Author Topic: Annamalai Swami says ...  (Read 5478 times)

srkudai

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Annamalai Swami says ...
« on: November 03, 2009, 10:52:12 AM »
Conversations from Living by the words of Bhagavan

Clouds come and go in the sky but appearance and disappearance of the clouds does not affect the sky. Your real nature is like the sky, like space. just remain like the sky and let the thought-clouds come and go. if you cultivate this attitude of indifference towards the mind, gradually you will cease to identify with it.
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Subramanian.R

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #1 on: November 03, 2009, 11:41:23 AM »
Dear srkudai,

Very much yes.  Let thoughts come and go.  One day like
an empty fort, there wil not be any soldiers inside.  Then
the fort is ours.  Once there was a devotee who was sparingly
coming and seeing Bhagavan Ramana right from the Virupaksha
Cave days.  Everytime he used to ask:  "When can I come?  When
can I come (i.e permanently leaving the world)." Bhagavan
Ramana used to smile and reply:  "Yes, when the play is over,
when the play is over!"  The play did finally get over for him.
He came to Bhagavan Ramana permanently after 20 years!

Incidentally Annamalai Swami's Liberation day falls on 9th
November 2009.

Arunachala Siva.

amiatall

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2009, 12:11:38 PM »
sirs, but when one does inquiry then all thoughts disappear so if we inquiry non-stop then where is the question of thoughts?
please elaborate

amiatall

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2009, 05:35:28 PM »
Of course if someone calls you react but it is spontaneous: no thought in between the action: "oh he called ME and i should turn around". It just happens without any sense of doership. What i mean here is that i can do work WITH thoughts that i am doing this and that or i can do work WITHOUT thoughts (and with much much better results). Two situations:
1. I took the glass of water spontaneously without even being aware of it - it is spontaneous.
2. I thought i should take glass of water because i am thirsty - this is not spontaneous because some illusory entity/thinker THINKS it should take this or do that...

amiatall

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2009, 08:09:32 PM »
thank you.

saraskrishna

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2009, 08:20:10 PM »
Dear friend...  Yes, that is the fact.. if a mosquito bites you, your hand automatically reaches that spot and rubs. This is also because of a thought, a feeling is also a thought... !!!  self shall never be disturbed for it has no form !

it reminds me of Newton's 1st law while speaking of this, the law goes like 'Every object remains in its steady state unless an external force is acted on it and so gets disturbed'  thats what is happening with us too..  Self is always steady, it is mind that gets disturbed and moves away from self because of mind itself!

Dear Udai, your descriptions is wonderful.. You got a great skill, it is not easy to describe the thought pattern! Mind is really an amazing tool! we got to do a lot with that!!! One gets easily confused in this topic  :) All that we need is a guiding light to make us do the right thing.. and having come to Bagwan, we are already in that...

if "Naan Yaar?" is well understood.. nothing else would one want to know!


with love
Balasaraskrishna

S.Subramanian

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2009, 10:37:02 PM »
When attention is one with action there is no room for thoughts.  Action takes place only in the present tense and thoughts are about past or future.  Action is determined by the quality of the mind.  It is perfect when mind is pure (satva) and flawed when mind is clouded with thoughts (tamas).  Why should there be a shadow when there is only light?  Existence of shadow indicates the existence of obstruction of light.  Enquiry is not to be stopped till the mind is absolutely still.

nonduel

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2009, 07:16:04 PM »
Namaste,

Discussion on thoughts reappears regularly here, and Sri Ramana was very often asked questions on thoughts. I posted about this a little while back.

Quote:
If you sit with closed eyes and just relax, and then just notice the thoughts as they arrise, one finds that they sprout from "emptiness" by themselves. If you just notice them without interfering in any way, just being a witness to them, you will find that they surge and dissolve by themself. Then another thought surges and the cycle keeps repeating itself. The illusion is the belief that these thoughts are ourselves. They only appear on awareness, images on a screen.

In Sadhu Om's book "The Essence of Spiritual Practice" page 60 #203 :
"Though many crores of very important thoughts rise in one's heart, bliss can be enjoyed only when one rejects all of them and remains still, knowing that to be still is far more important than to continue attending to any thought whatsoever. Only by those earnest aspîrants who have clearly understood this truth, can real austere practice (tapas) be possible."

