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Messages - atmavichar100

General Discussion / Re: pure karma kandin some observations.
« on: October 26, 2012, 10:23:24 PM »
These are said by the shAstrAs laid down since time immemorial. Infact, AchrayAs say they themselves do not have any right is changing the shAstrAs. The Dharma remains the same all through. Nobody can change just because of change of time and lifestyle.

In Bhagawan's Brilliant Selection of 42 essential verses of the Bhagawad Gita "Essence of the Gita ", while almost all the verses deal with "I" , I found one verse strange  that Bhagwan had introduced and that Verse was the last verse of Ch-16 i.e this verse is a response from Krishna for Arjuna's question as how one should Conduct one's life and this is what Lord Krishna answers :
Verse 24 Ch-16
Therefore ,sastra is the means of knowledge for you  (Arjuna) , in the determination of what is to be done and what is not to be done .Knowing what is said by the mandates of the sastra, you are obliged to perform action here ( in this world )

General Discussion / Re: pure karma kandin some observations.
« on: October 26, 2012, 09:20:37 PM »
Karma kanda does not suit one these days, excepting sandhya vandanam, chanting some slokas etc.

Most of Acharyas today are happy if people do Sandhya Vandanam twice daily with Gayathri Japa ( thrice better but not possible for most who have to go to work ) . Plus they are happy if people do their monthly Ammavasya rituals , annual Sraddham to their parents, support Vedic Scholars , support one's Kula Deivam Temple wherever possible  . This is the minimum Karma Kanda expected by all Acharyas .

I am right now doing twice Gayathri Japa of 54 times each and do my monthly Ammavasya without fail and also Annual Sradhham for my Father and do my best to support Vedic Dharma, Kula Deivam Temple  in whatever way I can . I am now slowly tuning myself to make  my move from twice Gayathri Japa to Sandhya Vandanam twice daily as Sandhya Vandanam is a perfect combination  of Karma ,Bhakti , Jnanam if done with right understanding and Bhava . I understood the seriousness /importance of Sandhya Vandanam only after listening to the 10 talks on the same by Swami Paramarthananda as well as reading Sringeri Acharya Sri Chandrasekhara Bharati's dialogues on the same and felt such a beautiful sadhana has become a very boring ritual these days and that due to lack of proper education in these matters many have given it up and hence I felt I need to restart it again but as I have already invested my time and energy in other Sadhanas ( like Yoga , Sanskrit and Tamil chanting etc ) , I need to slowly fine tune it to my schedule .It is a simple Sadhana and just need a tumbler of water and 20-30  mts of time morning /evening but merit is very high . It confers immediate relief in form of a calm mind and also confers adrishta pala ( unseen beenfits ) in due course .

General Discussion / Re: pure karma kandin some observations.
« on: October 26, 2012, 07:18:38 PM »
Whatever may be,  I am interested to know how your family priest considers these two greatest personalities -- Shirdi Sai and Bhagavan Ramana Maharshi.

I have told you that he is a staunch Karma Kandin and they are entitled to their views . He does not put a gun on my head and ask me to follow him . When I ask him an opinion he will give an answer as per shastras only and hence I never discuss with them these things nor seek their opinion about Other Gurus .He has a role in my life and I use him only for that . I have also mentioned in one of my earlier posts that it is futile to keep on verifying about each and every Guru . There are the teachings available to us , we need to do our own sadhana , sharpen our intellect and learn to segregate what is relevant from what is ir-relevant .Forums like these help us in getting certain inputs and we must be glad for the same .
 There will be lots of doubts no doubt but we cant wash away all doubts in a single day and we have to travel our own path through trial and error .So let us not waste time on these things and spend time in Sadhana( Karma , Bhakti , Yoga ,Jnana ) . So let us keep faith in God and do what best is possible for us and for our situation .

