Author Topic: The real "I"  (Read 3665 times)

ramanaduli

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The real "I"
« on: October 16, 2008, 05:58:04 AM »
Dear sir,

We are not body. We are not the mind, Jnanis say we are the awarness. When we can aware our awareness.?
Before the awarness every one says, "I" am this "I" am that. When I say I am so and so means  am I telling without my awarness, After reading who I am, I cannot find out my real "I". still.

Ramanaduli


Subramanian.R

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2008, 12:37:11 PM »
Dear Ramanaduli, There are no two 'I's, the Real and the false.
There is only one, and only 'I', the Real.  But when this Real
I , is is hidden by various screens, mind-body complexities, then
it is not visible or it is seen as 'I', the body-mind consciousness.
The self enquiry is to remove the screens and not to find out the
false 'I' and throw him out!   As I said elsewhere, you remove the
encumbrances in the house to make it clean.  Bhagavan used
two Tamil words, 'Naan' and 'Thaan' in Who am I? to distinguish
these two situations.  When English translators like Paul Brunton
and Arthur Osborne came, they had to use to different cannotations
to denote the difference, hence, they used 'I" and "I--I".  There is
no direct word in English for these.  Some one else used, 'i' and 'I"
but the problem remains!

You say you are not able to find out the Awareness after reading
Who am I?  Read it every day, many many times.  I read it atleast
500 times, both the question- answer type and the narrative
essay, the English Version and Tamil version.  Then I have understood
bit by bit.  Even today, I read it once every day, and every day,
I get new insights.  Bhagavan said:  "Lo, it is easy this Atma Vidya."
But most of us find it, that it is not easy.  He said it is easy because,
there is no need to go elsewhere, there is no need to go to many
teachers, there is no need to refer to many books, and it is
within us, ever present, shining, blissful and direct.

Arunachala Siva.           

silentgreen

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2010, 03:30:24 PM »
Approach enquiry of the self with the most common sense.
Go to a solitary place and find out, "What is it that is life? What is it that is the 'I'"?

Only reading lot of books won't do. Find it out yourself by introspection.
Use the most simple mind for enquiry without complicating it with lot of theories.
Pray to God with all your heart if it helps.

What you discover is in all probability what everyone else discovers, since the core self is of the same nature for everyone, for ordinary persons or saints. Some interpret their observations in a positive way and persevere. Others get discouraged. Faith makes the difference.

This will act like "home work".
Reading lot of books are like "class works".
Good students what they listen in classes follow up with home works.

Remember, what you observe is what everyone else observes since the core self is of the same nature for everyone.
Then what makes the difference? Faith and desirelessness.
Homage to the Universal Being...Om Shanti ... Om Shanti ... Om Shanti ...

ramana_maharshi

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2010, 03:47:37 PM »
>> Reading lot of books are like "class works".

Well said SilentGreen garu.

Sri Micheal James in his "Happiness And Art Of Living" Book says,

1) If we continue reading innumerable books to gather more and more extraneous knowledge, we will be wasting our valuable time and distracting our mind from our true purpose, which is to give up all other knowledge and thereby to sink in the only true knowledge – the simple non-dual knowledge or consciousness of our own being, ‘I am’.

2) For people of little intelligence, wife, children and others [other relatives] form [just] one family. [However] know that in the mind of people who have vast learning, there are not [just] one [but] many families [in the form] of books [that stand] as obstacles to yoga [spiritual practice].

3) Excessive study will not only fill our mind with innumerable thoughts, which will cloud our natural inner clarity of selfconsciousness,but will also fill it with the pride of learning, which will prompt us to display our vast knowledge to other people, and to expect them to appreciate and praise it. Therefore in verse 36 of Ulladu Narpadu Anubandham Sri Ramana says:

Rather than people who though learned have not subsided [surrendered or become subdued, humble or still], the unlearned are saved. They are saved from the ghost of pride that possesses [the learned]. They are saved from the disease of many whirling thoughts. They are saved from running in search of fame [repute, respect, esteem or glory]. Know that what they are saved from is not [just] one [evil].

4) In spite of all our vast learning and our seeming renunciation, if we fall prey to desire for the extremely delusive pleasure of being an object of praise,appreciation,admiration, respect, high regard, acclaim or fame, to free ourself of such desire is very difficult indeed.

5) What initially motivates us to read books on philosophy or religion is our desire to know the truth, but the true knowledge that we seek to acquire cannot be contained in any book or any words. True knowledge is only the absolute knowledge that lies beyond the reach of all thoughts and words.

6) No matter how many books we may read, we cannot attain true knowledge until and unless we forget all that we have learnt from them by thus concentrating our entire attention only upon our own true non-dual self-conscious being.

