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Topics - silentgreen

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This is a dialog between a disciple (d) and a software-side guru (sguru) on the subject of spirituality. The questions and answers are very brief. So a commentary is given below to understand the in-between thinking that is taking place. The questions and answers are taking place with a lot of silent contemplation in between.

The discussion starts as given below.

d: I have already read 1000 megabytes of scriptures. But still I am not getting the fulfillment I expect.

---- Silence ----

d: So?

1. The import is that the disciple has not approached sguru without any preparation. The disciple has already read 1000 megabytes of scriptures. Within that 1000 megabytes the disciple has already covered what he thinks are the key scriptures.

2. At this point the disciple has not gone for reading another 1000 megabytes because the disciple felt that reading further scriptures is repetition of the same concepts with different symbology. Therefore he decided to consult sguru.

3. It is not that the disciple has not found any fulfillment after reading the scriptures, but that he has not found the level of fulfillment he is seeking in life.

4. The Silence means that sguru has not responded. Silence is a potent thing, so in silence many things can get clarified by itself. But in this case even after a long silence the disciple could not get the clarity. Any more silence is not helping him. He expected a response from sguru. Therefore he says: So?

To be contn ....

General topics / Intellect vs Feeling
« on: July 05, 2013, 04:51:23 PM »
First it is absolutely necessary to clear the intellectual portion, although we know that intellectuality is almost nothing; for it is the heart that is of most importance. It is through the heart that the Lord is seen, and not through the intellect. The intellect is only the street-cleaner, cleansing the path for us, a secondary worker, the policeman; but the policeman is not a positive necessity for the workings of society. He is only to stop disturbances, to check wrong-doing, and that is all the work required of the intellect. When you read intellectual books, you think when you have mastered them, 'Bless the Lord that I am out of them', because the intellect is blind and cannot move of itself, it has neither hands nor feet. It is the feeling that works, that moves with speed infinitely superior to electricity or anything else. Do you feel? -- that is the question. If you do, you will see the Lord. It is the feeling that you have today that will be intensified, deified, raised to the highest platform, until it feels everything, the oneness in everything, till it feels God in itself and in others. The intellect can never do that. 'Different methods of speaking words, different methods of explaining the text of books, these are for the enjoyment of the learned, not for the salvation of the soul'.

Swami Vivekananda

General topics / Judgement of God
« on: March 12, 2013, 01:35:56 PM »
This post to narrate incidents to illustrate how one needs to reap the results of one's actions.

This is true story I read in a book. A lawyer saw a beggar on the road badly afflicted with leprosy from where pus was coming out. After giving some money the lawyer was going away, when the beggar called back:

O lawyer babu, did'nt you recognize me? I am the same person whose case you fought long back. That time you were able to save me from the judgement of the world, but see my condition now; you were'nt able to save me from the judgement of God.

This incident deeply affected the lawyer and changed his life.

General topics / The nature of Jnana
« on: March 11, 2013, 09:54:17 AM »
These questions have been carried over from another thread which has become congested.

I request  forum members to give clear-cut and concise answers to these questions.
1. Exactly what type of understanding prevents a jnani from becoming a robber?

2. What is that freedom inspite of having which and becoming fearless a jnani does not rob?

3. What is the nature of that detachment which prevents a jnani from robbing?

4. What is the relationship between vyavaharika and paramarthika? Does paramarthika understanding gets reflected in vyavaharika life or are the two completely detached?

A jnani is anyway always detached and sees everything as a dream.

The questions may appear simple but it contains the essence of misunderstanding about jnana.

Translations and Commentaries by Forum Members / Light Post
« on: October 29, 2012, 03:35:30 PM »
Got a mail from friend Nagraj. Thought I should come for another spell since he remembered me so kindly. Now I will post "Light Post".  Posts will be light and may throw light, so Light Post.

The thread will be a conversation between a companion guru (cguru) and a disciple. cguru is more of a companion to spend idle time under a banyan tree than a guru. Whether he is self-realized is unknown, neither is the disciple bothered about it. Spending idle time is what matters.

