Author Topic: All of you people here  (Read 9308 times)

tradere

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All of you people here
« on: June 15, 2009, 07:13:54 AM »
I'm not unappreciative of your presence, your posts, or your friendly spirit...

But we are all just talking and repeating what we know...

If even one of you gained deep clarity, what a benefit that would be...

But instead, these endless speculations, repetitions, beliefs, assumptions, theories...

And have any of you bothered to find out?  Even if through faith, which would mean, complete faith... taking it all the way...

But you don't find out.  You just talk...

This whole pursuit has cost me dearly... my worldly life went from normal and enjoyable to one of significant depression and loss of contact with people because of an inability to relate...

I cannot even go up to another human being and really have a conversation anymore.  They are so blinded by thier minds... it's like talking to the same wall, over and over again.  They don't care.  Not only do they not care, they are happily doing everything they can to fortify that wall...

So what to do?  Shall I be brutal and ruthless and get what I want in the world?  Why not.  Isn't that better than being one of you and just repeating words?  If that's all I am, if that's as far as I can go, and I don't see why not if any of you good people haven't done better yourselves, then why shouldn't I?

And what, you will reply to me again with second hand quotes... because you have nothing of your own.

I'm not at troll.  I'm not attacking any of you.  I'm just at a horrible point in my life and I don't know what to do.

Nagaraj

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2009, 11:03:34 AM »
Dear Tradere,

I understand your views and thoughts, its something which most of us face as a part of evolution if that is what we may want to call it.

But, if you really stuck to your views, you wouldn't have come here  to this forum to write your views - Infact you have just done that what you didn't want to do.

The choice is yours. really, a honest opinion of mine would be, find out yourself, dabble with what you want to do, explore and find it out all yourself.

To be brutally honest, there is no answer outside of yourself. Find it out all by yourself alone.

By talking, repeating sharing anything to anybody at any place, one is just communicating with himself alone and no (Other) body else. There is no Other at all.

Infact, your post is a post to yourself and all responses that come eventually are your own.

These are your own questions and your own answers, views, posts, etc...

You seem to have hit the nail, just go further and see for yourself what is there! there is no answers here or from anybody! Seek the help of the Self alone!

These are my perspective which are yourself's. This post is again your own based on your own experiences and interpretations. I am not different from you, you are not different from me. I am you, you are I -

Jump into the abyss and see and check it out for yourself, there are no answers anywhere except from your Self alone.

Nagaraj
« Last Edit: June 15, 2009, 11:05:56 AM by Nagaraj »
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

matthias

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2009, 12:07:03 PM »
please see that your point of view is just a point of view...

what you said is very insulting, and it hurts to read it, but it is ok..

the people and the wall is your own projection...you have to see this, it is your own wall...

if you have a depression go to a genuine and good psychotherapist...I also do this to aid my spritual praxis...it is not a step back in this sense...if you feel that you want to go through this alone, then this is also a good experience, maybe you make the therapy later, or never....

I also faced such a crisis, I was totally in my own sphere, the people all seemed dumb, idiots, without the slightest knowledge, total stupidity...I was also there for some time, but just for a few month...maybe some sort of cleansing of society dirt...






Subramanian.R

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2009, 12:40:20 PM »
Dear traders,

I do not want anything than what is posted by matthias,
and Nagaraj.  If you love others, you are giving love to
you, if you dislike others, you are giving dislike to you.
There is no one other than You.  "In the end, there will
be time, when everything looks alike."  Not a quote from
Bhagavan Ramana but by T.S. Eliot!

Arunachala Siva.   

amiatall

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2009, 02:49:04 AM »
Hi there tradere,

I don't see how worldly life can interfere with spiritual path.
In your essay which is called "Victimization" it is clearly seen by yourself that you and others exist. You are the victim while surroundings and conditions makes you feel this and that. From my experience I know for sure that unless you clearly see that conditions does not make you depressed, but you yourself are pinching yourself, you wont be free, when you are free then self enquiry can happen. When mind is still then self enquiry happens by itself. While God lets everything to be, why can't we?

paul

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2009, 04:22:23 AM »
Hi tradere, its a fact that everyone in life is on a diffrent Spiritual path and by that I mean yearning for God, Self-enquiry, etc. In some the intensity is small in others is is large. Most people are not interested in a spiritual path, that makes them no lesser a person and so the majority of people you interact with  are not that interested in things spiritual. Most of them are good, honest and decent people who would be more than happy to converse about most things. It is needed for a sense of wellbeing.Thats where you need to start.

