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Messages - Subramanian.R

Arunachala / Re: Meditation on Mt. Arunachala
« on: June 27, 2008, 05:24:22 PM »
Dear Shivani, I am sorry I had given a poorer description of Himalayas.
The Himalayas contain abodes of Shiva, Uma and Vishnu and it is the
birthplace of Ganga.  But these are all temples of gods but Arunachala
is God Himself.  There are, it is said, 51 sakti-peetas and 107 vishnu
sthalas (108th is Vaikunta, where one can go after the death only) and 5 Siva sthalas representing 5 elements.  But these are all again houses of gods ony.  Arunachala is itself Siva with concorporate Sakti.  Arunachala Puranam gives the difference in detail.  Arunachala Siva. 

General topics / Vichara Mani Mala and Bhagavan
« on: June 27, 2008, 05:12:29 PM »
Mahatma Nischaladas wrote the Hindi Vichara Sagara.  This was
translated into Tamil by name Vichara Sagaram by someone later.
When one Arunachala Mudaliar, told Bhagavan that this Tamil
version is too difficult to read, Bhagavan wrote a simpler extract
called Vichara Mani Mala.  Since the authorship was originally claimed
by Arunachala Mudaliar.  Since Bhagavan had no interest in authorship,
He left it at that.  The Tamil "Complete Works", upto 1997 edition,
did not contain this extract.  However, it is found in Arthur Osborne's
2002 edition, in Bhagavan's name.  Vichara Mani Mala, contains
a good dialogue between Guru and disciple, regarding relative truth
(vyavaharika satya; empirical truth) and personal truth (pratibhasika
satya) which are experienced in waking state and dream state. (srkudai,
please see this book).  Arunachala Siva.   

Dear srkudai, I saw the details but I am not able to say anything now.
Let me think over.  It is all Ramana-Maya.  Arunachala Siva.   

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: fighting with ego
« on: June 27, 2008, 04:41:15 PM »
Dear srkudai,  I have not read Ashtavakra Gita in detail.  There is
no reference to it in "Talks" but "Day by Day' entry dt.  31.3.1945,
mentions it.  Bhagavn says that the essence of AG is: Surrender to
the Guru your notions of "I" and"mine", and this will give you
realization.  Bhagavan also cross-refers Vasishtam in this context.
The verses indicated by you are excellent and I shall read this
treatise in detail in one or two days.  Ashtavakra makes Janaka
to sit on his horse, with one leg on the stirrup and another leg on
the midair and leaves at it and comes back after some time, to
test his faith in guru.  Perhaps the allegory is that one realize the
Self within the time that is taken between placing both the legs on the stirrup if one has faith in Guru.  Arunachala Siva.   

Ashrams / Re: Ashram Meditation hall
« on: June 27, 2008, 04:14:31 PM »
Dear Shivani,  Tiruvannamalai is a medium size town, where
accommodation is available for about Rs 400 per day for 2
people.  Staying Ashram's own guest houses, need prior approval.
Inside the Ashram, you may visit the Matrubhuteshwar Temple,
a small Shiva temple, over the samadhi of Bhagavan's Mother,
and also Ramaneswara Mahalingam Temple, another bigger temple,
over the samadhi of Bhagavan.  You can mediate in the Hall in
front of Ramaneswara Mahalingam Temple or in the Old Hall,
(with limited hours of opening) where Bhagavan lived for more
than 20 years and held court with his devotees.   Here is where,
all the happenings took place.  This has been sanctified by thousands
of Bhagavan's devotees.  There is an Ashram Bookshop, where you
can buy English, Tamil, Hindi, Sanskrit, Telugu, Kannada and Malayalam books and CDs.  The Ashram Food centre is available for people on first come first served basis.  The morning breakfast is at 7.00 AM, lunch at
11.30 AM and tea at 4.00 PM and evening food at 7.00 PM.  These
are all South Indian vegetarian food and breakfast.  In T. Malai,
there is a very large Shiva temple, which will take about 4 to 5 hours
if you want to see everything in detail.  You can climb the Hill, if
you can or see Skandasramam and Virupaksha Cave which is about
1/2 km on the way to uphill.  The circumambulation is about 14 kms.
There is samadhi of Seshadri Swami, who was there during Bhagavan's
time.  There is also a samadhi of Yogi Ram Surat Kumar.
Arunachala Siva. 