Externally cguru has all good marks. He has matted hair and long beard. Sometimes he puts marks of Shiva and sometimes insignia of Vishnu, depending on the festival. During Muruga festival he will stick some feathers of peacock over a duck and say it is the peacock of Muruga. From his appearance he can be judged either as a sage or eccentric; either of great austerity or an idler.

What type of conversation happens between the guru and the disciple?
Obviously Light, so Light Post.

Here is a sample conversation.

d: Today I visited a forum. There only one member, one Mr S. is there from the beginning of the forum. Other members come and go; go and come.

cguru: Is it the forum of Bhagavan Ramana?

d: How do you know?

cguru: Because things are happening as per his sayings?

d: What? Did Bhagavan told anything about forum?

cguru: Bhagavan said, behind all thoughts there will be a primary "I" thought which will be steady. All other secondary thoughts will come and go

Humour / Marriage
« on: December 23, 2010, 10:54:48 AM »
A person was of the opinion that without marriage life is useless.

When pointed out that some people stay unmarried for doing sadhana, he was unconvinced.

When further pointed out that you worship the same gods as those worshipped by the unmarried sadhakas, he promptly replied: I worship only those gods who are married.

Translations and Commentaries by Forum Members / Stories
« on: December 21, 2010, 11:30:59 AM »
Kapila Muni

The first teacher of any evolved creature is his mother. So, if ever a mother accepts her own son as her teacher, then that son has to be really great. Although such a thing rarely happens, particularly in the field of spirituality, yet it does happen, and Kapila, the son of Devahuti, is a luminous example of this. His mother became his first disciple, and in later times he came to be known as the Father of Philosophy. His simple life, coupled with his erudition in Samkhya, Yoga, Vedanta, and Bhakti schools of thoughts, makes him the greatest among sages.

Unlike many other sages of Vedic times, Kapila is more historical and human. Even Acharya Shankara accepts his identity and greatness as the teacher of Samkhya philosophy. Various legends, traditions and writings show the impact of the sage on the Indian psyche.

An Extraordinary Son
Kapila's fahter was the great sage Kardama, and the mother was Devahuti. The legend is that Devahuti, although a divine personality, was too infatuated with the trappings of the world. Out of sheer passion to enjoy life, she requested her sage husband to make it possible for her to do so in a spectacular fashion. The sage obliged. Devahuti was now able to experience such enjoyments as were not possible even for the gods to enjoy. However, soon after, Kardama left everything, including his weeping wife, and went to perform tapasya, after their son, Kapila was born. This giving up was in accordance with an earlier agreement between the couple.

Kapila is believed to be a born Siddha, a man who has attained perfection. He was a spiritual prodigy from his early childhood, and he soon took to performing unwavering tapasya. The hard spiritual labour bore fruits, and Kapila attained the Highest state of being even while quite young. He was now ready to engage himself in the welfare of humanity by meditating on the Universal Self, and also by teaching, instructing and guiding the spiritual seekers. The divine providence was such that his own mother, Devahuti, became his first disciple. She had been disillusioned with worldly enjoyment after the departure of her husband. This experience had made her long for eternal peace and joy that comes only to the spiritually illumined and liberated. With this foremost desire in her mind, she approached her own son to instruct her in the ways of God. Kapila the son, agreed to be Kapila, the teacher to her mother. The son-mother soon turned to be guru-shishya.

Kapila then taught her mother the Samkhya system of philosophy (which latter became Jnana Yoga), the Yoga system of sadhana, and the Bhakti way of spiritual realisation. These three vital aspects of Hindu spiritual tradition were first propounded and explained in detail by sage Kapila only. The latter philosophers, saints and poets developed these ideas into fully grown systems, which continue to play essential role in the Hindu system of thought even today.

While preaching his mother about the importance of devotion to the Lord, Kapila said,
The glory of the Lord is always worth singing; for His glories enhance the glories of His devotees. One should therefore meditate upon the Supreme Personality of Godhead and upon His devotees. One should meditate on the eternal form of the Lord until the mind becomes fixed.

