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Messages - Nagaraj

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General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: May 09, 2013, 12:00:21 PM »
stray thoughts..

the more we try to disassociate the body from ourselves, the more there is, the association!


General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: May 09, 2013, 11:57:36 AM »
The Buddha who had truly realized the nature of these issues observed noble silence. An ordinary person who is still unenlightened might have a lot to say, but all of it would be sheer conjecture based on his imagination.

The Buddha’s silence regarding these questions is more meaningful than attempting to deliver thousands of discourses on them. The paucity of our human vocabulary, which is built upon relative experiences, cannot hope to convey the depth and dimensions of Reality, which a person has not himself experienced through Insight. On several occasions, the Buddha had very patiently explained that human language was too limited and could not describe the Ultimate Truth.

If the Ultimate Truth is absolute, then it does not have any point of reference for worldlings with only mundane experiences and relative understanding to fully comprehend it. When they try to do so with their limited mental conception, they misunderstand the Truth like the seven blind men and the elephant. The listener who had not realized the Truth could not fathom the explanation given, just like a man who was blind since birth will have no way of truly understanding the color of the sky.

  The Buddha did not attempt to give answers to all the questions put to Him. He was under no obligation to respond to meaningless questions, which reflected gross misunderstanding on the part of spiritual development. He was a practical Teacher, full of compassion and wisdom. He always spoke to people fully understanding their temperament, capability, and capacity to comprehend. When a person asked questions not with the intention to learn how to lead a religious life but simply to create an opportunity for splitting hairs, the Blessed One did not answer these questions. Questions were answered to help a person towards self-realization, not as a way of showing His towering wisdom.

(Godwin Samararatne)


General Discussion / Re: Quotes of Nagarjuna
« on: May 09, 2013, 11:41:34 AM »
अस्तीति शाश्वतग्राहो नास्तीत्युच्चेददर्शनं ।
तस्माद् अस्तित्वनास्तित्वे नाश्रीयेत विचक्षणः॥

astīti śāśvatagrāho nāstītyuccedadarśanaṁ
tasmād astitvanāstitve nāśrīyeta vicakṣaṇaḥ

To say "it is" is to grasp for permanence. To say "it is not" is to adopt the view of nihilism.
Therefore a wise person does not say "exists" or "does not exist"

(mula madhyamaka karika, chap 15, 10)

The real truth revealed by Buddha actually is the Mauna of Dakshinamurthy! Predominantly, the Buddhist saints attributed 'Self' as 'Ego' as to really there would be no need for the Self to claim as Self, hence the Anatma expression, which means the attributelessness of the Self, as per the Vedas.

It goes to reveal that what Buddha has spoken off is verily the Vedas themselves, but without any background of Vedanta, he simply spoke or expressed his own expressions in his own authority.

Truth is eternal and same. expressions may wary, on how it is seen.


General Discussion / Re: Quotes of Nagarjuna
« on: May 09, 2013, 11:25:54 AM »
आत्मेत्यपि प्रज्ञपितमनात्मेत्यपि देशितं ।
बुद्धैर्नात्मा न चानात्मा कश्चिदित्यपि देशितं ॥

aatmetyapi prajnyapitamanaatmetyapi deshitam
budhdhairnaatmaa na caanaatmaa kashchidityapi deshitam

The Buddhas have make known the conception of self and taught the
doctrine of no-self.

At the same time, they have not spoken of something
as the self or as the non-self.

(mula madhyamaka karika, chap 18, 6)


General Discussion / Re: Teachings of Sri Ramakrishna
« on: May 09, 2013, 10:25:09 AM »

"A man may not know the right path, but if he has bhakti and the desire to know God, then he
attains Him through the force of sheer bhakti. Once a sincere devotee set out on a pilgrimage to the temple of
Jagannath in Puri. He did not know the way; he went west instead of south. He no doubt strayed from the
right path, but he always eagerly asked people the way, and they gave him the right directions, saying, 'This is
not the path; follow that one.' At last the devotee was able to get to Puri and worship the Deity. So you see,
even if you are ignorant, someone will tell you the way if you are earnest."

