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Messages - atmavichar100

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Glad to note that you and your family are safe .

Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya

Pointer - 21
Bhagavan on Mind

Talk 238

In answer to some question Maharshi said :
There is a state when words cease and silence prevails.

D :
How to communicate thought to each other?

M :
That is only when there is the notion of two.

D :
How to get peace?

M :
That is the natural state. The mind obstruct the innate peace. Our investigation is only in the mind. Investigate the mind; it will disappear.

There is no entity by name mind. Because of the emergence of thoughts we surmise something from which they start. That we term mind. When we probe to see what it is, there is nothing like it. After it has vanished, Peace will be found to remain eternal.

D :
What is buddhi (intellect)?

M :
The thinking or discriminating faculty. These are mere names. Be it the ego, the mind or the intellect, it is all the same. Whose mind? Whose intellect? The ego's. Is the ego real? No. We confound the ego and call it intellect or mind.

D :
Emerson says, Soul answers soul by itself-not by description of words.

M :
Quite so. However much you learn, there will be no bounds to knowledge. You ignore the doubter but try to solve the doubts. On the other hand, hold on to the doubter and the doubts will disppear.

D :
Then the question resolves itself to knowing the Self.

M :
Quite so.


Talk 235

Mr.T.K.S Iyer, a disciple, was excited because someone in the town had spoken disparagingly of the Master. He did not retort and came away excited. So he asked Master what penalty should ba paid for his failure to defend him.

Maharshi :
Patience, more patience; tolerence, more tolerence!


Self-enquiry practice from 'BE AS YOU ARE'

Question: I want to be further enlightened. Should I try to make no efforts at all?
Sri Ramana Maharshi: Here it is impossible for you to be without effort. When you go deeper, it is impossible for you to make any effort. If the mind becomes introverted through enquiry into the source of Aham-Vritti (ego-sense), the Vasanas (mental tendencies) become extinct. The light of the Self falls on the Vasanas and produces the phenomenon of reflection we call the mind. Thus, when the Vasanas become extinct the mind also disappears, being absorbed into the light of the one reality, the Heart. This is the sum and substance of all that an aspirant needs to know. What is imperatively required of him is an earnest and one-pointed enquiry into the source of the Aham-Vritti.

Edited by David Godman

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 16, 2015, 05:19:10 PM »
Talk 213
Devotee :
Why the mind cannot be turned inward in spite of repeated attempts.

Maharshi :
It is done by practice and dispassion and that succeeds only gradually. The mind, having been so long a cow accustomed to graze stealthily on others estates, is not easily confined to her stall. However much her keeper tempts her with luscious grass and fine fodder, she refuses the first time; then she takes a bit; but her innate tendency to stray away asserts itself; and she slips away; on being repeatedly tempted by the owner, she accustomed herself to the stall; finally even if let loose she would not stray away. Similarly with the mind. If once it finds its inner happiness it will not wander outward.

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 15, 2015, 10:19:33 AM »
It is distinctly stated in the Upanishads that the life- force of a Brahmanishtha never leaves his body, but inheres in the heart itself. If the Samadhi (tomb) is properly maintained and approached, it will confer inestimable bliss on the devotee, granting him boons.
This view is supported by Tirumular?s ?Tiru-mantram?, a Tamil classic, which states that the Jnani, whether in the embodied or disembodied state, is Brahman Himself and, as the Guru of all his children, personally takes care of them and blesses them. This authoritative work also proclaims the omnipresent character of the Jnani after giving up his body. Again, the Agamas state that, even if the Brahmanishtha has decided to cast off his coat and take up his abode elsewhere, he leaves in his old body one of his sixteen kalas, which is all powerful, to shed forth his blessing.
If it is felt that Sri Ramana is still actually in our midst and his presence is to be found most easily at the spot where he lived so long and his body is buried, surely this is only natural. Is it not the tradition amongst all great religions of the world, with no exception? Even the Muslims revere the graves of accredited saints, while the Buddhists go on tiresome pilgrimages just to pay reverence to some relic. People do not take all this trouble unless they feel there is a very good reason.
When Sri Ramana lay dying, people went to him and begged him to remain for a while longer as they needed his help. His reply is well known.
?Go! Where can I go? I shall always be here.?
The power of Sri Ramana, who gave up his physical form has not diminished. He is everywhere, like the light in a room shed by an electric bulb. But the light is found to be far stronger near the bulb, the source of light, than in any other part of the room, though no spot is in darkness. What wonder, then, if the power of our Guru is found near the place where his body is interred?
- Major Chadwick, 'A Sadhu?s Reminiscences of Ramana Maharshi'

General Discussion / Re: Swami Sivananda's Teachings and Quotes
« on: April 14, 2015, 06:10:23 PM »
Conserve every bit of energy within. Do not waste your time and energy by entering into hot discussions, intellectual gymnastics and lingual warfare. Give up all arguments and discussions entirely. You will progress on the spiritual path. If you meditate for half an hour you will be able to face the daily battle of life with peace and spiritual strength for one week through the force of meditation. Such is the beneficial effect of meditation. As you have to move with many different minds of peculiar nature, get the requisite strength and peace from meditation and be free from worry and trouble~Swami Sivananda

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 12, 2015, 08:57:01 PM »


Q: I am puzzled by some aspects of this teaching. There is no doubt that Bhagavan was realized, but in that state he was still aware of his body. When Bhagavan was ill he didn't say, ?I have pain,' he said, ?It has pain? . Since he had awareness of that pain in the body he must still have been a little identified with it?