General Discussion / Re: pure karma kandin some observations.
« on: October 26, 2012, 06:45:18 PM »

One of the reasons why I use this forum to get Opinion is that many of these things that are discussed here are of no importance to my family Vedic Priest who is a staunch Karma Kandin but is quite well read in his subject .So I use him only to conduct rituals in my family and to consult him on some vedic related rituals that are being performed .I respect him as a Vedic Priest and give him the due respect and never try to argue with him with my half baked knowledge .At the same time my sadhana is my personal journey and I carry on the same with as much sincerity as possible respecting the tradition as much as possible .
BTW if you read the dialogues of Sringeri Acharya Shri Chandrasekhara Bharati Swamigal it will be quite similar to what my Vedic Priest says i.e first doe ur Brahminical duties like Sandhavandanam , Samithadanam/Oupasanam and if u have extra time then do other things but do not sacrifice the daily Nitya Karmas for doing Other things .The same is also Paramachrya of Kanchi's views . There can be exception to these rules but I do not consider myself as an exception to this .

So let us not waste time arguing with others .Let us start doing whatever sadhana is possible and proceed step by step once we get more clarity .
Om Peace .

General Discussion / Re: Lalitha Sahasranama
« on: October 26, 2012, 03:55:23 PM »
Thanks Subramaniam Sir for ur inputs . Will do accordingly . It has strengthened me more .


Thanks for this post . A wonderful reminder to keep doing one's sadhana .

General Discussion / Re: Lalitha Sahasranama
« on: October 26, 2012, 03:22:30 PM »
Dear All

Thanks for all your inputs about Sri Lalitha Sahasranama stotram . I love chanting it a lot but I never do any puja for the same . I love sanskrit chanting ( as well as Tamil Chanting ) and consider Chanting itself to be a sort of Yoga Sadhana and I have got lot of benefits doing the same . At the same time I understood the need to respect certain sanctity with regard to our tradition and rules if not fully . Once I started learning Sri Rudram from an audio tape that was given along with Swami Dayananda's Commentary on Sri Rudram and started chanting the same and wanted to test how I chant and asked my family vedic priest to test it and he found lot of errors in the same as I learnt it by self learning method .He told me while my intention to chant Rudram is good , it is dangerous chanting Rudram with error and hence I dropped it and just listen to it on CD these days . I decided that henceforth I will not chant any Vedic Mantras ( except Gayathri , Sandhya Vandanam Mantras etc ) without proper training and started to focus only on Puranic Mantras /Stotras like Vishnu Sahasranama , Siva Sahasranama , Ganaga Sahasranama , Various ashtotras , Adi Shankara Stotras , Bhagawad Gita along with Bahagwan's Hyms in Tamil and certain hyms from Thiruvachagama  and Theveram etc  where rules are not strict and making simple errors in chanting is not dangerous   
Only problem was with Sri Lalitha Sahasranama as I was chanting it regularly until I was informed that it is not good to chant without initiation and luckily today I saw the quote of Sri Bharati Teerta  Mahaswamigal urging people to chant the same and I posed that quote in the forum after a long break . Today being Friday I took it as a sort of signal from Sringeri Acharya itself as a sign to chant the same but wanted to seek Other's opinions here in this forum also before doing so . I am right now reading Sri Kanchi Paramacharya's Voice of God Vol-7 pg 108-112which discusses about this .I have also asked a close friend of mine who is quite familiar with Shakti Upasana and as he is out of station ,he told he will give me a detailed reply later .
So I will share whatever inputs that I find from both these sources here . Others also share the same . I will go with Sringeri Acharya's advice to chant but since I did not learn from a Guru I will play the CD of Lalitha Sahasranama of Swami Paramarthananda and listen to it with rapt attention .
Thanks for the inputs from everyone .

Om Peace .

General Discussion / Re: Lalitha Sahasranama
« on: October 26, 2012, 11:46:19 AM »
Sri Atmavichar,

You had mentioned about a family priest with whom you had dareshan of sringEri swAmigal, i feel, he would be a right person to get initiated from.

