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Messages - atmavichar100

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General Discussion / Re: Swami Sivananda's Teachings and Quotes
« on: April 14, 2015, 06:10:23 PM »
Conserve every bit of energy within. Do not waste your time and energy by entering into hot discussions, intellectual gymnastics and lingual warfare. Give up all arguments and discussions entirely. You will progress on the spiritual path. If you meditate for half an hour you will be able to face the daily battle of life with peace and spiritual strength for one week through the force of meditation. Such is the beneficial effect of meditation. As you have to move with many different minds of peculiar nature, get the requisite strength and peace from meditation and be free from worry and trouble~Swami Sivananda

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 12, 2015, 08:57:01 PM »


Q: I am puzzled by some aspects of this teaching. There is no doubt that Bhagavan was realized, but in that state he was still aware of his body. When Bhagavan was ill he didn't say, ?I have pain,' he said, ?It has pain? . Since he had awareness of that pain in the body he must still have been a little identified with it?

AS: Even when the body was experiencing pain, Bhagavan was beyond it. He was not affected by anything that was happening to the body.

Q: He was beyond in the sense that he was not concerned or troubled by it, but he was still aware that the body was experiencing pain.

AS: There was an awareness of pain but there was no feeling, ?This is my body; I have pain?. You can be aware of birds flying in and out of a tree without thinking, 'I am this tree, these birds are mine'' similarly Bhagavan could be aware of bodily sensations without thinking 'I am this body; this pain is mine?; Bhagavan wore a body in the same way that other people wear a dhoti.

You are attaching too much importance to bodies, both
Bhagavan's and your own. It is possible to exist without' being
aware of the body in any way. Your experience in deep sleep should satisfy you that this is possible. Your questions and doubts are all coming from the body-mind level, from the idea that you are a body and a person. You can find out what the relationship
between the body and the Self is by experiencing the Self as it really is. But to get that experience you must first be willing to give up the idea that you are a body and a person. You will never have the experience while you are still clinging to erroneous ideas about the body. You will not resolve your doubts about the body by discussing them, you will only resolve them by giving them up.

- Living by the Words of Bhagavan

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 12, 2015, 08:47:44 PM »
Date: 16.9.42 Time: 10.15 A.M.

50. When I entered the hall a discussion was going on about self-enquiry. Bhagavan was in his usual posture with adorable countenance. A frequent visitor said:
?Bhagavan has said that self-enquiry is simple, direct and effective. Though I try to follow the same I cannot say I have understood it. I put the question 'Who am I?' but there is no proper response from within. However, I am getting a sort of stillness. ?
Bhagavan: "How can you get the answer in words? It is not a regular mental enquiry to elicit a concrete answer. It is only a tool to direct the mind back to its source."
Visitor: "Yes, I follow. But the result is not clear to me. There is a short stillness which does not last."
Bhagavan: "You should be steadfast in sadhana. By repeating the process you fix attention on the ego, the 'I'- thought. Whenever the doubt arises repeat the process and make the enquiry. Try to reach the source of the ego. Once you reach the source, by one-pointed effort, your peace will not be disturbed.''

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 12, 2015, 03:24:14 PM »
Talks with Sri Ramana Maharshi
D :
How to get rid of the mind?
M :
Is it the mind that wants to kill itself? The mind cannot kill itself. So your business is to find the real nature of the mind. Then you will know that there is no mind. When the Self is sought, the mind is nowhere. Abiding in the Self, one need not worry about the mind.

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 12, 2015, 09:28:52 AM »
D :
How to get rid of fear?