Devahuti felt so illumined and blessed by the instructions, of her own son that she prayed to him,
I believe, my Lord, that You are Lord Vishnu Himself under the name of Kapila, and You are the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the Supreme Brahman! The saints and sages, being freed from all the disturbances of the senses and mind, meditate upon You, for by Your mercy only can one become free from the clutches of the three modes of material nature. At the time of dissolution, all the Vedas are sustained in You only.

As instructed by her son, Devahuti began to practice bhakti yoga and soon became detached from her delightfully attractive home, and even from her own body. With her mind always fixed on God, she soon became liberated from material bondages, attained samadhi, and finally became one with the Supreme.

Kapila is accepted as one of the twenty-four incarnations of Lord Vishnu in Bhagavata Purana.
Lord Krishna said in the Bhagavad Gita: "among siddhas (perfected beings), I am the sage Kapila"

--- from Vedanta Kesari

February 1882
M.'s first visit to the Master

It was on a Sunday in spring, a few days after Sri Ramakrishna's birthday, that M. met him the first time. Sri Ramakrishna lived at the Kailibari, the temple garden of Mother Kali, on the bank of the Ganges at Dakshineswar.

M., being at leisure on Sundays, had gone with his friend Sidhu to visit several gardens at Baranagore. As they were walking in Prasanna Bannerji's garden, Sidhu said: "There is a charming place on the bank of the Ganges where a paramahamsa lives. Should you like to go there?" M. assented and they started immediately for the Dakshineswar temple garden. They arrived at the main gate at dusk and went straight to Sri Ramakrishna's room. And there they found him seated on a wooden couch, facing the east. With a smile on his face he was talking of God. The room was full of people, all seated on the floor, drinking in his words in deep silence.

M. stood there speechless and looked on. It was as if he were standing where all the holy places met and as if Sukadeva himself were speaking the word of God, or as if Sri Chaitanya were singing the name and glories of the Lord in Puri with Ramananda, Swarup, and the other devotees.

Sri Ramakrishna said: "When, hearing the name of Hari or Rama once, you shed tears and your hair stands on end, then you may know for certain that you do not have to perform such devotions as the sandhya any more. Then only will you have a right to renounce rituals; or rather, rituals will drop away of themselves. Then it will be enough if you repeat only the name of Rama or Hari, or even simply Om."

Continuing, he said, "The sandhya merges in the Gayatri, and the Gayatri merges in Om."

M. looked around him with wonder and said to himself: "What a beautiful place! What a charming man! How beautiful his words are! I have no wish to move from this spot." After a few minutes he thought, "Let me see the place first; then I'll come back here and sit down."

As he left the room with Sidhu, he heard the sweet music of the evening service arising in the temple from gong, bell, drum, and cymbal. He could hear music from the nahabat, too, at the south end of the garden. The sounds travelled over the Ganges, floating away and losing themselves in the distance. A soft spring wind was blowing, laden with the fragrance of flowers; the moon had just appeared. It was as if nature and man together were preparing for the evening worship. M. and Sidhu visited the twelve Siva temples, the Radhakanta temple, and the temple of Bhavatarini. And as M. watched the services before the images his heart was filled with joy.

On the way back to Sri Ramakrishna's room the two friends talked. Sidhu told M. that the temple garden had been founded by Rani Rasmani. He said that God was worshipped there daily as Kali, Krishna, and Siva, and that within the gates sadhus and beggars were fed. When they reached Sri Ramakrishna's door again, they found it shut, and Brinde, the Maid, standing outside. M., who had been trained in English manners and would not enter a room without permission, asked her, "Is the holy man in?" Brinde replied, "Yes he's in the room."

M: "How long has he lived here?"
Brinde: "Oh, he has been here a long time."
M: "Does he read many books?"
Brinde: "Books? Oh, dear no! They're all on his tongue."

M. had just finished his studies in college. It amazed him to hear that Sri Ramakrishna read no books.

M: "Perhaps it is time for his evening worship. May we go into the room? Will you tell him we are anxious to see him?"
Brinde: "Go right in, children. Go in and sit down."

