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Messages - atmavichar100

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1771
Dear All

I just wanted  to open a thread about certain select pointers from Bahgwan's life , Bhagwan's teachings and Devotees experience with Bhagwan  that I get as updates regularly from some sites related to Bhagwan .This thread is only for contemplative reading and I will open another thread for discussions on the same .


Here is the thread where you can discuss about what you read here :

It is called Pointers from Bhagwan - For Discussion
http://www.arunachala-ramana.org/forum/index.php?topic=7565.0

Pointer- 1
THE POWER OF THE PRESENCE OF A JNANI

One day when I was sitting by the side of Sri Bhagavan, I felt so miserable that I put the following question to him: ‘Is the sankalpa [wish] of the jnani not capable of warding off the destinies of the devotees?’

Bhagavan smiled and said: ‘Does the jnani have a sankalpa at all? The jivanmukta can have no sankalpas whatsoever. It is just impossible.’

I continued: ‘Then, what is the fate of all of us who pray to you to have grace on us and save us? Will we not be benefited or saved by sitting in front of you or coming to you? What use is there then for family men like me to gain by coming here to you?’

Bhagavan turned graciously to me and said: ‘Just as a trouble (or arrow) that comes to destroy the head goes away carrying with it only the turban, so a person’s bad karma will be considerably reduced while he is in the presence of a jnani. A jnani has no sankalpa but his sannidhi [presence] is the most powerful force. He need not have sankalpa but his presiding presence, the most powerful force, can do wonders, save souls, give peace of mind, even liberation to ripe souls. Your prayers are not answered by him but absorbed by his presence. His presence saves you, wards off the karma and gives you the boons as the case may be, involuntarily. The jnani does save the devotees, but not by sankalpa, which is non-existent in him, only through his presiding presence, sannidhi.’
(The Mountain Path, 1968 p. 236)

1772
Dear atmavichar100,

This book was published to celebrate the Skanda Sashti by the Murugan TiruvaruL Sangam, Tiruvallikeni, Chennai 600 005,
in the year 2010. It is almost three years old. My wife brought it in Bangalore, when Bangalore Group celebrated the same festival
in 2010.  You can contact:

Murugan TiruvaruL Sangam
101/50 Big Street,
Tiruvallikeni, Chennai 600 005.

The book is free of cost. You may get it, if copies are available with them.

Arunachala Siva,   
Subramaniam Sir
Thanks  for the information .
Have you read that book and can you share the feedback on the same .


1773
I came across this post on the net but there is no reference as to where to get the book . If anyone can find out where the above book can be got ,it would be very helpful .

Quote
Dear Anbargal,

Sub:  Akshara Manamalayil Thiruppugazh Malargal – Book Review

Though Arunagirinathar, the author of Thiruppugazh and Sri Ramana
Maharshi, a towering spiritual order aimed at one destination, they
differed in their perspectives and the methods to be adopted.  Ramana
Maharshi followed the path of Jnana and viewed Self as the reflection
of Brahman within (Advaita). Arunagirinathar followed the path of
devotion which admitted duality.  While Ramana Maharshi remained all
through his life in the surroundings of Arunachala, Arunagirinathar
went on a long pilgrimage in South India and beyond.  While   the
former was noted for his silence, the latter was noted for his
eloquence.

But the points of difference that distance them are few and the points
that unites them are more; says Smt. Santha Rajan and Sri Sundara
Rajan, who have brought out a wonderful book titled, “Aksharamana
Malayil Thiruppugazh Malargal”.
They have taken Maharshi’s
Aksharamana Malai as the subject of their research and established the
fact that all the 108 verses of Akshara Manamalai have many things in
common with Thiruppugazh.  Against each verse of Akshara Manamalai,
they quoted some songs either from Thiruppugazh, Alamgaram or
Anuboothi that contained the same message.
  The songs contain
references to various aspects of spirituality like self-realisation,
devotion, ego and anger as the obstacle.   It takes us to a new world
of knowledge and devotion.

When someone asked Maharshi about Adi Sankara’s influence on his
teachings, Maharshi said that what he had spoken or written were the
result of his own experience.  Similarly, we find that many aspects of
truth which Maharshi said has tallied with what Arunagirinathar had
said many years ago.

