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Messages - atmavichar100

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Ashrams / Re: Impressions from travels to Tiruvannamalai
« on: November 22, 2012, 03:46:27 PM »
Subramaniam Sir

Even Adi Shankara has said a similar thing about Satsangha in his Bhaja Govindam :

Sat-sangatve nissangatvam nissangatve nirmohatvam
Nirmohatve nishchala-tattvam nishchala-tattve jivanmuktih

Satsangga i.e Good and virtuous company gives rise to non-attachment. From non-attachment comes freedom from delusion. With freedom from delusion, one feels the changeless reality. Experiencing that changeless reality, one attains liberation in this life.

Adi Shankara in Bhaja Govindam

I remember even Bhagwan saying in one of the advice for a spiritual aspirant i.e first step is satsangha and rest will follow accordingly .

Today i.e Thu 22 Nov 2012 is a Thanksgiving day .
Thanksgiving is celebrated each year on the fourth Thursday of November in the United States  .Thanksgiving Day is a time for many people to give thanks for what they have.Thanksgiving Day is traditionally a day for families and friends to get together for a special meal. In Indian Context we can say Pongal festival as equivalent to Thanksgiving day .

This is the story on ThanksGiving Day  that I read in 1996 from the book "Notes from a Friend" by Anthony Robbins that made a very positive impact on me ( I had never known about Thanks Giving day before )

One Man’s Story— Importance of Thanksgiving day 

On Thanksgiving many years ago, a young family awoke with a sense of foreboding. Instead of looking forward to a day filled with gratitude, they were preoccupied by thoughts of what they did not have. At best, they would scrape together a meager meal on this day of “feasting.” If they had contacted a local charity group, they would have had a turkey with all the trimmings, but they hadn’t. Why? Because they, like many other families, were proud people. Somehow they would make do with what they had.

The difficult situation led to frustration and hopelessness, then to irreparable, harsh words between the mother and father. The eldest son felt devastated and helpless as he watched the people he loved most become more and more angry and depressed.

Then destiny intervened…a loud and unexpected knock at the door! The boy opened it and was greeted by a tall man in rumpled clothing. He was grinning broadly, carrying a huge basket brimming with every conceivable Thanksgiving delight: a turkey, stuffing, pies, sweet potatoes, canned goods---everything for a holiday feast!

The family was stunned. The man at the door said, “This is from someone who knows you’re in need and wants you to know that you’re loved and cared for.” At first, the father of the family didn’t want to take the basket, but the man said, “Look, I’m just a delivery person.” Smiling, he set the basket in the boy’s arms, turned to leave, then called over his shoulder, “Have a great Thanksgiving!”

In that moment, this young man’s life was forever changed. With this simple act of kindness, he learned that hope is eternal, that people---even “strangers”---really do care. The sense of gratitude he felt moved him deeply, and he swore to himself that someday he’d do well enough to give something back to others in a similar way. And by the time he was eighteen years old, he had begun to fulfill that promise. With his scant earnings, he set out to purchase groceries, not for himself, but for two families he had learned were in dire need of food. He then drove to deliver them, dressed in an old pair of jeans and a T-shirt, intending to present the gift as if he were a delivery boy. When he arrived at the first dilapidated house, he was greeted by a Latina woman who looked at him suspiciously. She had six children, and her husband had abandoned the family only a few days before. They had no food.

The young man offered, “I have a delivery for you, ma’am.”He then went out to his car and began to carry in bags and boxes overflowing with food: a turkey, stuffing, pies, sweet potatoes, canned goods. The woman’s jaw dropped. The children, when they saw the food being brought into the house, let out shrieks of delight.

The young mother, who spoke only broken English, grabbed the young man by the arm and started to kiss him all over, saying, “You gift from God! You gift from God!”

“No, no,” the young man said. “I’m just the delivery boy. This is a gift from a friend.”
Then he handed her a note that said,

This is a note from a friend. Please have a wonderful Thanksgiving---you and your family deserve it. Know that you are loved. And someday, if you have the chance, please do well enough to do this for someone else and pass on the gift.