M :
What is fear? It is only a thought. If there is anything besides the Self there is reason to fear. Who sees the second (anything external)? First the ego arises and sees objects as external. If the ego does not rise, the Self alone exists and there is no second (nothing external). For anything external to oneself implies the seer within. Seeking it there will arise no doubt, no fear-not only fear, all other thoughts centred round the ego will disappear along with it.
D :
This method seems to be quicker than the usual one of cultivating qualities alleged necessary for salvation (sadhana chatushtaya)?
M :
Yes. All bad qualities centre round the ego. When the ego is gone Realisation results by itself. There are neither good nor bad qualities in the Self. The Self is free from all qualities. Qualities pertain to the mind only. It is beyond quality. If there is unity, there will also be duality. The numeral one gives rise to other numbers. The truth is neither one nor two. It is as it is.
D :
The difficulty is to be in the thought free state.
M :
Leave the thought-free state to itself. Do not think of it as pertaining to you. Just as when you walk, you involuntarily take steps, so too in your actions; but the thought-free state is not affected by your actions.
D :
What is it that discriminative in action?
M :
Discrimination will be automatic, intuitive.
D :
So intuition alone matters; Intuition develops also.
M :
Those who have discovered great Truths have done so in the still depths of the Self.
The ego is like one's shadow thrown on the ground. If one attempts to bury it, it will be foolish. The Self is only one. If limited it is the ego. If unlimited it is Infinite and is the Reality.
The bubbles are different from one another and numerous, but the ocean is only one. Similarly the egos are many, whereas the Self is one and only one.
When told that you are not the ego, realise the Reality. Why do you still identify yourself with the ego? It is like saying, Don't think of the monkey while taking medicine- it is impossible. Similarly it happens with common folk. When the Reality is mentioned why do you continue to meditate Sivoham or Aham Brahmasmi? The significance must be traced and understood. It is not enough to repeat the bare words or think of them.
Reality is simply the loss of the ego. Destroy the ego by seeking its identity. Because the ego is no entity it will automatically vanish and Reality will shine forth by itself. This is the direct method. Whereas all other methods are done, only retaining the ego. In those paths there arise so many doubts and the eternal questions remains to be tackled finally. But in this method the final question is the only one and it is raised from the very beginning. No sadhanas are necessary for engaging in this quest.
There is no greater mystery than this-viz., ourselves being the Reality we seek to gain reality. We think that there is something hiding our Reality and that it must be destroyed before the Reality is gained. It is ridiculous. A day will dawn when you will yourself laugh at your past efforts. That which will be on the day you laugh is also here and now.
D :
So it is a great game of pretending?
M :
In yoga Vasishta it is said, What is Real is hidden from us, but what is false, is revealed as true. We are actually experiencing the Reality only; still, we do not know it. Is it not a wonder of wonders?
The quest ''Who am I?'' is the axe with which to cut off the ego.
Talks with Sri Ramana Maharshi

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 09, 2015, 06:05:40 AM »

(Mind alone is the cause of man?s bondage and freedom)
? Amritabindu Upanishad

D: I have not yet learnt to control my mind so I intend to seek ekantavasam (life in solitude) in North India and want Sri Bhagavan?s grace.

B: You have come all the way to Tiruvannamalai for ekantavasam, and that in the immediate presence and vicinity of Ramana Bhagavan, yet you do not appear to have obtained that mental quiet; you now want to go elsewhere and from there you will desire to go to some other place. At this rate there will be no end to your travels.

You do not realize that it is your mind that drives you in this manner. Control that first and you will be happy wherever you are. I do not know if you have read Swami Vivekananda?s lectures. It is my impression that he has somewhere told the story of a man trying to bury his shadow and finding that over every sod of earth he put in the grave he had dug for it, it only appeared again, so that it could never be buried. Such is the case of a person who tries to bury his thoughts. One must therefore attempt to get at the very bottom from which thought springs and root out thought, mind and desire.

D: When I spent an hour or two on the hill yonder, I sometimes found even better peace than here, which suggests that a solitary place is after all more conducive to mind-control.

B: True, but if you had stayed there for an hour longer, you would have found that place too not giving you the calm of which you speak. Control the mind and even Hell will be Heaven to you. All other talk of solitude, living in a forest etc., is mere prattle.

D: If solitude and abandonment of home were not required, where then was the necessity for Sri Bhagavan to come here in his seventeenth year?

B: If the same force that took this (meaning himself ) here, should take you also out of your home by all means let it, but there is no use of your deserting your home by an effort of your own. Your duty lies in practice, continuous practice of Self-enquiry.