Most people on this forum are trying to practise Self-enquiry, what is wrong when we are not practsing it, talking about it and sharing expeiences.

Have you read Who Am I ? (Nan Yar).

Have you asked God for help.

Another point to note is that spiritual success is in the hands of God. Just because there is no apparent improvement doesn't mean its failure. There's lots of stories about the length of time it takes, others may wish to elaborate.

Philip Chirgwin told me to look at the sky. Why don't you go and have a look at it.

Paul

Subramanian.R

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2009, 10:33:09 AM »
Wherever you are, your mind is with you.  If you set right
your mind, any place of residence is okay.

Arunachala Siva. 

tradere

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2009, 10:58:22 PM »
Thank you for the replies.  What Nagaraj in particular said resonated with me.

There is no harm in discussing or talking.  We all have to pass the time somehow.  But you understand also how those people who are beyond discussing have stabilized further in what needs to happen.  Many of you replied and said things that might have been right, but is it an actual fact for any of you?  Do you actually see yourselves as not different from others?  You may have the idea, but I sincerely doubt you have the experience.  To speak about what one has seen directly is such a beautiful thing.  Second hand conversation is just repetition without understanding.  It may be of some value but it is limited. 

matthias

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2009, 11:55:50 AM »
yes indeed

what you say is right..

S.Subramanian

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2009, 11:07:42 PM »
If we are harmonious with our mind, we are in harmony with the external world also.

karthikeyan M

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2009, 01:54:42 AM »
I'm not unappreciative of your presence, your posts, or your friendly spirit...
We are not talking, it is Bhagavan Ramana who is with us and he is talking in this forum by using our bodies.

But we are all just talking and repeating what we know...
You say we are talking and repeating what we know?

I guess you know that scientist in Geneva are still trying to understand how the universe begin and evolved, spending billions of dollars and scientist all around the world are taking part in that experiment, but still Physics is incomplete, their cannot still find a unified theory that could explain everything. Have you read Prof. Stephen Hawking book 'Theory of Everything'

On the other side, spiritually speaking , In the book Spiritual stories as told by Bhagavan Ramana, in one of the stories, the sons of Brahma(hindu creator god) wanted to know answers for everything and they tried seeking it, Siva as Daskina Moorthy who appeared as sage and began answering their questions, then siva as Dashkina Moorthy realised that if he keeps on answering  their questions this will not stop, he(siva) become silence, then only the sons of Brahma realsied their ultimate answer for all their questions. Silence, remain silence is also told by Bhagavan Ramana.
Even if Bhagavan Ramana knows everything, he remains silence.

What we are talking is only limited knowledge that is given to us by the Lord, No one knows everything and not one knows nothing.

If even one of you gained deep clarity, what a benefit that would be...
Certainly nothing will we get from this forum, only if we apply it in our lives practically then we will come to know about that knowledge.

But instead, these endless speculations, repetitions, beliefs, assumptions, theories...
OK, i presume that you are a christian, do a in depth research on the lives on Saints, belief and miracles by Christ, ask yourself why is Christianity still exist today.

And have any of you bothered to find out?  Even if through faith, which would mean, complete faith... taking it all the way...
Realizating the self, yes.