The young man continued to bring in bag after bag of groceries. The excitement, joy, and love reached a fever pitch. By the time he left, the sense of connection and contribution moved the young man to tears. As he drove away, looking back at the smiling faces of the family he’d had the privilege to help, he realized that that his story had come full circle, that the “horrible day” from his youth was actually a gift from God, guiding him, pointing him toward fulfillment through a life committed to contribution. With this one act he began a quest that continues to this day: to return the gift that was given to him and his family and to remind people that there is always a way to turn things around, that they are loved, and that---with simple steps, a little understanding, and massive action---whatever challenges exist now can be turned into valuable lessons and opportunities for personal growth and long-term happiness.

How do I know so much about this young man and his family, not only about what they did, but also how they felt? Because he is me.

Anthony Robbins

Ashrams / Re: Impressions from travels to Tiruvannamalai
« on: November 22, 2012, 12:58:16 PM »
Dear Atmavichar100,

Yes. Holding Satsanghs in the house or in some places in one's town, with like minded people  is also an excellent idea to
continue unfailingly our remembrance of Sri Bhagavan.

Arunachala Siva.

Yes Subramaniam Sir

That is what I am doing myself ( I have visited Arunachala , Ramana Ashram many times but no more inclined to visit ) and try to now have regular satsang at my own house informally .I choose the time 6.45p.m- 7.30 p.m in evening ,the time of Tamil Parayana at Ramana Ashram and keep chanting Arunachala Stuti Panchakam and on Sat chant Ramana Stuti Panchakam . Slowly I intend to memorize the other Tamil works and follow the same Mon- Sat routine of Tamil Parayana at my house at the same time .If the time does not work it does not matter but I have kept in my mind  that I spend 30-45 mts daily with some work of Bhagwan with full focus .
I suggest the same to others i.e instead of breaking your head about how to go ,when to go etc etc ( for some it is logistic problem ,for some financial problem ,for some time problem ,for some family problem and for some a combination of all above ) .Some complain that there is no Ramana Satsang in their City or even if it is it is too far from their house etc etc  .Do not wait for motivation from outside ,just start some satsang activity in your own apartment even if it is a small single bedroom apartment and then leave the rest to Bhagwan  as Bhagwan does not care about formality etc .All you need is a Picture of Bhagwan and you can play the chants on your computer /laptop/MP3 player , sit silently , switch off your mobiles, internet  and follow the chants for 30-45mts with uninterrupted focus  and maintain it on a regular basis  and see how it keeps moving you .
In conclusion : Bring Bahgwan and Arunachala in to your own house and that can be done through Ramana Satsang
Om Peace .

Ashrams / Re: Impressions from travels to Tiruvannamalai
« on: November 22, 2012, 12:32:31 PM »
Dear lathaji, Thank You Very much for these comforting words!! Yes,Bhagavan and Arunachala are Always in my heart,and that is most important. When the time come,with Blessings and Guru Grace,i will come there. Like in Your case,Bhagavan will take care of everything. Wish You All the Best!

Yes Jewell

When time comes things will happen on its own .
Visiting Arunachala and doing Giri Pradakshina  and staying at Ramana Maharshi Ashram and Meditating at the Old Hall  is just one way of showing our respects to them (i.e Bhagwan,Arunacahala ) but that need not be the only way . Bhagwan has left his wonderful works in Tamil and Sanskrit that you can chant them  or listen to them daily ( mostly are available for free download from the Ramana Ashram website ) , or read Bhagwan's Books in English by his close devotees i.e dialogues with Bhagwan etc and all these activities will keep you in touch with Bhagwan wherever you are and when the time is ripe , you will be able to visit here .
My suggestion is that you have a formal Bhagwan Satsang in your house once a week :
This is the link to how to have a Ramana Satsang .
Do not bother if you do not have friends /family members to take part in this .It is enough you start this satsang alone with urself and Bhagwan's picture in front of you .Today is auspicious day Guru's day and you can start it today and keep it every thursday and who knows soon how many people will join it .Satsang has a mysterious power . I know of one Zen teacher in America , a lady who used to do a zen satsang alone for many days in her room alone  but used to prepare the room as though many people will come ,first few weeks no one tuned up and slowly one by one people started coming and it became a big group . I have similar such stories .The intention here is not to attract a crowd but to keep the spirit of Bhagwan in your life and attract like minded people to it .
This is a  just a friendly advice .If you are already doing such a thing or related activity then do not worry ,carry on with whatever you are doing .
Om Peace .