7) If we have great enthusiasm to study a vast number of books, and to remember all the concepts that we have learnt from them, we are likely to forget the true purpose of the books we study. Therefore,rather than reading many books, we would be wise to select a few books which clearly and repeatedly emphasise the need for us to turn our mind inwards and drown it in the source from which it has risen,and that thereby enkindle and sustain our enthusiasm to practise the art of vigilantly self-attentive and therefore thought-free being.



silentgreen

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2010, 05:11:28 PM »
Dear prasanth_ramana_maharshi,

Nice post. I remember Sri Ramakrishna's story in this connection:
A person had received a letter in which he was asked to send certain articles to his kinsmen. He was about to order the purchase of those things, when, looking for the letter, he found it was missing. He searched for a long time. His people also joined him in his search. At last the letter was found and his joy knew no bounds. With great eagerness he took it up and went through its contents. But after knowing what things were wanted, he threw the letter aside and set forth to collect the desired articles. How long does one care for such a letter? So long as one does not know its contents. The next step is to put forth one's effort to procure the things. Similarly the Sacred Books only tell us the means for the realization of God. Having once known them, you should struggle hard to acquire them and reach the goal. What is the use of mere book-learning? A pandit may know many sacred texts and sciences, but if his mind is attached to the world, if he enjoys the pleasures of the senses, he has not realized the spirit of the Scriptures; he has studied them in vain.

When I read Sri Ramakrishna's teaching that only yearning is required for God realization, that is sufficient.
The letter is read.

Bhagavan said: "Find out from where the I rises from."

When I read David Godman's book "Be as you are", I got only one central message from every page:
Behind the small I is the infinite I.

What else is required?
The letter is read.

However reading books regularly for expressing the remembrance of God is of a different nature.
It is devotion.
Homage to the Universal Being...Om Shanti ... Om Shanti ... Om Shanti ...

ramana_maharshi

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2010, 05:37:48 PM »
Once Stretching out his hand towards the disciple, Bhagavan ramana said, “What do you think the book is teaching? You see yourself and then see me. It is like asking you to see yourself in a mirror. The mirror shows only what is on the face. If you see the mirror after washing your face, the face will appear to be clean. Otherwise the mirror will say there is dirt here, come back after washing. A book does the same thing. If you read the book after realising the Self, everything will be easily understood. If you read it before realising the Self, you will see ever so many defects. It will say, ‘First set yourself right and then see me.’ That is all. First see your Self. Why do you worry yourself about all that book learning?”

I did not say that reading is no help. I merely said that there is no need for illiterate people to think they can never attain moksha on that account and thereby feel disheartened.See how depressed he was when he asked me. If the facts are not explained properly, he will feel still further depressed,” said Bhagavan.

“Please help me to realise the Self. It is no use reading books.” Bhagavan answers, “Quite so. If the Self be found in books, it would have been realised long ago. Is it not a wonder that we should seek the Self in books? Can it be found there? Of course books have impelled the question.” -- Talks 117

Once Sri RamaKrishna said

Many people think they cannot have knowledge or understanding of God without reading books. But hearing is better than reading, and seeing is better than hearing. Hearing about Benares is different from reading about it; but seeing Benares is different from either hearing or reading. (p. 863)

Once Swami Vivekananda said

Not theory, mind you. Not reading books. . . . [Not parroting.] My old Master used to say, "It is all very good to teach the parrot to say, 'Lord, Lord, Lord' all the time; but let the cat come and take hold of its neck, it forgets all about it" [You may] pray all the time, read all the scriptures in the world, and worship all the gods there are, [but] unless you realise the soul there is no freedom. Not talking, theorising, argumentation, but realisation. That I call practical religion.


ramanaduli

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2010, 06:47:08 PM »
Dear Udai ji,

 The awarness is already there. Otherwise how we can identify our thoughts and its kinds like good thought or bad thought. As you said in your previous post.I am puting into practice it. First it is the conviction. And simply observe the thoughts. It is a new experience. As the awarness is everywhere
it is inside us as well as outside. Is it not?  it seems all figures are floating like. The body acts due to the awarness which is inside but outside it does not
visible because there is no body i.e. only space. Is it?


ramanaduli

amiatall

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2010, 08:29:58 PM »
'I am' is the greatest book one can ever read. The book of books.

Subramanian.R

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2010, 10:08:10 AM »
Books can help only to some extent.  Bhagavan Himself has said that there is no
point in reading limitlessly.  The best thing is to watch, as soon as you get up
in the morning, for a few minutes, "Where was I a few minutes before?"  Was
I working with my mind and body?  What is that which was with me during those
hours of sleep?"  This is the real prata-smaranam.

Arunachala Siva.

silentgreen

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2010, 03:41:41 PM »
When we can aware our awareness.?

Centering on the being, observe the transparent and subtle thing behind the thoughts. If there are no thoughts, observe the transparent and subtle thing behind the being.
Homage to the Universal Being...Om Shanti ... Om Shanti ... Om Shanti ...

Subramanian.R

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #10 on: March 19, 2010, 09:58:47 AM »
One can be aware of the Awareness, after all the search.  The Awareness is an experience
by itself without duality.  One cannot describe the Awareness.  Tasting sugar is different
from being sugar.

Arunachala Siva.

silentgreen

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Re: The real "I"
« Reply #11 on: March 19, 2010, 10:24:47 AM »
Trying to observe awareness one finds a tussle between the observer and what is observed.
Are they the same? Or are they different?
Is being awareness same as observing awareness? Or does mind observes the deeper self?
How to observe? With the mind or with the heart?
How to observe? Outward to inwards, or inward to outwards?

It is better to solve the problem oneself without taking recourse to a bookish definition or sayings of others.
It is better not to come to any inner conclusion unless one has found it out oneself.
(however there is no harm in quoting what others have said).
It may take days, months or years (or maybe lifetimes) but it is a good homework problem.
Homage to the Universal Being...Om Shanti ... Om Shanti ... Om Shanti ...