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Messages - Nagaraj

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The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: Surrender
« on: July 21, 2010, 10:22:09 AM »
Dear I,

Dear Subramanian,Namaste.
                                     It is quite surprising that a great being like Adi Sankara had a debate with Buddhists and who ever
loses has to jump in the fire.Adi Sankara won the debate and asked the Buddhists to jump into the fire which they did.

I have never read or heard anywhere about Sri Adi Shankara or Sri Jnana Sambandhar, being a direct cause of death of the persons they debated.

However, we have to take it in the right spirit, right understanding. The scholars and poets who recorded the lives of these saints have their peculiar ways of writing their poetry about these saints.

Infact, The Buddhists jumping into fire does not mean that they jumped into fire literally, it means the death of their EGOs. Having lost the debate, they (EGOs) had to jump into the fire of Knowledge and die.

It is ridiculous to interpret these things in such a manner.

Salutations to Sri Ramana

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: Surrender
« on: July 21, 2010, 10:13:55 AM »
Dear I,

Dear Nagraj garu,

It is not possible to follow ahimsa always.

You are right if you say that we should follow ahimsa as far as possible in our life.

Even gandhiji would have surely killed unknowingly many little creatures when walking many times in his life.

When all routes close and all options are over only then lord krishna has agreed for the war.

Even ramana maharshi asked Annamali Swami to clear the area of ants.

One day after lunch we noticed lots of ants in the Old Hall disturbing the devotees. Bhagavan asked me to inspect the area and do the needful. When I went and lifted a stone, millions of ants rushed out. I was jumping all over in order to avoid crushing them. When Bhagavan asked me what I was doing, I explained that it would be jivahimsa to kill hundreds and thousands of ants by stepping upon them or by closing the opening through which they came out. He said, "You are not doing it for yourself, it is for the sake of others." He then quoted from Chapter thirteen of Bhagavad Gita where Krishna says that even killing is permitted if it is for the benefit of the world. Upon hearing this, I cleared the area of ants, sealed the entrance and cemented it.

We are in Kali Yuga sir and not in Satya Yuga.If we are in Satya Yuga then maybe we can achieve 100% ahimsa.

If our government follows only ahimsa and close all our jails and bring back military from the border and bans police jobs then wonder how india will be like  :)

What to tell even with all our military force and security we are unable to stop 26/11 mumbai attacks,hyderabad gokul chat attacks etc.

Once i remember Kanchi Sage has distributed Hanuman Chalisa to our soldiers before they are about to engage in war.

The Scriptures, the Vedas, Gurus, all ask you to follow Ahimsa, but did they ask us to analyse and see how much percent we can follow Ahimsa, did they tell us, that 100% Ahimsa is only for Satya Yuga and it is not as much applicable today? It is unfortunate and little disturbing that we are even justifying by referring to some examples of Ramana Maharshi and war between India and Pakistan, it is unfortunate to use the Paramacharyas context of giving Hanuman Chalisa in the spirit of this post.

We are not asked to analyse and see what would happen if Indian Govt. follow Ahimsa!

We are asked to follow Ahimsa not to debate how much we can follow today.

We have to tame our minds... This is not the right way of interpretation or the way to go forward. We should stop comparing and stop using scales for following Ahimsa.

Salutations to Sri Ramana

Its worthwhile to once again contemplate on these words of Bhagavan -

The Ordainer controls the fate of souls in accordance with their prarabdhakarma (destiny to be worked out in this life, resulting from the balance-sheet of actions in past lives). Whatever is destined not to happen will not happen, try as you may. Whatever is destined to happen will happen, do what you may to prevent it. This is certain. The best course, therefore, is to remain silent.

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: smt. kanakammal
« on: July 19, 2010, 03:53:36 PM »
Dear I,

Thank you for your enlightening article -

Specially, I found these very moving -

Her eyes were sparkling whenever she talked of bhagavan and i kept thinking she is so lucky and told her so! and she said..i saw bhagavan in his body and you are seeing bhagavan in spirit. That is the only difference. Rest in the same. Bhagavan is always there and that is what has brought you here.

She said...

"bhagavan has come into you. You are young and still have the interest and eagerness to come here and learn more about bhagavan's teachings. That means bhagavan has come into you. Otherwise there are so many other things these days to keep you occupied. Keep the practise going.."

Her last message is for everyone. All of us are to blessed to belong to sri bhagavan's family. Once when i told mani mama from the ashram that he was the lucky one to be born in sri bhagavan's family he said it was not so. he said all of us are lucky to belong to the big ramana family and can claim brotherhood and sisterhood!

How blessed are we all to be in 'Ramana Family'

Gratitude, Gratitude, Gratitude

Salutations to Sri Ramana

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: Surrender
« on: July 19, 2010, 03:40:32 PM »
We have to see divinity in everything, be it good or bad, clean or unclean, anything...

We should uplift ourselves whereby, we have to listen to the venting of others and give them solace, but we should also make ourselves wise and never vent on others our difficulties. This is hallmark of a spiritual person.