Subramaniam Sir

Here is the link

There is Akashra Mana Malai( 3 talks )  and Arunchala Pancharatnam (17 talks )

After completing a round of daily chanting of Arunachala Akshara Mana Malai AAMM) , now I have started to chant the complete Arunachala Stuti Panchakam . I hope to maintain this as my daily Parayanam for the coming few weeks .Have downloaded Nochuru's 3 talks on AAMM and listening to them now .

Om Peace .

General Discussion / Re: Lao Tzu Book - TAO TE CHING
« on: November 21, 2012, 11:38:19 AM »

Thanks for opening the thread on Lao Tzu .I came to know of him and his work Tao te Ching only through Osho .

General topics / Re: Lord Ram was for real
« on: November 21, 2012, 10:42:09 AM »
Dear Hari,

Forget about the years. Lord Rama is real for those who realizes that He is Real. Adams Bridge was built when Lord Rama
and others had to cross over to Lanka. This again is real only for those who trusts that this is real. Lord Rama is not bothered
about either of these.

Incidentaly, Kavyakanta Ganapati Muni had done some research and had found out that Sri Rama lived about 8000 years ago,
vide his incomplete book Kala Nirnayam.

Arunachala Siva.

Subramaniam Sir

Kanndasan has already mentioned this in one of his film songs :
"Deivam enral athu deivam , Silai enral verum silai than ,
Undu enral athil undu  ,illai enral athul illai "


Thanks for sharing the letter of Annamalai Swamy .It is a great blessing that you had close contact with him in the early 80s itself much before he became sort of popular to the outside world after David Godman's book "Living by the words of Bhagwan" .
I still cherish that book and I never get bored reading it again and again .

Om Peace .

Dear Atmavichar100,

Spiritual Books can be studied to a limited extent covering bhakti and jnana. There is no need to read
books unlimitedly. If one is young, one can read novels and non fiction to some extent as for a change. Otherwise one
need not read many many spiritual books.
It is of no use. Sri Bhagavan says in Who am I? : If all books speak only about
mano nigraha, one need not read books to a large extent.

Arunachala Siva.

Subramaniam Sir

I was here referring to General book reading and not for spiritual awakening . The book that I was referring to "How to read a book" ,teaches reading book as an art and science which we were never at all taught .We were taught just to join the words and read but never how to get involved in a book and draw the wisdom of the same . This need not be applied to fiction / story books but to Other books written by authors who are expert in the field of Literature ,Science , History , Politics ,Religion ,Philosophy etc . They have nothing to do with Atma Vichara and I am aware of that and I was talking with respect to Secular Knowledge enrichment .

Coming to Atma Vichara :

I feel for a  mature seeker , nothing much is required . Even in the traditional Advaita Path ,I remember one Traditional Teacher of Classical Advaita Saying that though traditionally one needs to study Bhagavad Gita , 10 Upanishads and Brahma Sutra , yet for a mature seeker a simple small Upanishad like Keno Upansihad is enough to give clarity and he can go away after getting his answer from that Upansihad and he need not spend time reading all the other texts .
My take is simple :It does not matter what you read or what you do not read - have you got the answer that you are searching for ? Has it given you clarity or are you still continuing to search for answers ? I feel each Individual must answer this for himself .

Om Peace

General Discussion / Re: Nochur Venkatraman
« on: November 20, 2012, 08:50:52 PM »
Here is a link to Nochur's talks for downloading .

I have downloaded Nochur's Arunachala Akshara Mana Malai and listening to them now .

Om Peace .

I have a friend who was a Bhagavan devotee for seventeen years. For the whole of that period the only book on Bhagavan she ever read was Who am I? That pamphlet, along with a photo of Bhagavan, was, she said, all she needed.

According to TMP Mahadevan - Bahgwan's Upadesa Saram was more than enough for him .
According to Sadhu OM , he considered Bhagwan's Ulladhu Naarpadu as the essence of Bhagwan's teachings .
I do not know about Annamalai Sawmy but in one picture of David Godman's book "Living by the words of Bhagwan" , I saw the entire "Ulladhu Naarpdahu" written on the walls of Annamalai Swamy  house .I do not know whether it is still there or white washed after his passing away .

So each person resonates differently to Bhagwan's teachings .For me I found Annamalai Swamy's Final Talks and Living by the Words of Bhagwan as the best books that helped me understand Bhagwan Ramana and his teachings better .I am yet to study Bhagwan's Classical Tamil works seriously and have just started with Akshara Mana Malai .

Dear atmavichar,
          :) Even Upadesha saram was written by Ramana himself in Sanskrit right ?

