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Messages - Nagaraj

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General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: September 22, 2012, 08:40:18 PM »
Dear Jewel,

Does it matter really? what stand point i say? what matters is ones personal experience to the truth, One will know very well from his heart of hearts that what he reads is Truth or not, it will strike a chord in the deep realms of ones heart. Ones own Self is ones guide.

Only oneself can know. The one question that is very tough to win over is this -

How do i know, that i really know? because, this question has lot of twists, firstly, it will dawn to such a one that such a question arises only from ego, mind, and it will again dawn that why is there a need to know that i know? Do i have to know? How can i know if i am not deluding myself? how can i know if i am not under the sway of intellectual garb?

When one really knows, such questions will not affect the one, he will be so clear, that such question will never have a place to even stand before the fire of that light. Where can be a place for doubt before perfect clarity.

So Jewel, this is very personal query, and only oneself can find out oneself. It ultimately depends of the ripeness of the one and also depends on personal honesty to oneself.

General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: September 22, 2012, 07:47:12 PM »
Dear Jewel,

Like one wise man said me once,The one who is searching,is the one who is sought for.

Sri Bhagavan says: That which makes the enquiry is the ego. The `I' about which the enquiry is made is also the ego. As the result of the enquiry the ego ceases to exist and only the Self is found to exist.

That which seems ignorant is also the same Self, that which attains clarity is also the same Self. That which manifests as ignorance and knowledge is also the same Chaitanya.

The Self may manifest as the Ego, mind, and play games, but it cannot be vice-verse - the Ego posing as Self. Without attainment of clarity, samsara can never be crossed. Therefore, once properly one has to engage all his heart mind and soul in what ever sadhana one may be doing, be it Vichara, Bhakti or Yoga.

Our attitude should go beyond just doing things for the sake, mechanically, one should have intense-intense desire. Only then Miracles happen. There if no point is crying nothing is happening.

If the disciple comes with a cup he will only get a cupful. It is no use complaining of the niggardliness of the ocean; the bigger the vessel the more he will be able to carry. It is entirely up to him.

We have to simply jump into what we are doing so intensely that we don't even turn back and have time to see how we are doing and evaluate things!

General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: September 22, 2012, 07:36:36 PM »
Dear Sir,

All that is required is little bit, minuscule, genuine desire to see, or, attain God. Which is why He has give out various ways, through which we may desire Him or That.

A Shakti Upasaka may worship him as a child (Bala) as Mother, as even vamachara path as well, A Vaishnava woprships him as the Dhata, father, Supreme God, A Shaiva worships him as Jnana Jyoti, Tatva aaradhana, smartas worship all of them together, some worship as wisdom.

We just have to desire Him or That. That is the only eligibility, and we have to really really desire. Then as you have said, Siva Himself does these snapping out of His abundant Grace, by any way, he wills, in weirdest of ways!

General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: September 22, 2012, 07:06:01 PM »
Dear Sir,

Purity of mind is attainment of Clarity - தெளிவு Thelivu

That discernment which does not give rise to any doubts, is the purification, bathing in the Ganges.

when this clarity is discerned, even when there is Maya, it will not shake the 'Chaitanya' like how Janaka was not shaken when he saw his entire kingdom destroyed by fire. The Moon (body) and Chaitanya, when discerned as the Self, then, even when big meteorites or moon quakes hit the moon, the Light is not affected, like wise, what what happens in the body, will never bother such a chaitanya.

That clarity, which results is no fear, doubts, aversions, joy, judgement, and that because of which, everything is at poise, samatva, unperturbed, that wisdom is cleansing. Discernment of that wisdom is the annihilation of ego.

Upon that discernment, ego, has no place to stand, it is annihilated altogether, and, the annihilation is more, just an inference, there is really no annihilation, as it was itself that danced as the ego, and has now ceased to be.

When such a clarity has dawned, there is no way one can be under the sway of the mind/ego any more. What ever such a one does, does so as a Leela - Divine play.

General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: September 22, 2012, 05:00:42 PM »
Another illustration occurred here

When there is Solar eclipse, how is one able to say so? is it not again through the light of Sun itself? in the same way, Intellect is able to discern all these through its Self. Intellect is fully powered by itself, Jyothi Chaitanya.

is it right? therefore to say, Moon is hiding the Sun? it is Sun itself that is saying moon is hiding Self.

What is Sun, Sun is Light. Light again, is Prajna, Brahman Atma.

being the Chaitanya - Pure Light, identified with the Moon, we say, i am ignorant, ego has to die, but, if it is discerned that one is that Chaitanya. there will result no confusion.

i just posted this illustration under my topic "My Musings" and felt it is very relevant to this chain of discussion. hence re-posting here as well.