Paropakaaram idam shariram - This body is only for the service of others. This itself will take us through all problems.

We have to follow the highest order of Ahimsa which Gandhi followed. not hurting anybody, anything by thought word and deed. We should show such kindness to all, animals, insects, even while we walk, we have to walk very slowly consciously bearing in mind how Bhu Devi, mother earth is bearing the weight of all patiently.

We should be so conscious that we do not even abuse non living things as well, like, for example, take care of our vehicles properly like it is also a jiva, do not ride it rashly, go smooth in humps etc... we should have such level of care, we should follow such ideal of Ahimsa.

Even our Slippers, we have to treat it with utmost care and love, that we walk slowly and not hurt even the slippers.

Such compassion - we have to cultivate.

Ahimsa itself is Realisation, Brahman, Atman

Salutations to Sri Ramana

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Surrender
« on: July 17, 2010, 10:05:29 PM »
One of my close friends, when we were discussing about 'surrendering' to God completely (We had discussed a lot of times before); She had got so tired of surrendering, and one day, she said to me 'If at all I have to surrender anymore, I only have to go to a Police Station and Surrender myself'  :D

I found this very enlightening article by Sri A. Devaraja Mudaliar in one of the Mounatin Path Issues.

Even recent saints have, in their great mercy, told some lucky disciples that if they surrendered completely to the Guru they need not do anything else. Once when Girish Chandra Ghosh wept before Ramakrishna and declared that he could not follow any discipline, however simple or short, Ramakrishna was pleased to tell him: "Then give me power of attorney", meaning: 'Surrender and I will do the rest!'

I once told Bhagavan: "I am another Girish. You must save me yourself. Every saint must have a Girish."

Bhagavan replied But he gave power of attorney."

"I too have surrendered to the extent that I am capable of," I said: "What more can I do?"

Bhagavan said nothing.

It was not Bhagavan's way to say, "Surrender and I will look after you." However, the following incident is significant in that regard. About a year before Bhagavan left the body I said to him one afternoon: "I am going to sing Bhagavan three stanzas from a poem by Sivaprakasam Pillai because they express what I want to say better than I could." I then sang them. Their meaning is: "I have not followed your teaching or instructions; but is it proper for a Guru to get disgusted with his devotee as an incorrigible beast and to give him up? If you let me go my own way like this, what is to happen to me? I shall not reform and you will not correct or change me. Have I any other help in this or the other world except you, my Lord? What, then, is your idea" Is this right behaviour for you?"

Bhagavan did not immediately reply, which caused me some disappointment. After a minute or two he said: "Whether I do anything or not, your business is only to surrender and keep still."

Some friends have told me that I may take this to mean: "Don't worry; I know what to do and will do it." On the other hand, it may only mean: "If you really surrender you have no right to complain; so if a devotee complains it is a sign that he has not surrendered." In any case, I prefer to be an optimist and believe that, however incomplete my surrender may be, so long as his Grace is complete he will look after me all right.

Salutations to Sri Ramana

Dear I,

Ok. I donot investigate whether it is good or bad thought. The thought/thinking every thing happens to me.
Within me not outside. The only progress is it seems
easier to separate myself from my thoughts.When I say "my thought" the thought is separate and me "I" is
separate. It is clear that I am not thought that much it is clear.As it happens within me am I responsible for this. That is all. Rest is in Bhagavan's grace.

Note this, that the idea that the thoughts are separate from you is itself is wrong. How can it be that thoughts can be separate from you? If you are separate and thoughts are separate, then where from those thoughts are arising?

Please investigate and see, that your knowledge that thoughts and you are separate is to be investigated, thoughts have their origination from you itself. Thoughts are born from you.

Don't think that the thoughts are separate and you are separate, that will only lead to an endless cycle of births.

Salutations to Sri Ramana

Dear I,

One need not enquire the thinking process or thought.

One has to enquire the one who is thinking or is having thoughts.

Q - Who is having thoughts?
A - 'I'

Q - Who is thinking?
A - 'I'

that 'I' has to be enquired about. continue the enquiry 'who am I', and as and when thoughts keep arising, you will subconsciously ask yourself to whom have these thoughts come now, and subconsciously, you will know 'to me' ..... like this, as and when the mind keep going out, bring it back to its source.

from the source, the thoughts will keep coming again and again in the form of vasanas, just don't pay any attention to the 'content'* of your thoughts/thinking, just bring it back by subconsciously, staying with the substratum of 'I' to whom these thoughts are arising to. This is true meditation, bring back the outgoing mind to its source till your Vasanas whick keep going outwards in the form of thoughts/thinking are completely Stopped by staying in the source.

(Note - * (Contents can be very interesting, and could have a lot of gyan and intelligence - dont pay any attention to it - discard it as waste!)

Do not have any conceptions like "Catching". Just hold on with the substratum of all the thoughts/thinking - that substratum 'I' to whom all these thoughts/thinking are arising to.

