Author Topic: On being serious  (Read 5598 times)

mmohan

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On being serious
« on: June 03, 2009, 05:46:33 PM »
It is said that a sadhak should look happy and carefree and that is the real sign that he is on the right path and progressing and not deceiving himself. If he is tensed, it means he is not either ready for it or else he is on the wrong path. My question is: would not all of us be tensed when we first turn to spirituality as it is a totally new path compared to the life we had led till then? I tend to be very serious and has had major problems with my relatives as they felt there is something very wrong with me. At least to hide our aspirations from our "near and dear" we should appear normal outside but that would be playing a double life.
Most household sadhaks has this predicament of having their feet in two boats - one in the world and one in sadhana. True, as Sri Ramakrishna said, we should keep our hands in society and head in God and that all work is to be treated as sadhana etc etc, but at least initially would we not need a dedicated conducive atmosphere to blossom? Your thoughts are most welcome.

Mohan

Subramanian.R

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #1 on: June 03, 2009, 05:55:36 PM »
Dear mmohan,

Yes.  Initially it is difficult, because your people say,
you are mad, you are different.  It becomes natural
after a while.  But a Brahma Jnani need not be ever
serious.  Once Sadhana is over, He is once again among
the poeple, not caring a bit.  Initially it is difficult to
wear a codpiece, people look at you with suspicion.
Thereafter, they get used to your codpiece, because
they are happy you are at least wearing a codpiece,
and not roam around naked.  Sadasiva Brahmendra
went around naked.  One Sultan, went behind him and
cut his hand, because he was walking near the harem.
Sadasiva picked up the severed hand and fixed it as if it
was a wrist watch! 

Arunachala Siva.

ramanaduli

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2009, 01:15:40 PM »
Dear mmohan ji

Yes we have to hide sometime from people who are not like us. Especially people do not pray or go to temple. They say, their work is worship
But after their work (in late night in IT field) they are not happy. I like to ask them if their work does not give them happy, how it can be called a worship.
Sometimes they ask me why I am doing puja? They ask when nothing is materialised what is the point of wasting the time. There is no answer to
these youngesters. I think it is my habit that I am worshiping.


Ramanaduli

Nagaraj

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2009, 03:41:13 PM »
The grinding happens, continues, and then finally, this phase has to vanish. I think it is inevitable. Yes it's tough to strike a balance between both. It means dispassion has arisen. its a position of neither here nor there. Eventually, through discrimination, dispassionate ones will permanently settle on the banks of the Self and will remain in Bliss as Blissful one among the mad world.

As long as one is putting effort (False Face) to show a happy face to near and dear ones, it means that we have not yet riped, hence we are facing this strife. But once we really cross the ocean we will no more require to show a happy face, for we are Happiness - Bliss!

Sri Ramana
« Last Edit: June 04, 2009, 03:42:49 PM by Nagaraj »
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

vinita

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2009, 11:34:25 AM »
Dear Mohan,

i too am a very serious person. seriousness is associated with gravity. gravity is associated with pulling one down. one of my initial issues with spirituality was that everyone talked of bliss, a feeling of lightness, freedom...whereas i felt very much tied down and far from bliss. ( i still feel the same way often)

this could have something to do with our limitations and how we deal with them. if ramakrishna said that let our hands be in this world but our head be with god, it is something to be practiced. we have to be a part of this world, doing actions, being involved in our duties. at the same time we should be able to rise above all this (have our head with god) while performing actions. there has to be total involvement and yet non-involvement. seriousness comes when we are involved and yet not non-involved. maybe i am not making sense. but what i wanted to say is that from consciousness of seriousness we can perhaps proceed towards bliss...

yes, seriously, self enquiry and sadhana is the key.

love,
vinita

munagala

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2009, 05:29:40 PM »
Dear Ramadudli,mohan,vinita,

Everyone in this world wants happiness/pleasures.

A materialist toils hard in pursuit of happiness and finally finds his happiness is limited and material this cause more pain than happiness. Yet he is unable to stop his pursuit as the mind is conditioned for pursuit of worldly things.

A spiritualist is also in pursuit of happniess which is permanent.

If anyone asks you "why are you wasting time in this poojas etc" ask them "what are they working for and what is the end goal?"

Why should we feel shy in what we do and believe? There will always be someone in our friends/relative circle who will ridicule us or brand us as useless, mental etc.

Let us not bother much about what others have to say.  If you read Bhagavan's life history, his mother begged Bhagavan to come back to worldly life. But Bhagavan was solid like a rock and his mother finally gave up and followed his way.

Regards,
Munagala

mmohan

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2009, 08:49:27 AM »
Dear all, thanks for all your insights. They are a great help. I feel that at the beginning stages of our spiritual journey we all tend to be a little bit serious,it is good that way, as the path is new and also we have a lot of our own mental blocks to overcome. But as we progress, the gravity should lighten, like when a airplane takes off, it moves slow at first and then once it zooms to the heights it can affort to cruise without much effort. The same way we can judge our progress by how much mentally lighter we are becoming and less dependant on the circumstances and people around us. As it is said the spiritual journey can be likened to train entering a tunnel and coming out into the open. The initial period would be full of confusion and fear and more darkness than before but if you persist, then we can all come out into the light and then the journey would be pleasurable.

Subramanian.R

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2009, 11:41:29 AM »
Dear mmohan,

These are four lines of a poem of Alexander Pope.

A little learning is a dangerous thing,
Drink deep or taste not the Pierian spring,
The initial dozes intoxicate the brain,
The succeding ones sober us again!

Arunachala Siva.

amiatall

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2009, 09:04:34 PM »
Up to my experience, seriousness comes when there is no thoughts at all, then there is this silence/void. There is no real emotional reaction to whatever goes around.
In the world of psychology this is called depression, but as far as i remember Ramana said it is most suitable situation/mood for starting self-enquiry...