Entering the room, they found Sri Ramakrishna alone, seated on the wooden couch. Incense had just been burnt and all the doors were shut. As he entered, M. with folded hands saluted the Master. Then, at the Master's bidding, he and Sidhu sat on the floor.

Sri Ramakrishna asked them: "Where do you live? What is your occupation? Why have you come to Baranagore?"

M. answered the questions, but he noticed that now and then the Master seemed to become absent-minded. Later he learnt that this mood is called bhava, ecstasy. It is like the state of the angler who has been sitting with his rod: the fish comes and swallows the bait, and the float begins to tremble; the angler is on the alert; he grips the rod and watches the float steadily and eagerly; he will not speak to anyone. Such was the state of Sri Ramakrishna's mind. Later M. heard, and himself noticed, that Sri Ramakrishna would often go into this mood after dusk, sometimes becoming totally unconscious of the outer world.

M: "Perhaps you want to perform your evening worship. In that case may we take our leave?"
Sri Ramakrishna (still in ecstasy): "No - evening worship? No, it is not exactly that."
After a little conversation M. saluted the Master and took his leave. "Come again", Sri Ramakrishna said.

On his way home M. began to wonder: "Who is this serene - looking man who is drawing me back to him? Is it possible for a man to be great without being a scholar? How wonderful it is! I should like to see him again. He himself said, 'Come again.' I shall go tomorrow or the day after."

Translations and Commentaries by Forum Members / Vishnu
« on: December 14, 2010, 11:17:11 AM »
शान्ताकारं   भुजगशयनं   पद्मनाभं   सुरेशं
Shaantaakaaram Bhujagashayanam Padmanaabham Suresham

Lord Vishnu

शान्ताकारं भुजगशयनं पद्मनाभं सुरेशं
विश्वाधारं गगनसदृशं मेघवर्ण शुभांगम् ।
लक्ष्मीकान्तं कमलनयनं योगिभिध्यार्नगम्यम्
वन्दे विष्णुं भवभयहरं सर्वलोकैकनाथम् ॥

Shaantaakaaram Bhujagashayanam Padmanaabham Suresham
Vishvaadhaaram Gaganasadrsham Meghavarnna Shubhaamgam |
Lakssmiikaantam Kamalanayanam Yogibhidhyaarnagamyam
Vande Vissnnum Bhavabhayaharam Sarvalokaikanaatham ||

I salute the great Lord Vishnu, whose appearance is serene,
rests on the snake Adisesha, possesses Lotus in the naval,
Lord of gods, sustains the universe, infinite as the space,
bluish in appearance, handsome, Lord of Goddess Lakshmi,
possesses lotus-like eyes, attainable to the great sages
through eternal knowledge, eliminates the fear of worldly attachments,
and the Lord of all the worlds.

Translations and Commentaries by Forum Members / Kundalini
« on: December 09, 2010, 03:50:53 PM »
Kundalini is often described from the Bhakti point of view, as the energetic aspect of the Devi or Shakti.
Many sadhaks practicing Kundalini Yoga are worshippers of Devi.

The topic is very sublime and often crowded with wrong notions. It is also out of the reach for many of us.  It is related to mystical experience. Therefore it is better to understand what a mystical experience is.

Here are some of the passages taken from the writings of Gopi Krishna who was graced by Kundalini awakening and who demystified many notions about mystical experiences and brought about a light of understanding regarding them.

#. The class of human beings that has exerted the greatest influence on the thinking and behavior of mankind has been that of the prophets, saviors and mystics, including the founders of all current faiths. Kings, philosophers, rulers, scientists or scholars have, all combined, played a secondary role. Revealed religious teaching has held a fascination and maintained a grip on the human mind that is unmatched in any other sphere of life. This grip has persisted for thousands of years. Why? What makes millions upon millions of human beings believe implicitly in the words of the founder of their faith even in this rational age? While literally flooded by the marvels of technology, why do the masses still have greater faith in the ideals of their religion and the teachings of their prophets or saints than in the rational expositions of scientists and philosophers?