There is nothing 'to become'

Salutations to Sri Ramana

Dear I,

Brahmacharya shoould not be a 'goal' but it should end up being a by-product of our Sadhana. Only this is true Brahmacharya.

The more one tries to attain Brahmacharyam, one would only be farther from it.

To questions related to sex, Bhagavan only asked  the one to continue doing the Self enquiry with full attention. Sex related question only arise out of difference/duality between men, woman, has to go beyond genders which the 'I' is and Brahmacharya automatically is gained!

Salutations to Sri Ramana

Humour / Re: Where am I?
« on: July 16, 2010, 05:56:52 PM »
Dear I,

When the mind sprouts from the Heart or  self, the thoughts also belong to the heart. is not it?
Heart/self is always pure. How does the thoughts become impure?. Anyway our motive is just investigate and reach to the basis i.e. Heart.
To be summa, we should always watch whenever the thought comes we should send it back to the source. One day we would be a thoughtless state.


this is ok, but, the very next sentence -

To be summa, we should always watch whenever the thought comes we should send it back to the source. One day we would be a thoughtless state.

That idea to 'Be Summa" we should always watch whenever the thoughts..... is to be avoided.

There is nothing to do to 'Be Summa' why build up on how to 'Be Summa' ? ? ? just be! Don't attempt to try and analyse what is to be 'Chumma Iruthal'

The (point) is not to find out what is to be "Summa iru"

Renounce all ideas, and analyses and just be....

Salutations to Sri Ramana

General Discussion / Re: Seeker-Goal
« on: July 16, 2010, 10:49:05 AM »
How much so ever we may try to understand the state of (sleep) we fail at it, simply because, it is only in this waking state that we TRY to understand the state of (sleep) - it is false, and only full of ideas and imagination.

What cannot be known or understood, we should leave them as they are. Its like this, Can we ever try to straighten the tail of a dog?

Post thoughts -

- To truly know the (state) of sleep, shouldn't we check it during sleep?
- But where was 'I' during sleep? where did 'I' go away?

There is no point in seeking to enquire this; But

- Here 'I' am now, the 'I' who is trying to grasp the (state) of sleep, Who am 'I' ?

Salutations to Sri Ramana

'You' are not going to get an answer from 'me'

Dear I,

Dear Nagaraj,
                :)  Yes. But who has to enquire?
Please tell me one thing: you might have already enquired like this. why do u say u r still unrealized then ?

Whether I am realized or not, it is of no consequence! and the question "who has to enquire", you have to ask it to yourself !

Salutations to Sri Ramana

Dear I,

Dear Nagaraj,
can you explain why acquire and drop ?
why acquire if at the end it has to be dropped ?

and if krishna dropped, how did he communicate it to Arjuna?

Ramana said find out "who am i" did he say "focus on I" ?

Instead of thinking about why to acquire and drop, pondering over why acquire it in first place if it has to be dropped, enquire who is the one to whom these thoughts are sprouting to?

It is unnecessary to know how Krishna communicated to Arjuna if Krishna dropped! enquire the one who is pondering thus!

Instead of pondering about what exactly Sri Ramana has said, whether he said find out 'who am I' or did he say 'focus on I'; enquire as to whom these two thoughts are coming to, as to who is the one pondering about what Sri Bhagavan actually meant!

Dear Subramanian,
             :) How about trying it my way, just now, just once ? Now.
not that my method is superior. but that, perhaps it might work, who knows?
what do you say ?
Not that you should stop chanting Arunachala Siva. Chanting Arunachala Siva is undoubtedly no less than the highest approach. its supreme.

I want you to try it for my experiement ;) --- i have the feeling that this should work for all.
want to verify that with you. Love! Silence

When you say:  
How about trying it my way, just now, just once ? Now.
not that my method is superior. but that, perhaps it might work, who knows?
what do you say ?

whose way are you talking about? who are you referring when you are saying "MY" and "YOU" to who are 'you' or who am I?

When you say:

"I want you to try it for my experiement  --- i have the feeling that this should work for all.want to verify that with you.

Who is the "I" in

"I want you to try it for my experiement

Who are you addressing to or referring to when you say "MY" in

"I want you to try it for my experiement

Who are you referring to when you say "ALL":

i have the feeling that this should work for all

Salutations to Sri Ramana

I have had great regard for Mahatma Gandhi, I have read his Experiements with truth again and again. It takes mammoth lelvel of wisdom to lead a life like he has lived. I bet, there is no other person who could have written the truth of his life like how Gandhi has lived!

Sex is a taboo in India. It is viewed as one of the ugliest act. Vatsyaayana is from India, we should never forget it. It is a holy act. So what if he had sex with any one with their permission?

If we see the world with a black cooling spectacles, the world looks black only. we have to remove the narrowness in being judgemental about people, which is why I was inspired to post the article about the parable in Mahabharata about Yudhishtra and Duriyodhana.

If we see from ordinary eyes, we see only worldly things, if we see through the divine eyes, everything is Godly and divine.

Salutations to Sri Ramana

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