Subramanian.R

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2009, 10:28:17 AM »
Dear amiatall,

I respect your views that one will be serious when all thoughts
cease.  But a thoughtless state need not be a serious state.
There are several Jnanis like Bhagavan Ramana, Sri Chandra-
sekara Saraswati of Kanchi, and Seshdri Swami, whose
photographs reveal that they have got a smiling and joyous
countenance.  Bhagavan Ramana's famous Welling Bust
photograph show that He is quite joyful and is smiling.

Arunachala Siva.

Nagaraj

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2009, 11:58:25 AM »
I don't understand what is being Serious? what is a serious state? If we are discussing some state, then its just some state, if its a sate, then its nature is only experiencing. why should we want to experience some state? I have seen, read people sharing their spiritual experiences and experiences of Samadhi, Bliss, etc... they don't realize that its false, its not real, whatever we experience is not real.

That which is beyond experience alone is real. Its all Mind play, Ego playing, Mind is still active trying to achieve its agenda of achieving some state, samadhi etc...

There is no Experience at all in "That" ('state' - I don't want to use this word here, but its inevitable for purposes of communication) To experience there should be 2, experiencer and experienced. If there is experience then there is duality and mind is feeding itself.

Detach from association with experience. Get back to the source and abide as Self. constant practice will relieve one from this. Mistaken Identity.

This is Thoughtless state. Experience is possible only when the mind is operating. If mind is operating its again a mistaken identity. and then one experiences various state. Spiritual, Non Spiritual, etc...

Nagaraj
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Subramanian.R

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2009, 01:02:32 PM »
Dear Nagaraj,

I was also thinking about this "experiencer" and the "experienced", for a long time.  This implies duality --
was my stand also.  We have heard and read that the
Self is Is.  The Self is one without second and the self
does not move, expereince etc., etc.,  Once during my
visit to Tiruvannamalai, I asked about this to one of the
permament inmates.  He immediately asked me to go
through the Invocatory Verse of Sri Ramana Ashottaram.
The Ashottaram has got one invocatory verse in Sanskrit
and two more Sanskrit verses as Benediction.  The latter
two have been made into Tamil by Bhagavan Himself.
The Invocatory Verse reads:

Arunachala hruthspoorthi swarupanugramatmane
Namo Bhagavate dhrashtre ramanaya nirantharam.

"Namaskarams to Sri Bhagavan Ramana, who is the Witness
for everything, in my heart continually, to Him, to who
is the Effulgence of Arunachala in Heart, as His nature
and grace.

Nature and Grace.... Grace is from His compassion.  Compassion is the nature of the Self.  The Self is the natural state of
Bhagavan Ramana who showers compassion.  I think here,
the compassion/grace is "the experienced."  The Self is
the "experiencer."  Both are in Heart.  It is also called
Sannidhi, Presence.  People say that Sugar cannot itself
taste its sweetness.  This is the Advaita bala pata.  But
here the Sugar's Presence emits grace.  It is like Sun and
its shining rays.

There is one name in Ashottaram. Om Sri Rachitala Tandavaya
Namah.  Rachit means movement, dance.  How can Achalam,
non-moving can move or dance?  Viswanatha Swami says:
Achalam is poornam without anything outside. Its dance
is the anubhava sphuranam of the poornam.  This is
Swabanubhuti.  Viswanatha Swami categorically adds:
Here there is no duality of experiencer and experienced.

Arunachala Siva.   

Nagaraj

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2009, 10:46:24 AM »
Dear Subramanian,

Very beautiful post, Excellent recollection of Ashtothara Namams, it is so full of meaning and ecstasy. Bhagawan Ramana is the pure Consciousness within us as our own Conscioussnes, This itself is the Witness of everything. That Pure Consciousness alone - Sri Ramana.

The lesser ego, on realising its own non existence, prays to this pure Consciousness - Sri Ramana who is the Effulgence of Arunachala like the Sun in the Heart, which is showering its grace.

Grace is his Nature and Nature is Grace itself. How beautiful. Similarly, we can say that the experienced and Experiencer and Experience is all one and the same.

Sugar cannot taste its own sweetness, as it itself is Taste as well! The Grace is seen by the ego once it realises its own false state. The Life force, the Consciousness is dancing in its own sweetness, taste, its own experience, experienced, experience even though there is no movement - no tasting, no experience, no experienced - Achalam

That which is experienced without Experience, That which is sweetening without tasting the sweetness, that which is full of Life-Force without
Life is Arunachala - The Eternal Consciousnes Awareness Witness etc. Movement without Movement.

Nagaraj
« Last Edit: June 12, 2009, 11:12:58 AM by Nagaraj »
॥ शांतमात्मनि तिष्ट ॥
Remain quietly in the Self.
~ Vasishta

Subramanian.R

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Re: On being serious
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2009, 12:49:21 PM »
Dear Nagaraj,

Thank you.  There is another verse, benedictory.  Bhagavan
Ramana is like what?  He is like a large deep ocean of milk.
All the worldly activities around Him are like little waves on
the ocean's shore. Aparasatchit sukavari......  He is non-moving,
deep delving, calm, waveless ocean of milk.  Ocean of Sat
Chit Ananda.  Ananda is His nature.  Chit, Self Knowledge is
His Power.  He is the One, Sat, without the second.  The entire
world, people running around with all sorts of egoistic problems, challenges, doubts, fears, unstable happiness, miseries, anger and hate --- are like waves.  Without bothering about the waves,
if one goes into the ocean, he can dive deep into that Paramananda Sagara.

Arunachala Siva.

Arunachala Siva