Why do even distinguished scientists subscribe to faith? What is the explanation for this paradox? There are examples where even those rationalists who were atheists in their youth turned religious towards the close of life. Even materialistic political ideologies have not been able to uproot this inherent urge in the masses. No psychologist or thinker has so far provided a rational explanation for this apparently erratic behavior of the human mind.

I am suggesting for the first time an explanation for the profound phenomenon of religion for close examination and empirical verification by scientists and scholars. I do so with a full sense of my responsibility and the duty I owe to humankind and to God. From my point of view, religious experience is not to be treated lightly and cannot form a subject on which everyone can write or talk. It is of the profoundest significance and importance to humanity. This is why secrecy has always been maintained in respect of the esoteric doctrines of faith and why the hidden truths about God and the soul were talked of with bated breath.

#. It has always been felt instinctively that religion is a sacred subject beyond the province of the intellect. The massive Vedas of Ancient India were committed to memory and transmitted orally, generation after generation, for centuries, a prodigious feat, because there was a subconscious awareness that what they contained was of the utmost importance for humankind. The concern shown by theologians and divines for every word and line of the gospels of all faiths, to preserve them from distortion or interpolation, has also been due to the same intuitive impulse.

The reason is that mystical vision or, in other words, the vision of God, is the target of human evolution. Those who had it in the right form exerted a tremendous fascination on the minds of others, because they were the first arrivals at a destination for which all of us are bound. Their teachings have been cherished and acted upon with the utmost care, as they contain hints and guidelines about the Path that all of us have to traverse to reach the same stage.

#. If the race has to survive, not only political dissension but also religious discord must cease. But how can this concord be brought about? In my opinion, the only way is for science to locate the factors responsible for enlightenment. The illuminated founders of all faiths were human beings. They were born and had bodies like others. What mystery lay behind their extraordinary visions, the power of their words and the tremendous influence they exerted on countless human beings constitutes a riddle that has not yet been rationally answered.

#. Mystical vision, enlightenment and prophethood are the natural endowments of a more evolved human brain, brought in tune with the spiritual realities of the universe. Dogmatic barriers to the acceptance of this position will gradually cease when the organic factors responsible for this transformation are clearly demonstrated by the objective methods of science.

#. In the highest states of mystical ecstasy every object springs to life and the whole of Nature becomes alive. One incredible living, feeling Ocean of Being connects the mystic with every object in the universe. Mystical ecstasy is not an altered state of consciousness. It is not normal human consciousness in a state of rapture, or intense absorption in the contemplation of one object, or of quietude in which the mind reflects only a serene and silent state of awareness. It is not akin to the mental conditions produced by LSD, nitrous oxide, hypnosis, biofeedback, or any other artificial method or chemical.

#. There is no class of books that has been preserved with such love and care and regarded with such veneration as the gospels of every faith. They are considered sacred because what they deal with has been extremely rare and the subject they discuss is unfamiliar to the discursive intellect.

#. Present-day writings on altered states of consciousness only confuse the issue. What state of mind do they actually try to represent? If it is mystical experience, most of them deplorably fall short of the actual position. Mystical vision has nothing to do with sorcery, magic, miraculous happenings, weird adventures in the realm of the paranormal, bizarre visionary experiences or fantasies of any kind. In the genuine illuminative state, there is no clouding of the intellect, no riot of colors, no encounters with strange creatures, no weird or bizarre scenes but only an indescribable state of glory, happiness and love, coupled with the direct experience of an all-pervading, extended consciousness, or an Almighty, Omnipresent Cosmic Being.

#. The only sources available to gain correct and precise information about this state are the religious scriptures and the writings of the great mystics of the world. Since illuminated consciousness, and not altered consciousness, is the goal of human evolution, it is of the utmost importance to make a distinction between the works of mystics and the fanciful, highly colored, or sensational, narratives of those who wish to create an applauding gallery for themselves, or who mistakenly believe that they have had the experience without making any attempt to confirm their belief.

#. Augustine, quoted by Eckhart, likens it to being struck by lightning, when one hears inwardly the affirmation “Truth,” to put a seal of authenticity on the experience.