Thanks Nagaraj for your inputs about Lalitha Sahasranama , my family priest is a Vedic Scholar and a staunch Karma Kandin and does not entertain any activity apart from one's prescribed Nitya Karmas i.e Sandhya Vandana etc . He feels if you have more time then do more Gyathri Japa or learn Vedas . He is right in his own respects . This is what Kanchi Paramacharya also said .Anyway that is for a different discussion .
BTW according to my relative this initiation has to be done by a Shakthi Upasaka .

My aim of Chanting Lalitha Sahasranama is purely for Bhakti and also I consider it as a form of Yoga i.e proper chanting with right pronunciation leads to mental peace and stability plus I find it useful in my ongoing study of Sanskrit . I do not intend to do any Meru or Chakra Puja but just to chant it like I chant Vishnu Sahasranama . I was in a way happy seeing Sri Bharati Tirtha Mahaswamigal quote uring people to chant Lalitha Sahasranama .

So let me qualify my question :

I know that  initiation is  needed for people who Chant Lalitha Sahasranama as part of a Chakra Puja / Meru Puja but for others to just simply chant it like Vishnu Sahasranama is initiation needed ?

General Discussion / Re: Lalitha Sahasranama
« on: October 26, 2012, 11:13:48 AM »
I have a doubt regarding Chanting Lalitha Sahasranama .
I did learn Lalitha Sahasranama on my own using a book and the audio Chanting of Swami Paramarthananda  and can recite it very well but then one day a far relative of mine  on a visit to our house said that Lalitha Sahasranama should not be chanted without proper initiation and her father who is himself a Vedic Scholar associated with Sringeri Mutt advised her not to chant Lalitha Sahasranama but only chant Soundarya Lahiri . She further said there is no problem in Chanting other Sahasranama like Vishnu Sahasranama , Shiva Sahasranama etc without initiation but when it comes to Lalitha Sahsranama one needs an initiation before chanting and today I saw this quote of Sringeri Achraya ,Sri Bharati Tirtha Mahaswamigal urging people to chant Lalitha Sahasranama .
Can someone clarify what is the correct procedure ? i.e initiation needed or not needed for chanting this ?

General Discussion / Re: Lalitha Sahasranama
« on: October 26, 2012, 10:55:58 AM »
Lalita Sahasranamam enunciates the Vedantic truths and describes the Paradevata's saguna rupa; the ways of worship and the manner in which She blesses the devotees. May all devotees gain their well-being by reciting the Lalita Sahasranama - a veritable kalpavriksha - Sri Sri Bharati Tirtha Mahaswamigal[/color]

General topics / Re: Quotes from Shankaracharya's
« on: October 26, 2012, 10:53:53 AM »
Today is Friday and very auspicious day for Mother Goddess and sharing this quote of Sri Sri Bharati Tirtha Mahaswamigal on importance of Lalitha Sahasranama .BTW Sri Bharati Tirtha Mahswamigal is leaving Chennai after finishing his Chaturmasya Vrata here ( I do not know his exact time of departure ) . Personally I was benefited a lot by Acharya's visit to Chennai and had his Darshan 3 times ( one very close and personal with my family Vedic Priest ) and those visits, listening to his talks, watching his ChandraMouliswear Puja etc  helped me develop more shraddha in our Sanatana Dharma, seriousness in learning Sanskrit as well as studying the works of Adi Shankara( his stotras , commentaries etc )  .
Lalita Sahasranamam enunciates the Vedantic truths and describes the Paradevata's saguna rupa; the ways of worship and the manner in which She blesses the devotees. May all devotees gain their well-being by reciting the Lalita Sahasranama - a veritable kalpavriksha - Sri Sri Bharati Tirtha Mahaswamigal

General Discussion / Re: UG Krishnamurthy?
« on: October 12, 2012, 07:53:15 PM »
         I feel discussions on whether UG/Osho was liberated or not are redundant !
We have to discuss the teaching, not people, in my opinion. Please excuse me if you find it inappropriate.

