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Messages - Subramanian.R

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10321
General Discussion / Re: Laghu Vasudeva Mananam:
« on: December 22, 2015, 09:52:59 AM »
How can we know that Brahman who is said to be identical with this Pratyagatman is without
the above mentioned limitations?

The pot is real, the cloth is real, the wall is real, the earth is real, water is real, fire is real, air
is real, sky is real.  All these varied objects which are elements and made of elements are
considered by us as real.  From this itself the reality (Sattamikatva) and all pervasiveness
(Vibhutva) of the Atman become clear. Such all pervading Atman cannot be limited by space.
For the same reason the Atman is eternal (Anadi).

What is eternal cannot have the limitations of time, of which we think in terms of past, present
and future.  It means that the Atman is beyond time. In the same way, that it is beyond Space.
This is the meaning of being Anadi.

contd.,

Arunachala Siva.       

10322
General Discussion / Re: Laghu Vasudeva Mananam:
« on: December 22, 2015, 09:46:32 AM »
The intention of this questioner is not to win through specious arguments.  The intention is only
the clearing of a doubt.

Then understand what is said hereafter.  The three limitations of time, space and individuality
are present only in the body and not in the Atman.  The all inclusiveness and unlimitedness of
the Atman who is all pervading has none of these limitations. 

contd.,

Arunachala Siva.

10323
General Discussion / Re: Laghu Vasudeva Mananam:
« on: December 22, 2015, 09:43:04 AM »
If the Atman alone is indivisible and unitary, one must be able to see all these characteristics
together in a single apprehension.  But one does not see so.  I feel that I am standing in this
place and not in that place.  So the Atman cannot be said to have no limitation of space.  So
the Atman cannot be said to have no limitation of space.  The perception I have got that I was
born ten years ago and I shall be dying ten years after now, proves that the Atman has limitation
of time. When I have the feeling that I am a Brahmana and not a Kshatriya how can you deny
that limitation of individuality in the Atman?  Since all these differences are there how can I accept
that the Atman is without limitation?

In the 11th chapter the characteristics of Atman and non Atman have been stated as follows:

Atman is without any internal or external limitations while Anatman has got all kinds of limitations.
It was also said there whatever is seen in the Atman is not actually there but only superimposed
on it.  What is superimposed on anything has no actuality even when the superimposition is perceived
during any period during any period of time.  In spite of this knowledge, you are again asking the
characteristic of Atman to be described.  This befits only an opponent determined to defeat another
in argument by fair means or foul and not honest inquirer whose intention is to learn.

contd.,

Arunachala Siva.             

10324
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 09:26:47 AM »
Verse 40:


அந்த ணாளரும் ஆங்கது கேட்டவர்
பந்த மானுடப் பாற்படு தென்றிசை
இந்த வான்றிசை எட்டினும் மேற்பட
வந்த புண்ணியம் யாதென மாதவன்.

he saints of loving kindness,
Who were listening to him said:
?All the eight directions are realms where souls
Get embodied befitting their karma; what especial piety
Has indeed been wrought by the South
To merit in its realm, his incarnation??   

Arunachala Siva.



10325
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 09:24:57 AM »
Verse 39:


அங்க ணாளன் அதற்கருள் செய்தபின்
நங்கை மாருடன் நம்பிமற் றத்திசை
தங்கு தோற்றத்தில் இன்புற்றுச் சாருமென்று
அங்க வன்செயல் எல்லாம் அறைந்தனன்.



The Lord of great compassion said: ?Let it be so.?
Then he and the damsel-pair, as gracious mortals
Took birth in the South and lived in connubial joy.
They have now hither returned.?
To his holy audience Upamanyu fully narrated their lives.

Arunachala Siva.

10326
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 09:23:13 AM »
Verse 38:


கைக ளஞ்சலி கூப்பிக் கலங்கினான்
செய்ய சேவடி நீங்குஞ் சிறுமையேன்
மையல் மானுட மாய்மயங் கும்வழி
ஐய னேதடுத் தாண்டருள் செய்என.



?Hearing this he was dismayed;
Folding his hands in worship, he addressed Him thus:
?O Lord, if in my confounding human state
I stand bewildered, do redeem me
By Your gracious intercession.?   


Arunachala Siva.

10327
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 09:21:23 AM »
Verse  37:


ஆதி மூர்த்தி அவன்திறம் நோக்கியே
மாதர் மேல்மனம் வைத்தனை தென்புவி
மீது தோன்றிஅம் மெல்லிய லாருடன்
காதல் இன்பம் கலந்தணை வாயென.


?The Primal Lord beheld him and said:
?You set your mind on the damsel-pair;
Be born in the southern realm;
Be linked with them in loving joy, and then return.?   


Arunachala Siva.


10328
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 09:19:21 AM »
Verse 36:



முன்னம் ஆங்கவன் மொய்ம்முகை நாண்மலர்
என்னை யாட்கொண்ட ஈசனுக் கேய்வன
பன்ம லர்கொய்து செல்லப் பனிமலர்
அன்னம் அன்னவ ருங்கொண் டகன்றபின்.



?He gathered many many flowers -- fit for the Lord,
That were about to bloom and sought by bees,
And went away; like him the pen-like lasses
Also gathered cool flowers and hied away.   