Dear srkudai,  Bhagavan has informed Sampurnamma, to recite
Ribhu Gita even though she could not understand the meaning. 
This is mentioned in the Mountain Path, June 1993 article.  He
did not specify any particular chapter, but the chapter 26, which
speaks about undifferentiated abidance in non dual nature, can also
be used for daily recitation.  Sri Ramansramam has published an
English version (done by Society for Abidance in Truth, California,
U.S) and the original Tamil version of Ulaganatha Swami.  I do not
think they have Lingeswrara Rao's version and CD.  Arunachala Siva.

Dear srkudai, For a Brahma Jnani like Ramana, even the waking
state is a dream.  But He felt all emotions as if in a play.  Or He is
like a mirror reflecting the emotions of others.  On the last day
of His life in the body, when everyone around Him was crying and praying, He had asked after hearing the cooing of the peacocks:
"Whether the peacocks have been fed?"  Arunachala Siva.   

Dear srkudai,  I am not able to tell decisively.  But kindly tell me,
whether, (a) You decided to continue to sleep.  But did you
decide to continue the dream -- in the waking state or in the dream
state?  (b) Did you decide to jump down instead of climbing.  Was
this decision taken in the waking state or in the dream state?
(c) When did you know that you have met the caller's request
downhill? - in the waking state or in the dream state?

I still believe that one can decide to alter the dream, during next
time when the dream comes, but not in the same dream.

Arunachala Siva. 

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: Arjuna's question
« on: June 27, 2008, 12:15:56 PM »
Dear nonduel, Yes.  All of us are carrying our memory (fruits of good and bad karma) to the next birth and when the cumulative memory leads to Self knowledge we realize the Self.  The memory of one birth gives an advantage or a handicap (if it is a bad memory or fruits of karma)
in the next birth.  That is why, persons like Hunter Kannappa, within
a few visits to the Lord in the temple, could merge with the Self.  No
doubt there were several tests for him!  Every person on the way to
Self Realization has been put to test.  Arunachala Siva. 

Arunachala / Re: THE 'I' CONCIOUSNESS
« on: June 27, 2008, 12:02:51 PM »
Dear mick, I agree with you.  Fear of death is the primordial fear
for every living being.  This is fear of the unknown.  Death is
a relief but fearing about death is a pain.  The psychiatrists say
that fear of one losing is his mind (becoming a psychoneuratic or
a psychoic) comes from the fear of death. Fear about the death
is the hump on the way towards self-realization.  If one could overcome
this, the goal is reached.  Arunachala Siva.   

Arunachala / Re: Universe Inside The Hill ?
« on: June 27, 2008, 11:54:06 AM »
Dear mick,  I agree with you.  The Brhama Jnani  is the greatest
Siddha.  In that way, Ramana is a super-Suddha, Who knows
everything.  He has said once:  " I live in 20 lokas simulataneously,
and everywhere some people are sitting before me (as you are
sitting)."   Arunachala Siva.   

General topics / Chenkottai Avudai Akka
« on: June 26, 2008, 03:02:19 PM »
Chenkottai Avudai Akka (The Elder Sister Auvdai of Chenkottai)
was an illiterate, who had great insights about the Self and she
lived about 350 years in a place called Chenkottai in Southern
Tamil Nadu.  Her simple songs on bhakti, breath-control and jnana
are excellent pieces.  Bhagavan's Mother Azhagammal and other
elderly ladies of Tamil Nadu were knowing these songs and singing
them during their daily household chores.  Mother Azhagammal
used to sing these songs in Virupakshi Cave and Skandasramam.