But then with respect to all these, also interpretations and doubts can be raised always!
someone may simply say "upadesha saram is like that coz ramana was asked to write it within the context of a particular incident in the puranas" .

Why can one not say that Murgnar was very devotional and Ramana taught him in accordance with his devotional temperment not to disturb his faith ??

These are all interpretations arent they ?

BTW, just out of curiosity, what are the differences between sat-darshanam and the tamil version ? Can someone comment ?


As my knowledge of Classical Sanskrit /Classical Tamil is quite poor I cant give a judgement on it or with regard to any of Bhagwan's works .
As for Sad Darshanam ( Sanskrit ) and Tamil ( Ulladu Naarpadu ) , I have Swami Paramarthananda's Talks for the Sasnkrit Version and Nochur for the Tamil Version and once I have listened to both in depth ,I will let u know . But that will take a long time as now I have started only with Bahgwan's Akashra Mana Malai chanting and slowly memorizing it and step by step  :) Might be Subramaniam Sir and Ravi who are good in Classical Tamil can help you out .
Ok time for my evening Satsang with Bhagwan Ramana .
Om Peace .

I am very well aware of this! Its not easy to understand a Realized person and his teaching unless he himself expresses in his own words.

Bhagwan Ramana has documented whatever he wanted to convey in Classical Tamil and all his Tamil Works Prose and Poetry can be considered to be authentic as they were composed by him and the Guru Vachaka Kovai composed by Muruganar has been well corrected by Bhagwan . In Bhagwan Ramana's Circles : the Ramana Prasthana Traya are : 1) Updadesa Undiyar 2) Ulladu Naarpadu 3) Guru Vachaka Kovai and there is no doubt regrading the authenticity of the same as they are written in Classical Tamil .
Why Classical Tamil ?
Few years back I was talking to one great Ramana Devotee who himself is an expert in Classical Tamil and have written commentaries on some of Bhagwan's works and he said Classical Tamil is always used to preserve authentic works in Tamil Culture as there is very little scope for tampering once the verses are composed in Classical Tamil . So while Guru Vachaka Kovai is basically the written response of Bhagwan to his devotees the  English form of it took the name of "Talks with Ramana Maharishi " , "Day by Day with Bhagwan" etc but the authentic essence of the same is contained in Guru Vachaka Kovai which was written by Murugnar who was a witness to the dialogue and after Bhagwan gave an answer , Muruganar composed a verse and submitted it to Bhagwan and Bhagwan did correct the same ( correction for grammar , correction for right meaning etc ) and Muruganar then made the final draft .
Why Muruganar ?
While hundreds and thousands of devotees came to meet Bahgwan and asked him his advice .They did not ask him his advice but told what they are doing and asked how they can proceed further . So each one came with his / her own backlog and wanted to improve from that and none questioned the validity of their own backlog and Bhagwan not intending to Upset anyone just told them to proceed from where they are .It was only Muruganar who came to Bhagwan and asked him "what is your teaching and sat silently by his side " and as the saying Goes when the student is ready the teacher comes along , Bhagwan allowed Muruganar to record his teachings in Classical Tamil . Again Bhagwan had no problem with people writing in English but he choose not to correct the same but he choose to correct Muruganar's Classical Verses in Tamil .
In this context I wish to point out that Sri Kavya Kantha Ganapathi , a great Sanskrit Scholar did translate Bahgwan's Ulladu Naarpadu in Sanskrit as Sad Darshanam but he belongs to the Shakti Upasana lineage and hence he was interpreting everything from that angle and when Bhagwan corrected his SAsnkrit verses , he again changed it and after few times Bahgwan got fed up and told let him write what he wants . :)

So in conclusion : I am no authority of Bhagwan's works but I consider Bhagwan's propse and Poetry works written by him along with Guruvacha Kovai of Muruganar that was corrected by Bhagwan himself to be authentic works of Bhagwan( based on my information above ) and only problem is one must know some amount of Classical Tamil to understand it properly .I have no idea about what all he wrote in Telugu /Malayalam/Sanskrit . I enjoy reading the English works related to Bhagwan and will continue to do so as but for serious study ,I will only refer his Classical Works in Tamil and have started to study his works seriously starting with Aksharama Mana Malai .Of course this is my interpretation and I have nothing to argue for or against this and people are free to make their own interpretations of what is authentic /not authentic with respect to Bhagwan's works .

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