Rajans should be congratulated for bringing out a twin volume that at
once gives  the words of wisdom emanated from Ramana Maharshi and the
beautiful verses of devotion that flowed from Arunagirinathar.   There
are some excellent colour photos of Muruga, Ganesa, Adi Sankara,
Kanchi Maha Swamigal, Sri Bharathi Theertha Swamigal of Sringeri,
Ramana Maharshi, Arunagirinathar, Sri Sachidananda Swamigal, Seshadri
Swamigal, Pamban Swamigal and an overview of Arunachaleswar temple.
The book has been well researched, beautifully  written and
excellently presented.   We look forward many such brilliant
expositions from Rajans. Readers would find this a treasure of immense
value and those interested may contact Sri Sundararajan at
yesye...@yahoo.com.

V.S. Krishnan
www.thiruppugazh.org

1774
Dear atrnavichar100,

Did I not tell you that he lived only up to his nineties and merged with Sri Bhagavan? He lived up to 105 years is definitely incorrect.

Arunachala Siva.

Sure Subramaniam Sir

But as there is no confirmed DOB of Kunju Swami and the only given DOB is  1887 in the link provided .Even now David Godman has not given his exact DOB and only said that 1887 is wrong .
So anyway I had this query after re-reading about Kunju Swami yesterday in the book Power of Presence .

1775
The following is the reply I got from David Godman on Kunju Swami's DOB query

Quote

1887 is definitely wrong.
He arrived at Tiruvannamalai in the early 1920s when he himself was in his early 20s. He was probably around 92 when he passed away in Ramanasramam.


Best Wishes      David Godman

1776
Subramaniam Sir

I have just posted an email to David Godman to confirm exactly Kunju Swami's DOB . Only yesterday I went through his life as mentioned in Power of Presence but there is no mention of his DOB . Among Bhagwan's  earliest devotees he was one of the longest living one's I suppose .

1777
General Discussion / Re: we are missing a point.
« on: January 16, 2013, 01:18:03 PM »
we are missig one point:



I read the account of Kunju Swami who lived in Bhagvan's presence for a long time.

Seems these people  did not have any money or property or whatsover.

Their only aim in life was pure devotion,  self realisation,   guru bhakthi,  guru's teachings.

One occasion Kunju Swami  leaves for Kerala in a train to take care of his insane friend
who confused so much with sadhana and turned insane.

At that time,  Maharishee ,  realising that Kunju Swami did not have money to buy food,
makre parcel of fresh puris he just received from some devotee.


Now reading this,  I could visualize,  to what extent people like kunju swami lived
without having money for food for the next meal time.


I think ,  until one gets this attitude,  he cannot be considered a mumukshu.

I am not asking everyone here to depend on next time food aimlessly,  but at the same tiem
we should realise how difficult it was to be with Bhagavan all the time.

We now say,   we have missed Bhagavan , his physical presence etc.

But are we now as care-free as this gentleman Kunju Swami ?  A big No.

We have many ailments,  we depend on tablets.

Our next time meals is readily available in abundant,  until the end of our life time
it will  be availale.  But are we planning  money for next time food?  No,  we plan for
properties,  savings,  more luxury like AC,  costly bed,  cots ,  furniture etc.

We plan for next 30 -- 40 years put together.

People like me love and crave to be in 24 hours air conditioned places or hill stations.

In this endeavour,  ofcourse we have so many complex materila problems and we blink not knowing what to do.

But think of this --  Kunju Swami  when he really thought seriously enough,
he would have got frightened because for next meal time,  his meals is not guaranteed.

But inspite of that,  people like Kunju Swami,  Viswanatha Swami,  Muruganar, Annamalai Swammi
these people -- inspite of that,  they were not worried and focussed only on sadhana.


But we people are not like that -- in the name of duty,  we simply keep on adding more
and  more of our material needs.  And in the midst of this,  we have somehow started
sadhana .  So here,  we are committing some mistakes in terms of planning.

Planning,  worrying,  thinking and then fearing the future --  bad way to live life indeed.


One of my close relatives,  one day met me as I was going to Srirangam temple in my
natvie place.

He made lot of money in IT industry and now settled in India after long stay in Australia.