St. Paul fell in a swoon on the road to Damascus and Moses experienced it as a fire in the bush.

Mohammed saw himself carried on a winged horse, called Buraq, to the near Presence of God, and the experience had an overwhelming effect on his life.

In one instant of grace, Buddha realized that he was enlightened. A long period of life spent before that in austerity and religious practices brought forth no result comparable to this flash.

According to the papyri found in Egypt, Jesus is reported to have said,“Let him not who seeks cease until he finds, and when he finds he shall be astonished. Astonished he shall reach the Kingdom, and having reached the Kingdom he shall rest.

One of the Upanishads compares Brahman to a thunderbolt upraised, ruling all the elements of creation.

The Sufi Bullah Shah, sings,“To ascend the gallows is the pathway that leads to the love of the Lord. If you desire to have His vision, be ever prepared to wager your life for His sight.

The Bhagavad-Gita graphically describes the impact:
"If the splendor of a thousand suns were to blaze out together, in the sky, that might resemble the glory of the Mahatman.There Pandava (Arjuna) beheld the whole universe divided into manifold parts, standing in one in the body of the Deity of Deities. Then he, Arjuna, overwhelmed with astonishment, his hair standing on end, bowed down his head to the Shining One, and with joined palms spoke.”

#. In every case of illumination, mere visionary experience is not sufficient. Illumination must be attended by certain objective signs to confirm it. Why has mystical vision such a powerful impact on the mind of the beholder that he or she often becomes intoxicated with the love of God? Why does he prefer solitude to even the most joyous company and renounce the ordinary pleasures of life to revel in a delight before which all the pleasures of the earth seem stale?

to be continued ...

General topics / Kalas: A measure of Chaitanya Shakti
« on: November 12, 2010, 10:50:35 AM »
In the scriptures, Chaitanya-Shakti is measured by means of kalas.
Sandipani Muni also imparted this knowledge to Sri Krishna.

According to this:
Rocks, minerals and other inert matter have the lowest Chaitanya-Shakti of 1 kala.
Plants are the next evolution of Chaitanya-Shakti with 2 kalas.
Animals have 3,4 kalas.
Average human beings have 5 kalas.
Human beings with higher spiritual capacities have 6 kalas.
Saints have 7 kalas. The most advanced saints and sages have 8 kalas.

It is not possible for saints to go beyond 8 kalas. A normal human body cannot sustain greater than 8 kalas. Beyond that starts the incarnations (avataras) with special sattva bodies.

Varaha Avatara of Vishnu had special sattva body with 11 kalas.
Sri Ramachandra incarnated with 12 kalas.

When Sandipani Muni was imparting this knowledge to Sri Krishna and Balarama, he did not know that Sri Krishna was an Avatara. He mentioned upto Sri Ramachandra and said that in future other Avataras of Vishnu will incarnate. Sri Krisha incarnated with 16 kalas (Purna-Avatara), the highest possible Chaitanya Shakti. Amsa-Avataras incarnate with lesser kalas.

Translations and Commentaries by Forum Members / Shiva
« on: November 08, 2010, 08:23:50 AM »
महामृत्युंजय   मन्त्र
Maha Mrityunjaya Mantra

Lord Shiva

ॐ त्र्यम्बकं यजामहे  सुगन्धिं पुष्टिवर्धनम्
उर्वारुकमिव बन्धनान् मृत्योर्मुक्षीय मा मृतात् ॥

Om Tryambakam Yajaamahe Sugandhim Pussttivardhanam
Urvaarukamiva Bandhanaan Mrtyormukssiiya Maa Mrtaat ||

Om, We worship the Three-eyed One (Lord Shiva), who is fragrant and who nourishes all beings; may he liberate us from death, for the sake of immortality, even as a ripe cucumber is severed from the bondage of the creeper.

