Author Topic: Manage Thoughts  (Read 4652 times)


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Manage Thoughts
« on: December 16, 2008, 11:56:44 AM »
      Let us take simple situtations and just see things as they are. What ever i say here, can be seen within. We can verify within if this is so or not. There is no question of waiting for some favourable situtation or time. There is no religious affiliation required.
A complicated situtation is made up of some simple situtations... by looking at the simple situtations we shall be able to proceed to complicated and more complex situtations with ease.

Let us take a simple scenario. I am trying to hasten to office. There is an urgent work. But some situtation causes delay. Here, if we see closely, there is a dichotomy. I want to go to office, but something is not allowing. And this simple scenario is sufficient to make us miserable and angry; frustrated.
Frustration, anger, disappointment are "Disagreement" with what IS -- the current Situation. Let us call this situtation of "Disagreement" before it gets converted into Anger as situation 1.

So, when anger arises. I try to shout at someone. Shouting at someone actually makes the mind lighter. It is said that if a person does not shout when he feels angry ... or does not cry when he feels really let down ... it gets supressed and it might turn into something else : disappointment, sadness etc. Let us call the state of anger situtation 2. And the state after shouting out : state 3. And state of disappointment or dejection state 4.

Let us see how these states need to be addressed.

People are taught to do pranayama or japa or some spiritual practise to divert the mind from anger, disagreement etc. But diverting the mind from the problem is not going to solve the problem. These are called, in psychology, altered states of consciousness... they are escape from the current situtation.

What a person needs to do is "SEE" straight at the problem without trying to avoid it. Purely Witness the state of "Anger" without any attempt to "reduce" it  or "Alter the State" .

If a person is ready to "Be" or "Agree" with the presence of state1, state 1 does not get into state 2 or state 3 or state 4.
But most often this happens unconsciously. Automatic, almost. So we first find outselves in state 2!

In state 2 also ... if we witness the anger as a third person ... That is "see the angry man " as a role or a different person ... state 2 dissolves out in no time ! instead of trying to shout and reduce tension by moving to state 3 ... we just witness it.

we do not move into state4 if we do this, coz state 4 requires supression of the state. That is if we try to stop the mind from being angry ... we enter state 4 ... instead ... we just need to allow the mind run as it does and pick out the "I" from the mind ... and just witness...



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Re: Manage Thoughts
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2008, 08:40:04 PM »
this was an essential insight and came to the right time in my life, at the moment I struggle wiht my job, becuase I just work to have the money I need to make a living, the rest of my life is dedicated to meditation and painting//writing theater...

but hte job transformed like a cancer cell and I was suddenly in this job for 80% of the week, I witnessed how my mind and also body where suffering.....and yes I was shouting and criing the last days...

but fact is sometimes that acceptance is far away in uch a situation where you are troubled by what is...and then there should be a place  for the jiva to "change" (not alter) the scenario....

becaue my sadhana will benefit fom a job that is more in line with what I have to give here in society, and also it will benefit from a job that will profide more time for the sadhana...

you are right, you see when the self shines then it shines always as the self, in such situaiton or not...but you see I witnessed how my psyche became very unhappy, and how my body started to suffe runder this...and now there is the natural tendency to change the situation....


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Re: Manage Thoughts
« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2008, 10:23:28 AM »
Dear  Matthias,  How to overcome the misery of work situation?
Or, generally for that matter, any dark thoughts in life?  Bhagavan
Ramana said:  Find out to whom these thoughts (that bring misery)
are?  Then you will get the answer:  "It is for me?"  Then ask who am
I?  You will find out that all these thoughts are for the mind and for the
Self and you are the Self.