AS: Even when the body was experiencing pain, Bhagavan was beyond it. He was not affected by anything that was happening to the body.

Q: He was beyond in the sense that he was not concerned or troubled by it, but he was still aware that the body was experiencing pain.

AS: There was an awareness of pain but there was no feeling, ?This is my body; I have pain?. You can be aware of birds flying in and out of a tree without thinking, 'I am this tree, these birds are mine'' similarly Bhagavan could be aware of bodily sensations without thinking 'I am this body; this pain is mine?; Bhagavan wore a body in the same way that other people wear a dhoti.

You are attaching too much importance to bodies, both
Bhagavan's and your own. It is possible to exist without' being
aware of the body in any way. Your experience in deep sleep should satisfy you that this is possible. Your questions and doubts are all coming from the body-mind level, from the idea that you are a body and a person. You can find out what the relationship
between the body and the Self is by experiencing the Self as it really is. But to get that experience you must first be willing to give up the idea that you are a body and a person. You will never have the experience while you are still clinging to erroneous ideas about the body. You will not resolve your doubts about the body by discussing them, you will only resolve them by giving them up.

- Living by the Words of Bhagavan

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 12, 2015, 08:47:44 PM »
Date: 16.9.42 Time: 10.15 A.M.

50. When I entered the hall a discussion was going on about self-enquiry. Bhagavan was in his usual posture with adorable countenance. A frequent visitor said:
?Bhagavan has said that self-enquiry is simple, direct and effective. Though I try to follow the same I cannot say I have understood it. I put the question 'Who am I?' but there is no proper response from within. However, I am getting a sort of stillness. ?
Bhagavan: "How can you get the answer in words? It is not a regular mental enquiry to elicit a concrete answer. It is only a tool to direct the mind back to its source."
Visitor: "Yes, I follow. But the result is not clear to me. There is a short stillness which does not last."
Bhagavan: "You should be steadfast in sadhana. By repeating the process you fix attention on the ego, the 'I'- thought. Whenever the doubt arises repeat the process and make the enquiry. Try to reach the source of the ego. Once you reach the source, by one-pointed effort, your peace will not be disturbed.''

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 12, 2015, 03:24:14 PM »
Talks with Sri Ramana Maharshi
D :
How to get rid of the mind?
M :
Is it the mind that wants to kill itself? The mind cannot kill itself. So your business is to find the real nature of the mind. Then you will know that there is no mind. When the Self is sought, the mind is nowhere. Abiding in the Self, one need not worry about the mind.

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 12, 2015, 09:28:52 AM »
D :
How to get rid of fear?

M :
What is fear? It is only a thought. If there is anything besides the Self there is reason to fear. Who sees the second (anything external)? First the ego arises and sees objects as external. If the ego does not rise, the Self alone exists and there is no second (nothing external). For anything external to oneself implies the seer within. Seeking it there will arise no doubt, no fear-not only fear, all other thoughts centred round the ego will disappear along with it.
D :
This method seems to be quicker than the usual one of cultivating qualities alleged necessary for salvation (sadhana chatushtaya)?
M :
Yes. All bad qualities centre round the ego. When the ego is gone Realisation results by itself. There are neither good nor bad qualities in the Self. The Self is free from all qualities. Qualities pertain to the mind only. It is beyond quality. If there is unity, there will also be duality. The numeral one gives rise to other numbers. The truth is neither one nor two. It is as it is.
D :
The difficulty is to be in the thought free state.
M :
Leave the thought-free state to itself. Do not think of it as pertaining to you. Just as when you walk, you involuntarily take steps, so too in your actions; but the thought-free state is not affected by your actions.
D :
What is it that discriminative in action?
M :
Discrimination will be automatic, intuitive.
D :
So intuition alone matters; Intuition develops also.
M :
Those who have discovered great Truths have done so in the still depths of the Self.
The ego is like one's shadow thrown on the ground. If one attempts to bury it, it will be foolish. The Self is only one. If limited it is the ego. If unlimited it is Infinite and is the Reality.
The bubbles are different from one another and numerous, but the ocean is only one. Similarly the egos are many, whereas the Self is one and only one.
When told that you are not the ego, realise the Reality. Why do you still identify yourself with the ego? It is like saying, Don't think of the monkey while taking medicine- it is impossible. Similarly it happens with common folk. When the Reality is mentioned why do you continue to meditate Sivoham or Aham Brahmasmi? The significance must be traced and understood. It is not enough to repeat the bare words or think of them.
Reality is simply the loss of the ego. Destroy the ego by seeking its identity. Because the ego is no entity it will automatically vanish and Reality will shine forth by itself. This is the direct method. Whereas all other methods are done, only retaining the ego. In those paths there arise so many doubts and the eternal questions remains to be tackled finally. But in this method the final question is the only one and it is raised from the very beginning. No sadhanas are necessary for engaging in this quest.
There is no greater mystery than this-viz., ourselves being the Reality we seek to gain reality. We think that there is something hiding our Reality and that it must be destroyed before the Reality is gained. It is ridiculous. A day will dawn when you will yourself laugh at your past efforts. That which will be on the day you laugh is also here and now.
D :
So it is a great game of pretending?
M :
In yoga Vasishta it is said, What is Real is hidden from us, but what is false, is revealed as true. We are actually experiencing the Reality only; still, we do not know it. Is it not a wonder of wonders?
The quest ''Who am I?'' is the axe with which to cut off the ego.
Talks with Sri Ramana Maharshi