But you don't find out.  You just talk...
You say we didn't find, find out what, what do you what to find, are the still 21st century Paul Brunton who wants to find a true yogi, a true master, he(20th century Paul Brunton) found one, have you? Read Paul Brunton's 'A search in secret India'

This whole pursuit has cost me dearly... my worldly life went from normal and enjoyable to one of significant depression and loss of contact with people because of an inability to relate...
Why even my life is the same, i ruined my life, i failed to realizes and accept the truth, I failed to worship what has to worshiped. Now I'm worshiping what has to be worshiped and not repeat the same mistake in this present(Ramana said when we cannot understand the present why need to understand the future)

I cannot even go up to another human being and really have a conversation anymore.  They are so blinded by thier minds... it's like talking to the same wall, over and over again.  They don't care.  Not only do they not care, they are happily doing everything they can to fortify that wall...
I repeat, its the same here too, but there is God, when the path is changed from good to bad, from realizing the true self, why do we need 'other'


amiatall

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #11 on: July 01, 2009, 05:21:57 PM »
Thank you for the replies.  What Nagaraj in particular said resonated with me.

There is no harm in discussing or talking.  We all have to pass the time somehow.  But you understand also how those people who are beyond discussing have stabilized further in what needs to happen.  Many of you replied and said things that might have been right, but is it an actual fact for any of you?  Do you actually see yourselves as not different from others?  You may have the idea, but I sincerely doubt you have the experience.  To speak about what one has seen directly is such a beautiful thing.  Second hand conversation is just repetition without understanding.  It may be of some value but it is limited. 

I am trying to see what are you trying to ask? but can't.
Why are you cencerned if anyone has an idea or has an experience? Everything will take care of itself.

Billions do like this nowadays, they talk about the talk ant not just talk. speculations, ideas, gossips arise about talks of talks of talks....
as thoughts arise about being, how to be, where to be, good be, bad be, correct be, not be why not just be?

Here we discuss and expand or contract in whatever direction one is suited. It is different from sitting and doubting whether whatever anyone has said is experienced by him or not.
Quote
But you understand also how those people who are beyond discussing have stabilized further in what needs to happen. 
No, i don't understand the "beyondness of discussing" because the discussing itself may be a need to happen between us. Or maybe nothing needs to happen in reality? it just happens.
Happy circling.

Sincerely,
Arvydas

Subramanian.R

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2009, 07:40:06 PM »
Dear amiatall,

Talking with another,  even if he has not experinced, helps.
Talking with an experienced Jnani helps a great deal.  The
first could be a disciple-disciple relationship and the second
is guru-disciple relationship.  During Bhagavan's time, apart
from Bhagavan Himself, various devotees were talking to
each other and got benefited in someway or other.  I had
been to Tiruvannamalai for four days from 30th June 2009
to today, 3rd July 2009 and had some mind blowing experiences when I talked to Brahmasri Nochur Venkatraman.  More details about him, please wait.  He is just 30, married and has got a  2 year old boy.  My talking with him for about 30 minutes, brought the world upside down!  Similarly I had talks with simple people like you and me, who come to Tiruvannamalai and spend 4 days  by talking to each other and then sitting before Bhagavan's
Samadhi silently!  If one has to wait for a realized Jnani to teach you, you won't get him quite easily.  Bogus Jnanis abound in this world of today.  The disciple-disciple talk helps, because they are of different grades and a "higher grade disciple" can always help a "lower grade disciple" and even VICE VERSA !   This vice versa, I knew in Tiruvannamlai and it blew my ego into millions of atoms.   The gentleman is an insider in the Asramam, doing a  lot of odd jobs.  Whenever he is free, he sits in the Samadhi Hall.  He talks a few words to others, when one sits next to him.  He explained to me what is total surrender like nobody in this Forum.  He has thoroughly read Aksharamana Malai and he gave new layers of meanings, for each line.  He says that one song wa was enough for him.  He did not read any other books of Bhagavan in detail.  He appears like a small spark but he can blow your entire stack of haystack in conflagration.  More about him later.  He says total surrender is enough for him
and there is no need to bother about self enquiry.  Bhagavan
Himself has said that they are two sides of the same coin.

Arunachala Siva.                   

karthikeyan M

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #13 on: July 05, 2009, 08:08:24 PM »
Dear Subramanian.R  sir,
You forgot to inform us about your travel to Arunachala.

matthias

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Re: All of you people here
« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2009, 10:36:07 PM »
please read the posts "darshan of the frozen fire"