Sun's light falls on the Moon, and we say, moon thinks it is Self. Infact it is the Light that imagines that it is moon. but actually it is just light.

When one realises that one is the Light and not the moon, does that light have to annihilate itself? to realise Brahman? or does the light that falls on the moon, go back to its source Sun? isn't the light already, not-separate from itself,  Sun?

To also say that Light comes from Sun is min interpretation. Light is itself the Self, Sun.

Light is Brahman, Prajna, Atma

You are neither the Sun (Self that is somewhere) nor the Moon (body) you are the Light - Prajna, Brahman, Atma

When the Light identifies itself as the moon (body) then the same intellect is ego, upon ceasing from identifying with moon (body), it is Self. Annihilation of ego is merely the discernment that you are not the moon (body) what remains is shuddha Chaitanya.

General Discussion / Sun-Moon-Chit
« on: September 22, 2012, 04:49:14 PM »

Sun's light falls on the Moon, and we say, moon thinks it is Self. Infact it is the Light that imagines that it is moon. but actually it is just light.

When one realises that one is the Light and not the moon, does that light have to annihilate itself? to realise Brahman? or does the light that falls on the moon, go back to its source Sun? is the light already not separate from itself Sun.

To also say that Light comes from Sun is min interpretation. Light is itself the Self, Sun.

Light is Brahman, Prajna, Atma

You are neither the Sun nor the Moon, you are the Light - Prajna, Brahman, Atma

When the Light identifies itself as the moon (body) then the same intellect is ego, upon ceasing from identifying with moon (body), it is Self. Annihilation of ego is merely the discernment that you are not the moon (body) what remains is shuddha Chaitanya.

“because the ‘I’ arises from the Absolute and gives rise to budhi (Intellect). IN BUDHI THE ‘I’ LOOKS THE SIZE AND SHAPE OF THE BODY, na medhaya means that Brahman cannot be apprehended by budhi.
Brahman—Aham (‘I-I’)—budhi (intellect).

Which is it again that discerns that Brahman cannot be apprehended by buddhi? is it not the same buddhi? The Buddhi or Intellect realises it. The very purpose of the buddshi arising from Self is to discern this very thing. This discernemnt is the rippened discernement that i mentioned. What more is there fore the Buddhi to do? it realises its inability to see the Self, as it is not different from Self. Intellect is not differnet from Self.

In context to this discussion alone, and, with the above discernement, where is a need to discover Brahman any more? One just drops over from the race.

This is how i understood the words of Sri Bhagavan.


What is annihilation of intellect? the annihilation of intellect is to be understood as discernment, pure understanding. The very complete discernment that Intellect is itself the manifested aspect of Self, and that, the very intellect is not different from Self, is the annihilation of itself. That discernment, after which the intellect no longer struggles to annihilate itself, or, goes in search of Self, or, strives to merge with Self itself is annihilation of itself.

“Such inward seeking is the path to be gained by man’s intellect. THE INTELLECT ITSELF REALISES AFTER CONTINUOUS PRACTICE THAT IT IS ENABLED BY SOME HIGHER POWER TO FUNCTION. It cannot itself reach that Power. SO IT CEASES TO FUNCTION AFTER A CERTAIN STAGE. When it thus ceases to function the Supreme Power is still left there all alone. That is Realisation; that is the finality; that is the goal.
Again, as expressed in the previous point, i view or discern as follows:

That the intellect itself realises after continues practice that it is enabled by a higher power to function is also doiscerned by the intellect itself. Sri Bhagavan goes to tell that intellect ceases to function after a certain stage. it ceases to function, as it realises that there is nothing apart from Self, Intellect, itself included. Intellect has seen the Self, (itSelf) there is no seeing Self apart from Self (or itself). Intellect has discerned what has to be discerned. What is left? why trouble with Self Presence? which remains in the form of Chit Shakti? Pure Intellect cannot be annihilated, can that which is birthless, deathless be annihilated?

"Sat Chit Ananda" is the term used to closely attribute the Absolute Brahman.

Why is it that the word "Chit" is present in between Sat and Ananda? If Sat - Truth is there, and Ananda signifies that it is opposite to that which is unhappiness, it is blissful. without Chit, who can know, Sat and Ananda? Chit Shakti is the Rippened Intellect, That knows. Chit is the Seer, Another name for Chit is "Rshi" Rshi literally measn "Seer" When they call Bhagavan Maharshi, it means Great Seer.

There is no annihilation. Annihilation of Intellect's volition is truth but not the intellect itself. It remains.