I have already expressed in other thread on Osho about this .For me I never invest my time and energy on the Teacher and rather spend it on seeing how far those teachings help me become more clear or refined .If it does ,I take it .If not I set it aside .

Dear Sanjay,
       :) Why dont you include me also ;)
how do you know JK/UG/Osho had the True experience ?
Rather what makes us suspect that they had experience ?

I do not know what state Tushnimji is or Ravi is Or Subramanian Sir is or any one in this forum is .I do not know whether they really live the teachings  what they write or share here . I do not know whether they write out of their own experience or copying from some books or from other sources in the net .It is none of my business .I check this forum to see if I have any valuable input  Primarily related to Bhagwan Ramana , Arunachala and secondly with respect to Other teachers ,Advaita , Sanathana Dharma etc that  can help me .If it is I take it ,If it is not I leave it .

I feel if we go on spending time doing R&D on each and every individual teacher , we will end up our entire life doing only that .

General Discussion / Re: UG Krishnamurthy?
« on: October 12, 2012, 12:28:18 PM »

The following explains UG's meeting with Sringeri Acharya Sri Abhivana Vidyateertha at Sringeri .

Meeting With the Shankaracharya of Sringeri
That year in Madras, U.G. ran into his boyhood friend, Mr. Tummalapalli Ramalingeswara Rao. Mr. Tummalapalli was a great scholar in the Sanskrit, Telugu and English languages. He was also an adept in Mantras. U.G. at that time was looking for a more suitable place in India, a place with a more temperate climate than Madras. When he heard of U.G.'s interests, Mr. Tummalapalli suggested Sringeri as the proper place. "I am well acquainted with the Jagadguru (lit. "World Teach"—title of Sri Sankarachary) of Sringeri Pitha, Sri Abhinava Vidya Tirtha Swami. Things will work out well for you there," he assured U.G. and Valentine and led them to Sringeri.

U.G. liked the environs of Sringeri very much and also the peaceful climate of the banks of the River Tunga. He wanted to rent or buy a place and live there. Mr. Ramalingeswara Rao introduced U.G. to the Swami of Sringeri. When he heard of the Calamity that had happened to U.G., he said, "I must talk to you in private," and led U.G. into his private chambers which were located in a garden called Narasimhavana on the far side of the river Tunga. It is noteworthy that he allowed Valentine also into that room. The Swami sat on the Teacher's Seat (Guru Pitha), and U.G. and Valentine sat in front of him.

"When I heard of the extraordinary things that happened to you, I am reminded of my guru Sri Chandrasekhara Bharati," the Jagadguru started talking. "I don't know of these things in my own personal experience. But my teacher used to describe his experiences just the way they have occurred in your case. We were afraid that perhaps his mind was deranged. It is very rare that the body survives the shock of such a thoughtless state. According to the scriptures, within twenty-one days after such an event the body dies. If the body could sustain its vital force and not die off, it must surely be for the sake of saving humanity. There is no doubt about it."

U.G., on the contrary, had no inclination to save the world or uplift humanity. He listened silently as the teacher spoke. Then he presented to the Jagadguru his proposal for establishing his residence near Sringeri in a solitary place away from people. In reply, the Jagadguru said, "I will be responsible for getting you any place around here, if you so wish. But your idea of living alone will never work. Whether you stay in a jungle or in a mountain cave, people won't stop coming to see you." The teacher's warning made U.G. abandon his resolve to stay away from people.

At that time, Dr. K. B. Ramakrishna Rao used to be the principal of the JCBM College in Sringeri. The Jagadguru invited him to visit and introduced him to U.G.

General Discussion / Re: Water - Arghya - Significance
« on: October 10, 2012, 07:47:03 PM »
Dear Atmavichar,
           Thank you for that explanaton. I was really unaware of it. Actually I was planning to get this clarified by someone.
This clears the doubt.