- Crumbs from HisTable

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 08, 2015, 09:06:40 AM »
D.: Bhagavan often says: ?The world is not outside you?, or ?everything depends on you?, or ?what is there outside you?? I find all this puzzling. The world existed before I was born and will continue to exist after my death, as it has survived the death of so many who once lived as I do now.

B.: Did I ever say that the world exists because of you? I have only put to you the question ?what exists apart from yourself?? You ought to understand that by the Self neither the physical body nor the subtle body is meant.

What you are told is that if you once know the Self within which all ideas exist, not excluding the idea of yourself, of others like you and of the world, you can realize the truth that there is a Reality, a Supreme Truth which is the Self of all the world you now see, the Self of all the selves, the one Real, the Supreme, the eternal Self, as distinct from the ego or individual being, which is impermanent. You must not mistake the ego or the bodily idea for the Self.

- Sad Darshana Bhashya

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 07, 2015, 08:46:52 PM »

If one is lucky enough to find a Guru like Bhagavan one should stay with him and serve him wholeheartedly.

Many people came to Bhagavan, did seva [service], and said that they wanted Self realization. After some time many of these people forgot the purpose for which they came to Bhagavan. They started dabbling in ashram politics and soon lost their desire for Self-realization.

Other people had a few good experiences and then left, thinking that they had nothing more to learn.

If you have the opportunity to stay with a Guru you should not waste your good fortune by leaving him or by indulging in ' activities in his vicinity.


General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 02, 2015, 01:32:27 PM »
Q: Does the Guru's grace burn up karma? Can the Guru take away

some of our past bad karma?

AS: I served Bhagavan for many years. By doing a lot of service to

Bhagavan with all my heart and my full mind, the karmas of my

previous lives were erased easily. It was all through his grace.
When this period was over Bhagavan told me, 'Your karmas are
finished'. I did not expect Bhagavan to give me such a great

Finding a great Guru like Bhagavan depends on one's karma.
One cannot hope to find such a Gum unless one has done tapas in

previous lives.

The path of jnana is for those who only have a little karma left.
Those who still have many karmas to undergo cannot follow the
path of jnana successfully because they don't have the capacity to

be still and quiet. Only those who have learned how to be still

can abide in the Self.


General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: March 31, 2015, 05:54:36 PM »
Yogi Ramiah?s Account of His Experiences
Sitting in the Maharshi?s presence brings peace of mind. I used to sit in samadhi for three or four hours together. Then I felt my mind took a form and came out from within. By constant practice and meditation it entered the Heart and was merged into it. I concluded that the Heart is the resting place of mind. The result is peace. When the mind is absorbed in the Heart, the Self is realised. This could be felt even at the stage of concentration (dharana).
I asked the Maharshi about contemplation. He taught me as follows: When a man dies the funeral pyre is prepared and the body is laid flat on the pyre. The pyre is lit. The skin is burnt, then the flesh and then the bones until the whole body falls to ashes. What remains thereafter? The mind. The question arises, ?How many are there in this body - one or two?? If two, why do people say ?I? and not ?we?? There is therefore only one. Whence is it born? What is its nature (swaroopa)? Enquiring thus the mind also disappears. Then what remains over is seen to be ?I?. The next question is ?Who am I?? The Self alone. This is contemplation. It is how I did it. By this process, attachment to the body (dehavasana) is destroyed. The ego vanishes. Self alone shines. One method of getting mind-dissolution (manolaya) is association with great ones - the yoga adepts (Yoga arudha). They are perfect adepts in samadhi. Self- Realisation has been easy, natural and perpetual to them. Those moving with them closely and in sympathetic contact gradually absorb the samadhi habit from them.
? Talks with Sri Ramana Maharshi, No. 34

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: March 31, 2015, 10:46:45 AM »

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: March 31, 2015, 09:28:10 AM »
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General Discussion / Re: Swami Sivananda's Teachings and Quotes
« on: March 30, 2015, 02:46:16 PM »
Spiritual sadhana is ultimately an effort to cease from all effort. This is the highest effort, because no one normally can be without exerting oneself in some direction. All activity is a process of moving away from the Centre. The activity to cease from such activity is sadhana.- Swami Krishnananda

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: March 25, 2015, 06:24:21 PM »

Q: Does satsang mean 'association with jnanis', or can it also mean 'association with good people' ?