Sat Chit Ananda

Dear Anil ji, i would like us to ponder over your observation as below -

"SELF ALONE IS ETERNAL. INTELLECT IS A PHENOMENON. Intellect is a tool of the Self. The Self uses intellect for measuring varieties. There is no intellect in dreamless deep sleep. Yet, we remember on waking, ‘We slept well.’"

couple of points for contemplation -

Suppose, as you have observed, that, it is the Self that uses the intellect as a tool, for what ever, measuring varieties. what doubt should arise, if it is the Supreme Self itself that is employing its own manifested aspect? There is no avidya here.

A Ripened intellect is itself the Self. Mana Eva Manushyaanam Kaaranam Bandha Mokshah. Mind alone is the cause of Bondage and Freedom. By Ripened Intellect, i mean that intellect which has sorted out all doubts, that results in no volition anymore.

What is the reason Sri Bhagavan says Mritu Manas, Dead mind. If it is dead, annihilated what say it remains as Dead Mind? Because Chit remains, Prajna Remains, Intellect remains. to say it remains is wrong, it ever is. Sat CHIT Ananda.

To whom is it said, Bhrahma Vid Brahmaiva Bhavati, is to to Self or the reasoning intellect? Which is the Higher power? there is no higher power than Self. Is the Self different from the reasoning Self? Chit Shakti?

Intellect is Chit Swaroopam of Self.

Dear Sri Anil Ji, please take your time. we can continue as and when you get opportunity to spend time.

This is an interesting article on Sat Chit Ananda.

Jnaneshvar begins with a clarification of the ageold designation of Brahman (the Absolute) as Satchidananda, a composite Sanskrit word made up of Sat (“Existence”or“Being”),Chit (“Consciousness”) and Ananda (“Bliss”). It is a useful designation, as Jnaneshvar points out, because it includes in one word three separate aspects, or attributes, of the One. If we say merely that It is Existence, we leave out mention of the fact that It is Consciousness; if we refer to It merely as Consciousness, we leave out mention of the fact that It is pure
satisfaction, or Bliss; and so on. But his purpose here is to explain that these three designations are merely hints, and are really inadequate, as all words are, to accurately describe the experience of the Absolute, of Brahman. “Whatever may be said about Him,” says Jnaneshvar, “He is not that.”

Such words as “Consciousness,” “Existence,” “Bliss,” suggest to us those states which are the opposite of “unconsciousness,” “nonexistence,” and “unhappiness.” This is the limitation of all language; it is based upon the dualism of contraries which we experience in the world. But the Absolute Reality is beyond all contraries, and cannot be expressed in language. We can only say, “not this, not  that.” Finally, in the last few verses, Jnaneshvar acknowledges that all his wordy outpourings are of no use in affecting anything at all; even such terms as “bondage” and “liberation” have no meaning in regard to the Self, Who remains always in the same state of Freedom. Nothing, therefore, is to be accomplished by all his lengthy explanations. The fact is, it is all for his own pleasure and delight in expounding the Truth.

Why i discern that is important, as expressed in my previous post is because, it is important to not carry on Self Enquiry blindly, like, when ever there is disturbing thought,or when ever we sense the arise of 'I' we enquire the source. This would never end the quest.

Self Enquiry should not be like taking a medicine for headache.

One may carry on with this for ever, but if one fails to discern the tatva, It may be endless cycle.

It is important to look at it carefully, discern it carefully and see it as it is. See and discern the purpose of Self Enquiry as well.

Self Enquiry ought not to be like our prostrations, shashtanga Namaskaram, that we keep doing it again and again and again, Surrender done repeatedly.

True Surrender is just once, and done be with ones ego. In the same spirit, True Self Enqury is just once, it should be done with it.

it may take time, that is not important, it may take days, years, may be just once, one true enquiry. Like how Buddha decided to sit and sort himself out.

could be any time. But, the spirit should not be forgotten. Self Enquiry is done only once, and only continued.

Like the spirit, when one begins some job, should not leave it half done, should complete it, no matter what. In the same way, Self Enquiry too, ought to be carried on one stretch.

काल करे सो आज कर आज करे सो अब​
पल में परलय होएगी बहूरी करोगे कब

The work you want to do tomorrow do that today, and the work you want to do today do that just now. The destruction will occur in one second then when will you do?

Some discernment...

When we discern that intellect crossing 'Aham' cannot discover the Absolute or Brahman, and when we discenr that 'I' arises from the Absolute, and gives rise to intellect. A rippened intellect realises that intellect also is the Absolute itself and that to distinguish intellect from the Self is not right, and such a one ceases from even striving to seek the source of intellect, just remains, reposes, such a one no longer bothers about realisation, attainment, Salvation, liberation. It is only throught the intellect, the Self is able to 'experience' bliss. If there is no rise of intellect, there would be no experience of 'Self' of 'Bliss' The purpose of intellect arising is to See the Self. Once that is over

The intellect, ike a pressure cooker, stops whistles, and is brought down from fire, just is let to cool down. When the Rice (intellect) is cooked, there is no more any need to cook further. The cooking is finished!

