Author Topic: Enlightenment and Saintliness  (Read 2962 times)

Subramanian.R

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Enlightenment and Saintliness
« on: June 12, 2009, 05:00:12 PM »
David Godman, in one of his talks with some Westerner has
said that it is quite rare to witness a person like Bhagavan
Ramana who is both enlightened and saintly. 

I also agree with him.  There are only two in my view where
both saintliness and enlightenment were together.  One is
Bhagavan Ramana and the other is Chandrasekhara Saraswati
of Kanchi Math.  Both were extraordinary.

There are many people who were enlightened but not
saintly, at least, in outward behaviour.  Seshadri Swamigal
and earlier Kaduveli Siddhar [about whom I wrote] were
such types.

There are many who are saintly in their disposition but not
self-enlightened.  There are numerous examples which I
do not want to quote here.

Arunachala Siva.   

mmohan

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Re: Enlightenment and Saintliness
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2009, 07:56:14 PM »
What is saintly? Where do you place Sri Ramakrishna?

Subramanian.R

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Re: Enlightenment and Saintliness
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2009, 08:05:58 PM »
SRK is no doubt enlightened.  But regarding his saintliness,
he was somewhere between Ramana and Seshadri Swami.
Certain of his practices were causing embarassment for
the devotees/rare visitors.  One should also conform to
the culture of the times, is it not?  Do not ask what is culture? Today saints are wearing trousers and T shirts.  They grow a long beard to look saintly.  They distribute their face engraved
lockets and bracelets.  They always keep a fire near their
seat as if they are effulgence itself.  But Ramana and Ramakrishna were not overstepping the culture of their
times.  Both tolerated casteism. Both did not wear tweed
trousers and coats. Remember British had already landed
in India during their times.

Arunachala Siva. 

ramanaduli

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Re: Enlightenment and Saintliness
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2009, 02:42:51 PM »
What about Avadutas like Sadasiva brahmendral.
In the same way, Sri Ananda Mayi ma. She got married in her early stage but she was enlightened. She was a saint even though she got married.
She came to have darshan of Bhagavan with Yogananda. There is a photograph of 3 holi people. But Bhagavan is exceptional. All others shed their
mortal body in different manner but there was no shooting star in the skay. We are this much fortunate to take birth in the same land of Bhagavan
of course Bhagavan does not have any terriory. He is everywhere.
They say while leaving this mortal body, it can be noticed how we lived in this life. The prana should go URDHUVA GATHI. I pray as Namazhlvar
AEIPENAI VANDHU NALIYUMPODU APPODHU NAN UNNAI NINAIKKAMATTEN, APPODHAIKKU IPPODHEY SOLIVAITHEN ARUNACHALANE, ENGAL RAMANA
BHAGAVANE

Ramanaduli

Subramanian.R

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Re: Enlightenment and Saintliness
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2009, 03:29:00 PM »
Dear Ramanaduli,

The need for chanting God's name is that it will always
be with us, become part of our thought, so that at death
he can chant that name and attain liberation.  Unless
one constantly practices the chanting during his healthy
years, it may be difficult.  Nammazhwar is noted for
such splendid songs.  One fellow had three sons.  They
and his wife were standing near the death bed.  The
wife says: Please say Narayana.  The old hag says: Please
wait.  He calls the first son to go and collect the dues from
a neigbour!  The wife says: Narayana.  That chap says:
Wait.  He calls the second son to go and pick up the rice
bags from the godown since it might rain!  The wife pursues
"Please say Narayana."  He calls the third son for some other
job.  Yama said:  "I gave you three chances.  You did not
listen.  Now let me do my job."  The old fellow died!

Arunachala Siva.   

ramanaduli

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Re: Enlightenment and Saintliness
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2009, 06:28:30 PM »
Dear Subramaniyan ji


But Ajamilan was very lucky. At the last moment he called his son, Narayana, and died. Duthas came from Vaikund and took him to Vaikund even though
he was a sinner. Same time duthas came from yamas, and not allowed to take Ajamilan but they were not allowed to take him as because he uttered
Narayana. They say God is that much kind and He always ready to shower His grace. Bhagavan Ramana also moved and shed tears when He was
narating the stories to His devotees. Here He himself is god and shed tears. Like Rama and Krishna how acted in their period.


Ramanaduli

Subramanian.R

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Re: Enlightenment and Saintliness
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2009, 06:48:57 PM »
Dear Ramanaduli,

Bhagavan Ramana has said:  "Grace is always there, ever
flowing.  But one should bring vessel to take it."  Vessel
here means a clear mind.  If the vessel is large, then the
Grace is also large.  If we take a small tumbler, we will
take only a tumbler-ful of Grace.  Muruganar and Kavyakanta
Ganapati Muni and others went with a very large vessel,
like the olden-day boilers.  Paul Brunton took a large vessel,
no doubt, but he dropped the nectar on the way!

Arunachala Siva.