AS: The real Sat, which is being, is within you. You associate with
it and get satsang every time you turn your attention towards it.
You do not need a jnani for such satsang. You can get it anywhere.

On the other hand, worldly people who are living near jnanis are often not getting satsang because they are not tuning in to the
jnanis Sat.

Some people who live near saints are just like little insects called 'unni' (cattle tick) which live on the udders of cows. They drink the blood there instead of the milk. Some people who were physically associated with Bhagavan ignored his teachings and failed to make contact with the grace he was radiating. They worked and ate at the ashram, but they got little benefit from being there. These people were not having satsang, they were just human unni.

There was a group of brahmins who were associated with Bhagavan who did not subscribe to the advaitic view, 'All is Brahman. All is the Self.' In those days we used to read a lot from the Ribhu Gita, a text which repeatedly says 'All is Brahman?.
These brahmins refused to join in because they didn't agree with the philosophy. 'Where is this Brahman you are talking about?' they would say. 'How can it be everything? How can you go on chanting "All is Brahman" when that is not your experience? Maybe these teachings are useful for people like Bhagavan, but why should people like us parrot these statements endiessly??

Bhagavan himself encouraged us to recite this text regularly.
He said that constant and frequent repetition led to samadhi. In
giving us this instruction Bhagavan was giving us a method of experiencing some of the sat that was his real nature. In effect he was offering us a highly effective form of satsang. But these
brahmins didn't want it. They wanted instead to complain about
the contents of the book. When such people willfully turn down a method of associating with Bhagavan's Sat, how can it be said that they are having his satsang?


General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: March 22, 2015, 10:28:15 AM »
During Bhagavan?s days on the Hill, Spiritual Grace was in abundance but material comforts were minimal or non-existent. It is possible that some great devotee may have advised Niranjananda Swamigal that worship of the Sri Chakra will lead to prosperity and he started the worship. But this is at best a surmise.

Dear Sri Ravi

With regard to the above quote on the worship of Si Chakra/ Sri Vidya Sadhana  for material prosperity ,I here give an incident in the life of Swami Sivananda himself .This excerpt is from the book "From Man to God-Man".  Sivananda's Personality By  Sri N. Ananthanarayanan

The Master( i.e Swami Sivananda ) did not do any formal worship of the Divine Mother. He himself clarified this point when a learned Pundit  of South India remarked that the Master must have attained perfection in Sri Vidya Upasana and that was why he succeeded in all this  undertakings.   "I have not done any formal Sri Vidya Upasana," the Master told him. "I repeat the Mantra along with several others after bath  daily. I repeat the Mantras only once. But perhaps you are right when you say that I have done Sri Vidya Upasana. It is of a different  kind. Whenever I see a woman, I mentally prostrate to her and mentally repeat some Devi Mantra, like ?Om Sri Durgayai Namah?. I look  upon all women as the embodiments of the Divine Mother. When I apply the sacred vermillion to my forehead, I repeat, ?Om Hrim Om?. This  constitutes my Sri Vidya Upasana."
The Master taught his disciples what a Sannyasin should be, what a saint should be. He was a living example of a Sthitaprajna?a man  of unbroken serenity. He had a mind which nothing could shake; nothing could cause a ripple or ruffle in it. It was indeed an  extraordinary mind. There is a saying: Learn by doing; teach by being. The Master taught by both doing and being. "Bear insult, bear injury; this is the highest Sadhana," was his favourite saying?and he was the very personification of it.


So that say's it all . While great saints build temples , Veda Patashalas in their Asharms and see to it the proper rituals are done daily without fail to maintain the tradition of worship of forms and also to maintain a spirtually vibrant atmosphere in the Ashram but they themselves do not do any sort of secret sadhana to get material prosperity .

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