When we say experience, we can say it as intuiotion, realisation of Self, Seeing the Self, etc...

From this context, i discern that all the major Tatvas, ie. Advaita, Dvaita and Visishtadvaita are all correct.

Advaita, realises that the risen intellect is just the Self, the Visishtadvaitin realises, intellect as Visishta, qualifiedpart of the Self, that seeks to attain prapatti of the Self, where from it origninates, the Dvaitain realises the intellect as ever seperate from Self, as the 'Chit' The Buddhist say the intellect arouse from Self that is attributeless, hence they refer it as Sunya, Sunya is nothing or everything. Infinity. They even negate Self Experience, as to experience Self, intellect as to arise from Self what Is. As Self there is nothing, no experience, no Self Experience as well. Therefore, Intellect arises only to taste the Self, See the Self, Intellect is a mirror.

What matter what Tatva it is, it is no more of any importance.

What is important is that, when one sees the essence of all these, one becomes really grounded and does not fly in the ether of unawareness. Be it Advaita, Dvaita, Visihtadvaita or sunyata.

He no more is in any race, be it worldly or spiritually. He is no longer inspired or longs to attain some goal. He is.

General Discussion / obilerating thoughts
« on: September 21, 2012, 08:59:48 AM »
thoughts are like sparks of fire, inflamed and flying all around one. Taking the full pot of water in the form of the remembrance of the Name of the Lord, put out the fire-like thoughts.

the thought of the Name of the Lord is the [true] thought. All other thoughts are of no use. Whatever one thinks about without the Name, those are all of the death-noose of “kal” (time of death)

Even in the path of Enquiry, may get lost in some nitty gritties of Enquiry, and may get lost in intellect plane. So in those moments, when one is unable to abide steadfast in the true meditation of Self and when one is unable to truly stay with the source of 'I' chanting, remembering the name of Lord is best alternative, that serves the same purpose.


General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: September 21, 2012, 08:29:38 AM »
Dear Sir,

Wonderful expressions! what can be responded back to such ecstatic out-pours of Manickavachakar

Some expressions of Jnaneshwar:

If it be said
That there was then no need
To begin to write such a work as this,
I would have to reply that
We are describing what is already self-evident
Only out of love for it.

What can we offer ourselves
In the form of exposition?

Even the ten Upanishads
Cannot approach this silent speech;
There, the intellect becomes
Absorbed in itself.

Jnanadeva says,
“This is the sweet Nectar
Of Mystical Experience.
Even those who are liberated
Should have a drink of it.”

Jnanadeva says,
“May everyone in the universe
Enjoy this feast of
The Nectar of Mystical Experience.”

Narayana also means as follows:

Ayana means Abode/residence, Nara means beings, therefore Narayana also means the abode/residence of all beings. Which conveys the Atma Tatva, It is in Self, everything is. In Him everything rests.

Naar also means water, therefore, Narayana also means He or that who/which resides or lay in the waters. here, Water or Nar signifies the cosmic ocean,  where He is the heart of the whole unlimited cosmic ocean.

Naar also means spirituality as well, therefore Narayana also means, that which is the home of all divinity, spirituality, etc..

General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: September 20, 2012, 07:18:16 PM »
When realisation came to me, I was filled with joy and all fear departed from me.
I found pure deliverance in the realm of the unapproachable, the unthinkable.

The Unapproachable has come near, the message of the Unthinkable abides with me always, the Unutterable find utterance.
From separation I have come to Union.
The bonds of self are loosened, all error has fled, and the light of the Brahman shines upon my soul.

Dadu says: I am neither Hindu nor Muslim
I am not attached to any of the six philosophical schools.
I love the merciful God.

In cutting Brahma up into bits the sects have divided him.
Dadu says: abandon limited thought in favour of the unlimited and become non-sectarian (nipakh).

Dadu says: since I am non-sectarian, the people are all in anger against me.

I have found that God is unchangeable, immortal, fearless, self-existent,
Almighty, pure, unimaged, unseen, infinite and incomprehensible.
Worship is due to Him and Him alone.

(Dadu Dayal, 15th Century Mystic)

Two personalities from Mahabharatha, that touch deeply my heart were Bhishma and Karna. Both took the side where there is no righteousness. Even though both knew that their choice was wrong but they stuck to his choice to keep their promises they made to father and friend respectively. Their Tapas is unparalleled. Coupled with this, if one takes a look at their personal lives, none would want such a life. Such sacrifice and such benevolence.

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