But even in case of type1 , what is the difference it makes when we know the meaning and when we do not know the meaning ?
The analogy given by Acharyas is you go to a Doctor for some illness , the Doctor prescribes u some medication . You take it having faith in the Doctor . The Medicines works in your system whether you know the composition of the medicines or not .It is not possible for all the patients to know the meaning or composition of those medicines unless they themselves are Doctors or Chemist . If you wait for the day that you will take the medicines only when you know the meaning for the same then you will only be a looser . These days many Doctors complain  that the big problem with some of the current patients is they do their own R&D in google on the  medicines and argue with them with their half baked Google knowledge   :) and first they come as patients  humbly to receive medicines and then in the next visit  they advise the Doctors themselves as to the what they read about the medicines in the net  :)
That is why Swami Paramarthananda and other Acharyas like Kanchi Paramacharya say that when it comes to Veda Purva Mantras just follow what the Vedic Priest tells you do without arguing with your half baked google knowledge  :) In fact people like Kanchi Pramacharya have gone to the extent of saying that it is better not to know the meaning of the Veda Purva Mantras as you will chant the Mantras with more faith rather than a person with half baked google knowledge  :)
If you still want to know the meanings , there are scholars who have studied Bashyam in Vedas i.e detailed explanation of the Mantras , their significance , potency etc and visit them and learn from them .In Chennai , if you visit Sanskrit College you will get to see such Scholars .

But when it comes to Vedanta , the Acharyas are clear that you need to understand the meaning of the mantras as unfolded by the Guru and mechanical repetition of  Vedantic Statements will not help you .

One more thing .
This again I got it from Swami Paramarthananda - Not all things in Veda Purva are subject to Scientific Analysis as Vedas are beyond Science .For eg you will have to accept a thing called "Pitru loka" when you do "Sraddham /Tarpanam" for your departed ancestors ,and  if you say unless you prove to me that a Pitru loka exits via Telescope or satellite pictures I will not believe it    :) then nothing can be done for such a person . You just have to accept the Veda Purva Portion as it is .
Only when you come to Vedanta you adopt the rigorous Intellectual standards for logical reasoning .
BTW I am not an expert on these things and that is why when it comes to Veda Purva things like Dharma Sastras etc I consult my Family  Vedic Priest and in fact I am on a Project recording some of the important aspects related to our Daily Vedic Rituals etc through my family priest and there is a Vedic Scholar , called Sarma Sastrigal who has written an excellent book on The Great Hindu Tradition and for more details about the book and about him you can refer the following link :
His email and other contact details are given there .
Only 2 days back I spoke to him and have Ordered that book to know more about these things .Apart from that I refer the 7 Volumes of Kanchi Paramacharya "Voice of God " as well as the various books published by Sringeri Sarada Peetam on the talks of Sringeri Acharyas for details about our Traditional practices , Mantras , Dharma Sastras etc

General Discussion / Re: Water - Arghya - Significance
« on: October 10, 2012, 06:51:14 PM »
However i have seen even traditional teachers suggest that simple chantign without knowign the meaning is also useful. I am not sure how that works and whether or not it works :).

According to Swami Paramarthananda ( this is from a talk of his ) - in Vedas there are 2 types of Mantras - Type -1 where Shabda Pramana ( i.e Vibratory Power ) is important and Type-2  where Artha Pramana ( i.e Meaning ) is important .
In Veda Purva i.e the Ritualistic Portion Type -1 Mantras are used and in Vedanta i.e the Knowledge portion Type-2 Mantras are used .

But it is not as though for Type -1 Mantras there is no meaning . It does have a meaning but for Common Man it is enough he learns to chant it properly with the right pronunciation after learning it from a proper Guru . Eg Sri Rudram - many people chant it and but people say never chant it without getting the right training from a proper Vedic Teacher as wrong Chanting is dangerous and many people have had negative effects of wrong chanting of Veda Mantras even with good intention . But Sri Rudram is also called as Rudro Upanishat and Swami Daynanda has given a detailed commentary on the same .
Aurobinda has written books on the secret of Rig Veda Mantras .
So in essence : Remember which Mantra Type it comes in i.e Type-1 , Type-2 and follow accordingly .