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 09, 2015, 06:05:40 AM »

(Mind alone is the cause of man?s bondage and freedom)
? Amritabindu Upanishad

D: I have not yet learnt to control my mind so I intend to seek ekantavasam (life in solitude) in North India and want Sri Bhagavan?s grace.

B: You have come all the way to Tiruvannamalai for ekantavasam, and that in the immediate presence and vicinity of Ramana Bhagavan, yet you do not appear to have obtained that mental quiet; you now want to go elsewhere and from there you will desire to go to some other place. At this rate there will be no end to your travels.

You do not realize that it is your mind that drives you in this manner. Control that first and you will be happy wherever you are. I do not know if you have read Swami Vivekananda?s lectures. It is my impression that he has somewhere told the story of a man trying to bury his shadow and finding that over every sod of earth he put in the grave he had dug for it, it only appeared again, so that it could never be buried. Such is the case of a person who tries to bury his thoughts. One must therefore attempt to get at the very bottom from which thought springs and root out thought, mind and desire.

D: When I spent an hour or two on the hill yonder, I sometimes found even better peace than here, which suggests that a solitary place is after all more conducive to mind-control.

B: True, but if you had stayed there for an hour longer, you would have found that place too not giving you the calm of which you speak. Control the mind and even Hell will be Heaven to you. All other talk of solitude, living in a forest etc., is mere prattle.

D: If solitude and abandonment of home were not required, where then was the necessity for Sri Bhagavan to come here in his seventeenth year?

B: If the same force that took this (meaning himself ) here, should take you also out of your home by all means let it, but there is no use of your deserting your home by an effort of your own. Your duty lies in practice, continuous practice of Self-enquiry.

- Crumbs from HisTable

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 08, 2015, 09:06:40 AM »
D.: Bhagavan often says: ?The world is not outside you?, or ?everything depends on you?, or ?what is there outside you?? I find all this puzzling. The world existed before I was born and will continue to exist after my death, as it has survived the death of so many who once lived as I do now.

B.: Did I ever say that the world exists because of you? I have only put to you the question ?what exists apart from yourself?? You ought to understand that by the Self neither the physical body nor the subtle body is meant.

What you are told is that if you once know the Self within which all ideas exist, not excluding the idea of yourself, of others like you and of the world, you can realize the truth that there is a Reality, a Supreme Truth which is the Self of all the world you now see, the Self of all the selves, the one Real, the Supreme, the eternal Self, as distinct from the ego or individual being, which is impermanent. You must not mistake the ego or the bodily idea for the Self.

- Sad Darshana Bhashya

General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 07, 2015, 08:46:52 PM »

If one is lucky enough to find a Guru like Bhagavan one should stay with him and serve him wholeheartedly.

Many people came to Bhagavan, did seva [service], and said that they wanted Self realization. After some time many of these people forgot the purpose for which they came to Bhagavan. They started dabbling in ashram politics and soon lost their desire for Self-realization.

Other people had a few good experiences and then left, thinking that they had nothing more to learn.

If you have the opportunity to stay with a Guru you should not waste your good fortune by leaving him or by indulging in ' activities in his vicinity.


General Discussion / Re: Rough Notebook-Open Forum
« on: April 02, 2015, 01:32:27 PM »
Q: Does the Guru's grace burn up karma? Can the Guru take away

some of our past bad karma?

AS: I served Bhagavan for many years. By doing a lot of service to

Bhagavan with all my heart and my full mind, the karmas of my

previous lives were erased easily. It was all through his grace.
When this period was over Bhagavan told me, 'Your karmas are
finished'. I did not expect Bhagavan to give me such a great

Finding a great Guru like Bhagavan depends on one's karma.
One cannot hope to find such a Gum unless one has done tapas in

previous lives.

The path of jnana is for those who only have a little karma left.
Those who still have many karmas to undergo cannot follow the
path of jnana successfully because they don't have the capacity to

be still and quiet. Only those who have learned how to be still

can abide in the Self.


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