He asked about my current job and then forecasted the fate of my career in IT after 10 years
and warned that I need to spend more time ,  more free time of weekends to improve my skills.

He told that otherwise,  with my minimal skill set,  I may be thrown away anytime.

Fear struck me at once -- we were discussing this near the Rajagopuram of Srirangam temple.

Fear really struck me --  I got confused and started sweating.  Somehow I smiled and cut short that
topic and then I went straight to Thaayar -- Mahalakshmi sannidhi.

There I sat and unloaded my burden created by the fearful lecture of my relative.


Today I compare this  attitude with  Kunju Swami's. 

I can really see that,  I am and many others along with me,  are planning too too much.

David Godman spent 18 months in a damaged temple roof. He was not afraid of snakes,
scorpions or anything.  There  he performed self enquiry.


But today  I want instant realisation -- I go to saradamma's hosue and if Amma does not
come out,  I get frustrated.


Then for relaxing,  I go to youtube.com and start seeing some video on self enquiry.

One thing is sure -- God or Atman or Self --  it will never reveal unless we atleast
untie ourselves from this over planning,  this  extra carefulness in material affairs.



On top of all this,  occasionally we comment that Kunju swami may not have  realised Self.


We did not even realise our fears for next 40 years financial planning, 
while Kunju Swami also did not realise that his next time meal is not guaranteed.



Unless one is able to throw himself at Nature's mercy,  unless one is ready to place
his physical body in front of the eternal quest,  it is not going to be easy.


One need not die,  but one should not care even if death comes due to starvation.

Just thought of writing.
Kskat

I went through this old post of yours and I appreciate what you have written . You have yourself given the answers in your post on the qualifications needed to be on this path .
One of the signs of spiritual maturity is less anxiety for the future . It does not mean we have to be careless or lazy but just do what we can and stop overspending the time contemplating on the future . The Current Global Economy runs by exploiting people's twin powerful emotions of Greed and Fear .

1778
Subramaniam Sir

From the link below it is given that Kunju Swami was born on 1887 and you have mentioned that he passed in 1992 so it means he lived for 105 years .

http://bhagavan-ramana.org/ramanadevotees.html

1779
Quote
On this day, in the year 1992,

Subramaniam Sir

When was Kunju Swami born ? I guess he lived for more than 100 years ?

1780
General Discussion / Re: Thiruvalluvar Day , 15 Jan 2013
« on: January 16, 2013, 10:58:34 AM »
Sure Subramaniam Sir

I hope Sri Ravi who has lot of inputs from Sage TGN's talks on Thirukural  can shed more clarity on these quotes .

1781
Tripura Rahasya and other ancient works / Re: Ribhu Gitai Tamil Mp3s
« on: January 16, 2013, 09:29:36 AM »
Dear KSKAT

Till Ramana Ashram gets a chorus chanting done , we need to be content with the Single Chant that is being made available for free for the devotees and it is also good enough .
Om Peace

1782
General Discussion / Re: Thiruvalluvar Day , 15 Jan 2013
« on: January 15, 2013, 10:13:06 PM »
Subramaniam Sir

Here is a Kanchi devotte's account with Kanchi Paramacharya on what Thiruvalluvar meant by the term "iraivan" in the Kural that you have pointed out :

Quote
I had written in my eassy: the terms thaamarai kaNNaan* ('lotus-eyed') and adiyaLandhaan ('he who measured with his foot') that occur in TirukkuraL are references to Tirumaal (Mahavishnu) -- the glory of the Feet in the first chapter, 'Praising God' -- the line Indirane salum kari (even Indra, the head of Devas, suffered the curse of sages) -- the phrase ulagu iyatriyaan (he who made the world) -- eN guNatthaan (of eight attributes) and such other lines. I was explaining these lines in front of Pujasri MahaswamigaL. As I read out the TirukkuraL

piravip perunkadal neendhuvar neendhar
iRaivanadi seraadar.


The boundless ocean of births can be crossed, indeed,
but not without intimate union with Infinity's Holy Feet.

(translation by Himalayan Academy
(Contents of Weaver's Wisdom - Ancient Precepts for a Perfect Life)

he waved his holy hands for me to stop.

He gave the graceful message, "During TiruvaLLuvar's time, iRaivan meant Sivan."