Arunachala Siva.

10329
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 07:58:15 AM »
Verse 35:


மாத வம்செய்த தென்றிசை வாழ்ந்திடத்
தீதி லாத்திருத் தொண்டத் தொகைதரப்
போது வாரவர் மேல்மனம் போக்கிடக்
காதல் மாதருங் காட்சியிற் கண்ணினார்.



?For the great thriving of the South
That indeed had wrought immense tapas,
He who was to incarnate thither and hymn
The flawless Tiru-th-tonda-th-Tokai,
Did set his mind on them both;
The loving lasses also reveled in the joy
Of beholding him.


Arunachala Siva.   

10330
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 07:56:00 AM »
Verse 34:


அந்த மில்சீர் அனிந்திதை ஆய்குழல்
கந்த மாலைக் கமலினி என்பவர்
கொந்து கொண்ட திருமலர் கொய்வுழி
வந்து வானவர் ஈசர் அருளென.



?When Anintitai of boundless glory and Kamalini
Of dark and dense hair adorned with a fragrant wreath,
Were gathering choice flowers from the bunches,
It happened like the grace of the Lord of Gods.   


Arunachala Siva.

10331
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 07:54:15 AM »
Verse 33:


அங்கு முன்னெமை ஆளுடை நாயகி
கொங்கு சேர்குழற் காமலர் கொய்திடத்
திங்கள் வாள்முகச் சேடியர் எய்தினார்
பொங்கு கின்ற கவினுடைப் பூவைமார்.


?Thither came a pair of women, passing beautiful,
With visages like unto the full-moon bright,
To gather flowers, rich in pollen,
For the Lord?s Consort whom they served.

Arunachala Siva.

10332
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 07:52:27 AM »
Verse 32:



அன்ன வன்பெயர் ஆலால சுந்தரன்
முன்னம் ஆங்கொரு நாள்முதல் வன்தனக்கு
இன்ன வாமெனு நாள்மலர் கொய்திடத்
துன்னி னான்நந் தனவனச் சூழலில்.

?His name was Alala Sundarar.
One day, of yore, to gather fresh flowers
Wherewith to deck the Primordial Lord
He fared forth to the flower-garden.   

Arunachala Siva.


10333
General topics / Re: Tevaram - Some select verses.
« on: December 22, 2015, 07:50:36 AM »
Verse 31 of Periya Puranam:



உள்ள வண்ணம் முனிவன் உரைசெய்வான்
வெள்ள நீர்ச்சடை மெய்ப்பொரு ளாகிய
வள்ளல் சாத்தும் மதுமலர் மாலையும்
அள்ளும் நீறும் எடுத்தணை வானுளன்.

Then the Saint began his true narration thus:
?Unto the True Ens, the Lord of Munificence
In whose crest courses the flood of Ganga,
His service was to gather honey-laden blooms
And weave them into garlands;
He was also the bearer of His Holy Ash.

Arunachala Siva.

10334
Verse 6:


மானேநீ நென்னலை நாளைவந் துங்களை
    நானே யெழுப்புவன் என்றலும் நாணாமே
போன திசைபகராய் இன்னம் புலர்ந்தின்றோ
    வானே நிலனே பிறவே அறிவரியான்
தானேவந் தெம்மைத் தலையளித்தாட் கொண்டருளும்
    வான்வார் கழல்பாடி வந்தோர்க்குன் வாய்திறவாய்
ஊனே உருகாய் உனக்கே உறும்எமக்கும்
    ஏனோர்க்குந் தங்கோனைப் பாடேலோ ரெம்பாவாய்.


O gazelle-like one,
you said:
``On the morrow,
I myself Will come to wake ye up.
`` Pray,
tell us the direction into which your pridian promise shamelessly frittered away.
Has it not dawned for you yet?
Unto us who come Singing the lofty,
long,
ankleted and sacred feet of Him Who is unknown to the heaven,
the earth and all else,
And who on His own free volition deigns to come down To foster us and rule us by enslaving us,
You ope not your lips;
neither does your body melt in love.
Such deportment befits you alone.
Lo,
bestir Yourself and come forth to sing Him who is Our Lord as well as of others,
Empaavaai !


Arunachala Siva.

10335



Bhagavan Ramana's own philosophy [which is of course, the only true philosophy of this universe],
is reflected in His own works.  But in His life, He had to meet several people, with different backgrounds/levels of maturity. Therefore He had to water down the message depending upon
the devotee.  These replies, should not be taken out of context. One cannot pick up one or two
replies and say that this is the final teaching of Bhagavan Ramana.

Take this illustration:-

1. Once Dilip Kumar Roy sang some nice songs and then asked Bhagavan whether the music
alone sung in devotion to god, would confer him liberation.  Bhagavan Ramana said:
"Why not? Pursue this with conviction."

2. To Devaraja Mudaliar, who got excited by some Tiruppugazh songs which were sung in the Hall, asked Bhagavan Ramana, whether singing Tiruppugazh alone could take one to liberation.
Bhagavan Ramana said: "O Mudaliar! Go behind these songs and see the mounam, Silence which
is all pervading." 

Arunachala Siva.

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