(The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna)


Tripura Rahasya and other ancient works / Re: Nectar from rAmAyanA
« on: May 08, 2013, 11:04:36 AM »
Stray thoughts...

Just because Sri Rama decided to stick to his decision to honour 'what is' or Dharma or 'Ulladu', everybody else were saved from transgression of committing sin of acting against Dharma.

His father Dasharatha, wanted to stop Kaikeyi by force, and wanted to so much dishonour his vow made to Kaikeyi, of sending Rama to Forests and install Bharatas the King. but he could not do so at Rama's steadfastness in honouring his fathers words. His sin was averted!

Mother Kausalya, wanted to desert his husband, due to his actions! This sin was averted!

Lakshmanas anger and intentions to restore the honour of his beloved brother! These sins were averted!

Bharata's rage averted!

Just a moment of flashes, how one person's Tapas transcends all boundaries and saves the near and dear ones. Such is the power of honouring Dharma.

IT is difficult, but the good things are not openly seen or felt when the mind is agitated.

Is it simply said?

Ramo Vigrahavan Dharma
"Rama is the embodiment of Dharma"

There are plenty of small small instances that require careful study of Ramayana, by which we can derive the ambrosial nectar by which we can uplift ourselves and move out of humanly delusions and fears.

पिबरे राम रसम् रसने
पिबरे राम रसम् ॥

दूरीकृत पातक  संसर्गम् 
पूरित नानाविध फल वर्गम् ॥१॥

           Drink the nectar of rAmA,
Drink the nectar of rAmA

it removes the sins and bestows
various type fruits (of life and jnyAnA)


General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: May 06, 2013, 09:37:46 PM »
Stray thoughts...

When it dawns or when we realise or see for ourselves that it is Gods will alone that truly prevails then what results is that the ego may not be gone all out yet but it will be fully shaken out of its wits and nerves and never to be steady again. Every moment thereon will be new and uncertain. Our own decisions and plans can no longer be trusted anymore!


Translations and Commentaries by Forum Members / Re: Stories
« on: May 05, 2013, 10:53:59 AM »
Wonderful stories you are posting Sri Jewel.


General Discussion / Re: Teachings of Sri Ramakrishna
« on: May 05, 2013, 10:46:32 AM »

   "When the heart becomes pure through the practice of spiritual discipline, then one rightly feels that God alone is the Doer. He alone has become mind, life, and intelligence. We are only His instruments. Thou it is that holdest the elephant in the mire; Thou, that helpest the lame man scale the loftiest hill.

"When your heart becomes pure, then you will realize that it is God who makes us perform such rites as the Purascharana.

Thou workest Thine own work; men only call it theirs.

"All doubts disappear after the realization of God. Then the devotee meets the favourable wind. He becomes free from worry. He is like the boatman who, when the favourable wind blows, unfurls the sail, holds the rudder lightly, and enjoys a smoke."

(The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna)


The Srimad Bhagavata / Re: Contemplating on BhagavatSwarupam
« on: May 04, 2013, 06:39:07 PM »
Am I right in assuming that this does not mean one should stop performing their duties but instead do their best with the clear understanding that it is God who is performing through us. If we do sharanagati to Guru/God and not focus on the fruits of our actions, the blessing and grace that has made us aware of these beautiful teachings will wake us up from this long dream(wakeful state) and problems.

Interesting posts, Sri Sanjay, Sri Jewel, Subramanian Sir,

i would like to express my 2 pieces of thoughts :)

Lataji, this doubt or question comes along with the doership. Without the Doership, there is neither. There ought to be the Doer ego to either Stop performing the duty or in performance of duty! The wisdom is beyond both. There is neither of both there, there such questions or doubts do not arise, of that of doership of performance or non-performance of some duty!