Parithiyaar, who wrote the first commentary on TirukkuraL explained the meaning this verse as "Those who did not meditate on Shiva's feet won't be able to cross the ocean of births." I remember this fact now due to the graceful sweep of the sage, and this I submitted to him in words.

He said finally, "Have you seen the nigaNdugaL (dictionaries)? All those would explain the meaning of iRaivan as Sivan. There are other meanings, but among the names of Gods, only Sivan!" He had shown a new way to research the religion of TiruvaLLuvar that has not been seen by any researcher till date. My wonder knew no limits.

I went to the French Library in Chennai and checked the nigaNdu. There are many dictionaries named ChuuLamani, Divakaram, Pingalandhai, and Asiriya Uriccheer Nigandu. There is a sUtra that reads 'iRai Sivan kadan vengai'. I understood that until the sixth century the word iRai denoted only Sivan as a meaning that referred to the God; that word did not refer to other Gods until then. It was clear how deeply and subtly Sri Maha SwamigaL had mastered TirukkuraL. I adored that limitless and great knowledge.

1783
General topics / Re: Quotes from Shankaracharya's
« on: January 15, 2013, 04:18:37 PM »

1784
General Discussion / Re: Thiruvalluvar Day , 15 Jan 2013
« on: January 15, 2013, 01:12:55 PM »
Refer the following link for more details on Thiruvalluvar and Thirukural

http://snsriramadesikan.com/thirukkural.html#Tirukkural

1785
General Discussion / Thiruvalluvar Day , 15 Jan 2013
« on: January 15, 2013, 12:47:20 PM »

Tiruvalluvar Day marks the birth anniversary of the immortal Tamil Poet-Saint Thiruvalluvar. He is the author of Kural or Thirukural, a poetic composition of great antiquity in Tamil Literature which can be termed as a treatise on the art of living a happy and peaceful life. In 2013, the date of Thiruvalluvar Day is January 15.
It is believed that Thiruvalluvar wrote the Thirukural in the second century AD but there are also some scholars who believe that it was written in first century BC.
Thiruvalluvar in Thirukural diagnoses the intricacies of human nature and one will be captivated by his thorough knowledge of human psychology. Many of his insights on human mind are yet to be studied by modern psychology. His advices on various topics are sagacious and practical and are relevant in all times. Each new generation is attracted to his teachings in the Thirukural as it is not hampered by prejudice or dogma of any kind.
The birth anniversary of Saint Thiruvalluvar is observed on the day after Pongal festival in Tamil Nadu. On the same day, Mattu Pongal is also observed.
A huge statue of Thiruvalluvar is located at Kanyakumari and is adjacent to the Vivekananda Memorial in the middle of the sea.
This is the significance of the Thiruvalluvar Statue in Kanyakumari :
Quote
The statue of Saint Tiruvalluvar greets visitors at Kanyakumari, the southernmost tip of India. The 133 feet tall statue stands next to Vivekananda Memorial, a temple for meditation. The height of 133 feet signifies the 133 "Adhikarams". The pedastal measures 38 feet in height, representing the 38 "Adhikarams" of the first part of Kural "Aram".

One of the  Thirukual  mentioned by Bhagwan is the following one .



124.நிலையின் திரியாது அடங்கியான் தோற்றம்
மலையினும் மாணப் பெரிது.

The glory of a Brahma gnani who is firmly established in the Self without any wavering is higher than a great mountain".

Though there is lot of commentaries and translations available on Thirukural , very few of those can be considered to be authentic as according to Sage TGN ( Courtesy Sri Ravi ) , Tamil Scholars who had a solid knowledge of Tamil lacked required Spiritual Knowledge and Sanskrit Scholars who  had good spiritual knowledge lacked proper expertise in Tamil language with the result no one could give a complete vision of what Thiruvalluvar intended to convey .

Anyway  Thirukural is a very precious text and its message is not just to Hindus /Indians/Tamilians but for people the world over and I have taken upon myself to commit to memory the verses of Kural starting from today the Auspicious day of Thiruvalluvar Day and let me see how much I can commit to memory by the next Thiruvalluvar Day in 2014  :)

I have quoted one Kural quoted by Bhagwan but those who can share other  Kurals quoted  by Bhagwan can share the same here .

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