Page 55 # 188: " ...replied (Sri Ramana) to all the questions asked by His true disciples who had taken refuge in His Feet, "Doubt who is the doubter that asks these questions

Through all this...one only return his attention on the self It is normal that thoughts will surge more once sadhana is started, how could they be disolved otherwise?   Doubts is a thought!  Contemplating on who is the doubter, one realises that it is the mind. Thoughts originate from the memories in the mind, when I doubt, I am giving credence to a THOUGHT! Who is the witness perceiving the thought rising in consciousness? 

Love
Oh Arunachala, blazing fire of Jnana, in my heart I pray and think of Thee from afar, root out the ego, merging me in the Self.

S.Subramanian

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2009, 11:11:24 PM »
This is in response to reply # 10.
Following questions were raised:
1   Is there sensory perception when the mind is still?
2   Are thoughts about past or future?
3   Can there be action without thoughts?
4   Is there a satva state of mind where there are no thoughts?

Please consider my brief answers to the above.

1   Sensory perceptions are not because of thoughts but because of the consciousness behind thoughts.  In fact thoughts only obscure the perception.   Fewer the thoughts,   brighter the consciousness and better the perception.  Great inventions were made by scientists only in the stillness of the mind.
2   Thoughts are either reflections of past or imaginations of future.  When we are fully present there is no room for thoughts.  Because of thoughts we are caught in the mesh of time.
3   All bodily actions are performed by prana (the life energy) which arises from where thoughts also arise.  Action is perfect when our whole attention is focused on it.  Thoughts only distract us from action.  In emergency or dangerous situations (like fire accident, bike race, etc.,) there is only action.
4   Maharshi has said (in Talks) that there are no thoughts in pure satva mind.

Brain scans of people affected by mental disorders show poor consumption of glucose (energy) by brain.  More the thoughts, dimmer the perception and weaker the energy.   

amiatall

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #9 on: November 05, 2009, 01:32:35 AM »
What S.Subramanian said was how i understood the whole thought phenomena.

What Swamis says about thoughts is for practice purposes. It means - thoughts are there, but they are not you and they can't touch you, now you stay as you are, be still.
As one practices self-inquiry and goes much deeper - thought waves start to lose their grip and the result of this is: clarity, energy, stillness, sharpness - qualities of BEING.
I doubt that Ramana Maharshi had any sharp sense of a body, because the whole goal of practice is to destroy 'i am the body' idea which in result destroys focused awareness of a body-I-sense.
Realized one has few or no thoughts at all - it is a state where action springs spontaneously, it is called "where there is no thought between action and GOD". Now thoughts and actions are not separate.



Subramanian.R

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #10 on: November 05, 2009, 10:07:58 AM »
In a thoughtless-state of a Brahma Jnani, it is the Self which
does things including essential thinking.  Sri Sankara and
Bhagavan Ramana did exactly the same.

Arunachala Siva. 

Subramanian.R

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #11 on: November 05, 2009, 01:45:47 PM »
Dear srkudai,

Long time back, you raised a point if the Jnani is ever in
thoughtless state, how could Sri Sankara and Bhagavan
Ramana write all these poems.  I think I gave the same
answer.  Saiva Siddhantam says that upon union with Sivam,
the saints write poems through Siva.  This was proved by
the story that Nataraja wrote all the poems of Manikkavachagar
and when asked at the end, 'What is the meaning of all these
poems?',  the saint replied, pointing out Nataraja in the
Chidambaram Temple,  "The meaning of these poems is He,"
and disappeared into the sanctum sanctorum as a huge Light!

The saints and Jnanis serve as a medium for writing divine
poems.

Arunachala Siva.   

amiatall

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #12 on: November 05, 2009, 03:15:36 PM »
truly, this illusion of doer is so persistent...  >:(

S.Subramanian

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Re: Annamalai Swami says ...
« Reply #13 on: November 06, 2009, 09:45:32 PM »
In response to reply # 17 let me present the following:

The gods and the sages experience the Infinite continuously and
eternally, without their vision being obscured at any moment. Their
minds are surmised by the spectators to function; but in fact they
do not. Such surmise is due to the sense of individuality in those
who draw inferences. There is no mental function in the absence of
individuality. Individuality and mind functions are co-existent. The
one cannot remain without the other.

(from Talks with Sri Ramana Maharshi)
« Last Edit: November 07, 2009, 09:41:12 PM by S.Subramanian »