Any doubt only arises only with the doership.

True Sharanagati occurs at the dawn of Jnana, of knowledge, that there is absolutely that can be claimed as ours! Therefore the root of Doership depends on the water of attachment or possession, only if we have something to claim as mine, only then can there be a doer and the need to neutralise this doer or the goal of attainment of Sharanagati.

Surrendering the fruits of actions, then can no longer be called as THYAGA or Sacrifice, as when it dawns that even the fruits of our actions do not really belong to us, how can we claim it? Even though we may enjoy certain things from this body-instrument of ours, truly He alone is the real enjoyer, thereafter.

He is the Karta, He is the Bhokta as well.

We are swallowed!

When 'I am' also His, what remains? I cannot claim myself, that would be error and birth of samsara!


General Discussion / Re: my musings
« on: May 04, 2013, 08:59:40 AM »
One day the Buddha held up a flower in front of a large audience. he did not say anything for quite a long time. The audience was perfectly silent. Everyone seemed to be thinking hard, trying to see the meaning behind the Buddha's gesture. Then, suddenly, the Buddha smiled. He smiled because someone in the audience smiled at him and at the flower.

When someone holds up a flower and shows it to you, he wants you to see it. If you keep thinking, you miss the flower. The person who was not thinking, who was just himself, was able to encounter the flower in depth, and he smiled. 


General Discussion / Re: Teachings of Sri Ramakrishna
« on: May 02, 2013, 06:15:02 PM »
"Look here. If a man truly believes that God alone does everything, that He is the Operator and man the machine, then such a man is verily liberated in life. 'Thou workest Thine own work; men only call it theirs.' Do you know what it is like? Vedānta philosophy gives an illustration.  Suppose you are cooking rice in a pot, with potato, egg-plant, and other vegetables. After a while the potatoes, eggplant, rice, and the rest begin to jump about in the pot. They seem to say with pride: 'We are moving! We are jumping!' The children see it and think the potatoes, egg-plant, and rice are alive and so they jump that way. But the elders, who know, explain to the children that the vegetables and the rice are not alive; they jump not of themselves, but because of the fire under the pot; if you remove the burning wood from the hearth, then they will move no more. Likewise the pride of man, that he is the doer, springs from ignorance. Men are powerful because of the power of God. All becomes quiet when that burning wood is taken away. The puppets dance well on the stage when pulled by a wire, but they cannot move when the wire snaps."

(The Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna)


The Srimad Bhagavata / Re: Contemplating on BhagavatSwarupam
« on: May 02, 2013, 05:48:25 PM »
Dear Latha,


I just realised that Krishna had responded to your query posted on  May 04, 2012 i am not sure, and i expressed believing you have posted as of today. If the same question lasts now in you, however this has been a beneficial contemplation for me.


The Srimad Bhagavata / Re: Contemplating on BhagavatSwarupam
« on: May 02, 2013, 05:40:52 PM »

   Dear Latha,

From my own limited experience, i can share with you that, this is no brahma vidya or any some great secret knowledge has to be derived, what i have discerned about seeing Bhagavan in all beings is to simply begin seeing Bhagavan this very moment, in everybody and every thing! Simply as a matter of fact! What is there out there other than Bhagavan? We always have two choices with us, it is to either to see the other as an ordinary being or we have the divine choice to see the other as Saakshaat Bhagavat Swaroopam Himself. The choice is ours. The more we are able to see Bhagavan in all we are in Paramaarthikam and the lesser, that is seeing others as ordinary beings, we dwelve in vyvavahaathikam!