A sample of Auvdai's song:-  "Oh, come and cross the ocean of
samsara, with faith in Guru and restlessness in your minds, we
shall soon reach the 'island' where our Guru is waiting for us
with extended hands and a lot of eagerness.  You need only to
discard your homes and all the attendant care with faith only in

Arunachala Siva.   

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: Arjuna's question
« on: June 26, 2008, 02:52:22 PM »
Further reg: Arjuana's question, how can the anxiety or crying or
indetermination, or pain be called a 'yoga'?  Why Arjuna's anxiety
is called Arjuna Vishada Yoga?  Is it a yoga like Bhakti or Breath-
control or Jnana.  I was considering this point upto around 11 PM
last night.  The answer seems to be that even such anxiety, weeping,
pain etc., are also Yoga or the Path.  Several saints have experienced
them.  Ramakrishna wept before Kali.  Manikka Vachakar's
Tiruvachakam is a continuous weeping to merge in the Self.  Even
scolding the God or Self could be a path.  Sundaramurthy another
Saivite Saint has scolded Siva asking him, "Oh you are living without
me.  Live, live, live for eternity!"  Thirunavukkarasar has suffered
unimaginable pains at the hands of the King who was a Jain.  The
saint was thrown into the deep sea; roased in calcium-kiln and
was given poison. 

Reg:  Why did Arjuna came back from Godhead and exhibited
anger, self pride, arrogance etc., Bhagavan says that there is no
retracting the path once you merge in the Self.  Perhaps in Arjana's
case, he went near the Godhead but did not merge!

Arunachala Siva.     

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: "I-I"
« on: June 26, 2008, 02:41:53 PM »
Dear mark and non-duel, you have put it nicely.  The pearl diver is
the mind and the pearl is self.  In Who am I?, Bhagavan says that
as a pear driver who dives with a loadstone, one should dive into the
ocean and takes the pearl.  This, He says when a question is asked
about "Vairagya.'  - that is non-attachment.  (Question No. 19).  To
take the 'simile' a little further:-

1. Pearl - Self
2. Pearl-Diver - self or mind
3. Ocean - samsara or bith
4. Load Stone - attachment towards all other things in life.
5. Non attachment - Vairagya -  non attachment towards the
 For a pearl diver, when he seizes the pearl, he does not
feel the loadstone or he does not need an attachment as coming out
of the ocean needs no weight behind!
 Arunachala Siva.

The teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi / Re: Arjuna's question
« on: June 25, 2008, 05:30:30 PM »
Dear 'non duel'.  The question can be taken up with two possibilities.
For an 'avatara' like Bhagavan Ramana, the question of 'carrying
the knowledge' of the previous birth, does not arise, because they
are already the Self and the birth is to show the way and goal for
others.  For example, Jnana Sambandha, the great Saivite poet (Kavyakanta Ganapati Muni, calls Bhagavan as an 'avatara' of
Jnana Sambandha, in Ramana Gita), sange songs in praise of Shiva
at the age of 3, when Uma, the consort gave her breast milk to him,
when he was crying on the bank of a tank in Sirkali. 

For others, who have to work our their search and realize the Self
in several births, the 'carrying of knowledge' does take place.  As
they carry the effects of their good and bad deeds, they carry the
knowledge too.

In Arjuna's case, he had the anxiety about the war, which is
'Arjuna Vishada' in the first chapter.  When Krishna taught him
the knowledge, he took it and conducted the war.  But Arjuna's
'knowledge' was not complete, as he showed signs of anger, self-pride,
arrogance etc., later and vowed to bring back the dead child of
a Brahmin and rushed to Vishnu Loka, to fight the Death!  Krishna
again had to intervene and bring the child back and to tell Arjuna
that he is not fully realized, vide Narayaneeyam or Bhagvatam.
Arunachala Siva.