked his servant,
to read out a verse in Tiruvachakam and left the body!  The verse
is:  O Siva, the concorporate consort of the lady with eyes lke
split unripe mangoes!  You can call me to Your lotus feet or
throw me into hell, I do not know your idea.  I am sufering
like a shuttle which goes hither and thither in the weaving
machine!  O I shall be lost, I seek refuge in You."  (Decad on
surrender).  For people, who do not know already,  Muruganar's
Sri Ramana Sanndhi Murai - The Song of the Holy Presence,
is entirely based on Tiruvachakam, because what Manikkavachagar
is to Siva, Muruganar is to Bhagavan Ramana.  Muruganar's
Guru Vachaka Kovai, is again based on another poem of Manikka
Vachagar, called Tiru-Chitrambala-Kovaiyar.

Arunachala Siva.
     

nonduel

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2008, 06:45:31 PM »
Dear Subramanian-ji,

Quote:
""Dear srkudai,  We are always the Being.  But since we are all
the time doing the thinking and acting, we do not realize the
Self.  Bhagavan says "Stick to one thinking, Who am I? and banish
all other thinking.
""

This is really hitting the nail on the head!

So simple, yet we complicate it in an absurb way. This is why we sometime get into hot debate instead of trying to understand what the Self is saying. Reality cannot be convey through words. So when anyone writes about non-duality, he is writting with dual words, concepts. One has to tip-toe through the post to see the underlying meaning. Otherwise we can always correct a little something, and/or add to it because of the duality lenses we are seeing through.

It reminds me of Sri Nisargadatta. He didn't analyse, intellectually reflect and pounder on what his guru told him. He accepted, I AM THAT, and that was it! He dwelved on I AM for three years and realised the Self.

The biggest hurdle is this continuous thinking about difficulties, wanting to learn more, to understand more....while Reality is beyond knowledge.

I like Sri Ramana's...Does a man has to continously say he is a man to know he is a man?

We are already what we are trying to reach. We ARE THAT when we are STILL.

Sri Ramana has said repeatedly, that the most direct way to realisation was Self-Enquiry, self-Attention. Why complicate his most precious gift?

He also said "Self-Realise and THEN talk." 

Oh Arunachala, blazing fire of Jnana, in my heart I pray and think of Thee from afar, root out the ego, merging me in the Self.

Subramanian.R

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Re: Self-enquiry-Surrender
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2008, 08:03:34 PM »
My dear non duel, Yes.  Thoughts are the barrier.  As in the
pole-vault game, one has to keep the one long stick of Who am I?
and jump over the other thoughts, the horizontal stick!  Upanishads
say that the Brahman, the Self, is beyond the Vedic words, which
are unclean with saliva, because of mouthing the scriptures!

Arunachala Siva.