If one cannot directly go into self enquiry, one can 'remove' all the
other thoughts, through one 'pure thought'. This is where the worship,
mantra japa, nishkamya karma, raja yoga, all these come.  It is like
giving a chain to the elephant, so that it will not move its trunk hither
and thither, but will hold on to the chain and move it! (Who am I?)
Like srkudai said yesterday, ask the child who is afraid of darkness to
chant Hanuman Chalisa.  In my younger days, in 1960s, my grandma
used to say that whenever you are afraid, (I was afraid in those days,
about the night time beggar who comes at the doorstep and ask for
alms with a hoarse call!), "Chant Ramana Maharshi Bhagavan!
Seshadri Bhagavan!"  I used to chant Ramana Maharshi Bhagavan!
Seshadri Bhagavan! to ward off the fear of the night time beggar!

The idol worship, mantra japa, the Raja Yoga, all these are only to
concetrate one one thought, instead of being assailed by so many

Annamalai Swami, whose interview I was watching yesterday in
the DVD, (David Godaman has released it) said a new example:
Whenever you look inside the well, you will see your head there.
If you are afraid to see the head inside the well, what you should
do?  You should keep away from looking into the well and you shall
see your head right on top of your neck!"

All miseries are due to the mind, be it with regard to your work,
your livelihood or your health.

Best of luck!

Arunachala Siva.     


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Re: Manage Thoughts
« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2008, 02:36:38 PM »
I see what you mnean and I do take this job as a challenge and also to deepen my practice...

its is the simple fact that due to this work my body and mind start to rebell, it is like they are not born to do this....and Iam witnessing how it is affecting me...I watch my breath or the simple open moment, or I do mantra meditationw hen I work...but at the end of three full days Iam without much energy for other things, and this is not in harmony with what I "think" I should do...

so there is a mental conflict....something that rebells against this situation, and you see I do not loose my meditation or the door to my inner peace, but mind//body are rebelling against this and therefor Iam willing to change the situation....I feel that now it is enough


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Re: Manage Thoughts
« Reply #4 on: December 17, 2008, 09:46:43 PM »
Dear Matthias and srkudai,

I read with interest the exchange of posts between the two.  The
exposition is excellent.  But I am only afraid that the standards set
up are too high, only reachable by Hemant Karkare, Abhinava Bindra
and Viswanthan Anand.  Most of us are fighting against only errant
autorickshaw drivers, shooting darts at the garden trees and playing
chess in the street corner clubs.  We can definitely not jump a height
fixed for pole vaulters. 

Thousands came to Bhagavan Ramana during His life time.  But only
Lakshmana Sarma, Wolter Kiers and Lakshmanaswami could attain
what He spoke of, from the word 'go'. We are not even Munagala
Venkatramaiah, Devaraja Mudaliar and G.V. Subbaramaiah.  Even
Annmalai Swami took 10 to 12 years!   We are like the Harijan who
came to Him, on the Hills.  We are still on the fringes of the outskirts
of Arunachala Hills.  Bhagavan Ramana was totally different.  From
Madurai, He went straight to Virupakshi Cave and sat.  All His reading and tapas were only for the sake for the world, for whom He had to give a 'formal' teaching!  He had no need for any of those things.

So, I still believe that one should start with formal worships, formal
prayers, meditation and then self enquiry.  One fear, we are back
with Hanuman Chalisa.  One misery, we are back with Sri Ramajayam.
One disappointment, we are back with Sundara Kandam!  One obstacle,
we are back with Ganesa Pancharatnam!

I trust that this clarification will be helpful.

Arunachala Siva. 


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Re: Manage Thoughts
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2008, 01:07:14 PM »
Dear srkduai,

I agree with you on several points.  The first and foremost is do the
prayer etc., to dis-identify ourselves with the mind.  Secondly, these
are not escape situations, or rather to face the misery/disappointment/

These are all sub-routes which shall take us to the royal road of
self enquiry.   Bhagavan Ramana has said the same thing on many

What I was trying to say is that these sub routes cannot be set aside
as irrelevent or unncessary.  That is all.

Arunachala Siva. 


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Re: Manage Thoughts
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2008, 09:26:43 PM »
Driving in seclusion is a must before becoming expert driver on a busy road with chaotic traffic.