As Bhagavan says the only choice we have or freewill we truly have is to desire the Lord or Self. It is merely a matter of our purushaartham, that we begin to see Bhagavan in one and all. I am reminded this wonderful small story as told by Sri Ramakrishar -

Seeing God in everything

"There was a monastery in a certain place. The monks residing there went out daily to beg their food. One day a monk, while out for his alms, saw a landlord beating a man mercilessly. The compassionate monk stepped in and asked the landlord to stop. But the landlord was filled with anger and turned his wrath against the innocent monk. He beat the monk till he fell unconscious on the ground. Someone reported the matter to the monastery. The monks ran to the spot and found their brother lying there.
Four or five of them carried him back and laid him on a bed. He was still unconscious. The other monks sat around him sad at heart; some were fanning him. Finally someone suggested that he should be given a little milk to drink. When it was poured into his mouth he regained consciousness. He opened his eyes and looked around. One of the monks said, 'Let us see whether he is fully conscious and can recognize us.' Shouting into his ear, he said, 'Revered sir, who is giving you milk?' 'Brother,' replied the holy man in a low voice, 'He who beat me is now giving me milk.'

"But one does not attain such a state of mind without the realization of God."

It comes with small beginning. Lets just simply begin seeing everything as Bhagavan. The Goods and the Bads, the nice and the not so nice, the ones that are to be shunned and the one that are to be imbibed, etc... There is no secret. as you would have heard Acharya quote in one of his talks, it comes with faith, he quoted from Adi Shankara (dont remember now) The Guru says so, therefore Shivoham Shivoham. Repeated satsang with such SatGuru itself would take us to that. We have to maintain that current and not dissipate it off in mundane affairs.


Tripura Rahasya and other ancient works / Re: Nectar from rAmAyanA
« on: May 02, 2013, 11:13:56 AM »

   Lakshmana shook with an uncontrollable rage. He stomped around with flailing arms flashing eyes and stormy demeanor, making him seem like an intoxicated tusker. To this fiery embodiment of fury, whose sighs sounded like the hissing of king cobras Rama quietly said

“Lakshmana! Your anger against our father and your sorrow for me has to be restrained. The coronation has not been stopped for any lack of competence on your part, so it is of no disgrace to you. Do show the same zeal in procuring things for my exile, as you did for my coronation. As for mother Kausalya, I rely on you to dispel her doubts about my ever becoming ruler of Ayodhya. It grieves me to see her agonizing over me, but the king will be distressed if his promises are violated. His distress will also be mine. My early departure will make queen Kaikeyi happy and clear the way for Bharata’s installation.

“Listen Lakshmana! To be given a kingdom for a moment, only for it to be snatched away the next, is merely an act of the Gods. The merciless utterances of mother Kaikeyi, to prevent my coronation are destiny. My banishment now and my enthronement later, is destiny. How otherwise, can a princess so noble, so virtuous, ill-treat me like a common shrew, in the presence of her king and consort? Even the devatas cannot allay the mysterious forces of destiny. It is this unalterable judgment that has altered my fortune and Kaikeyi’s feelings for me. No man can conquer fate. Good and evil, fear and anger, gain and loss, being and non-being and all that they involve are ruled by destiny.”

“Even sages in all their glory, driven by that mysterious force, fall prey to it. Rendered victims of their anger and passion they lose the powers of their immense penance. A coronation stops mid-way, is that not destiny? I see no reason to bemoan it. Stop sorrowing; help me depart in peace and not in turbulence. To me, whether it is a palace or a forest makes no difference. Banished to live amidst exotic forest life is a joy. It is more a blessing than a bane, for a crown comes with a price and many demands. A forest has no demands! I will have the good fortune to see the greatest of sages and ascetics who live in sylvan solitude.”

Noble and compassionate to the core, Rama did not abandon thoughts of Kaikeyi. Protective to the end, his kindness compelled him to remind Lakshmana that the reason why the crown chose to rest on a head other than his was not Kaikeyi. He said it was purely an act of destiny condoned by the gods.

“Do you now realize the powers of the divine Lakshmana?”

asked Rama.

(Excerpts from Ayodhyakanda Sarga 22)


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