ॐ (Om): Symbol of Para Brahman
त्र्यम्बकं (Tryambakam): The three-eyed one
यजामहे (Yajaamahe): We worship
सुगन्धिं (sugandhim): The fragrant
पुष्टिवर्धनम् (Pussttivardhanam): पुष्टि (pusstti) - well nourished condition, वर्धनम् (vardhanam) - one who nourishes, strengthens
उर्वारुकं (Urvaarukam): उर्वारु (urvaaru) cucumber
इव (Iva): Like, just as, in the same manner
बन्धनान् (Bandhanaan): Unhealthy attachment (binding, tying, fetter etc)
मृत्योर् (Mrtyor): From death
मुक्षीय (Mukssiiya): Free us, Liberate us
मा (Maa): Not
अमृतात् (Amrtaa): Immortality

General topics / Soundaryalahari: Jnana and Bhakti - by Mahaswamigal
« on: November 04, 2010, 04:52:31 PM »
From discourses of Kanchi Mahaswamigal on Soundaryalahari:

How could Adi Shankara, who preached the jnAna mArga, have promoted this work (Soundaryalahari) of bhakti? It cannot be his, say some who profess Philosophy. But our Acharya was not a professor who isolated philosophy as a separate discipline. Having written very profoundly on advaita and its deepest implications in his several commentaries and the other works of his, he promoted the spiritual pursuit of the common man by writing and talking about the need to follow one's swadharma by Karma and Bhakti. His intent was to raise the common man from his own level. For this purpose he went from one pilgrim centre to another all his life and composed hymns after hymns and also established yantras in temples.

The philosophers argue: JnAni says everything is One. But Bhakti can happen only when there is the duality of the devotee and the deity. Therefore, they say, the jnAni can never be a bhakta. These philosophers cannot themselves claim to have the Enlightenment of advaita! But there have been those who could have so claimed, like the sage Suka, Madhusudana Saraswati or Sadasiva-brahmam. If we carefully study their lives we will know that they had been devotees of God in the fullest sense of the word and have themselves written works of Bhakti. Even in our own times Ramakrishna Paramahamsa has been a great devotee of Mother Goddess. Ramana Maharishi has done works of devotion on God Arunachalesvara. Again, on the other side, great devotees like Manikka-vasagar, Nammazhvar, Arunagiri-nathar, Tayumanavar, etc. have themselves been convinced advaitins, and this is reflected in innumerable flashes in their compositions.

If a jnAni should not do a Bhakti composition, then I would say that he should not also do a work of jnAna. Why am I saying this? Let us go back to the definition of a jnAni. The world is all mAyA; the thinking of people as if they were separate separate jIvAtmAs is nothing but Ignorance - with such a conviction through personal experience, they have thrown away that Ignorance as well as its basic locus, the mind, and they live in the non-dualistic state of  "I am everything" -  such should be the status of the jnAni; shouldn't it be so? Such a person preaching, or writing a book, even if it be about the subject of jnAna - is it not a contradiction? Unless such a person thinks there is a world outside of him and there are jIvAtmAs outside, how can he think of 'teaching'? Teaching whom? And when we look at it this way, all those great teachers of jnAna should really not be jnAnis! What power will there be for such a teaching about jnAna from teachers who are not jnAnis themselves?

On the other hand what do we observe in our experience? Whether it is the teaching about jnAna in the Gita, or the Viveka Chudamani of our Acharya, or the Avadhuta Gita of Sri Dattatreya or the teaching in the Yoga-vASiShTa, or a song of Tayumanavar, even as we just read these we feel we are being taken beyond the curtain created by mAyA to some distant peaceful state of Calm. Just by reading, in one's spiritually ripe stage, such teachings, there have been people who have renounced the world and reached the state of Bliss-in-one-Self! If these teachings had not been written from that spiritual apex of Experiential Excellence, how could such things have ever happened?

Therefore, however much by our intellectual logic, we may argue whether a jnAni can get bhakti, how the jnAni can do any preaching and so such possibilities cannot exist and so on, these are certainly happening, by the Will of the Lord which is beyond the Possible and the Impossible. It is only the Play of the Lord that, the jnAni, who is non-dualistic internally, appears to do things in the dualistic world. His mind may have vanished, mAyA might have been transcended by him; but that does not mean the outside world of jIvAtmAs has disintegrated. What do we gather from this? There is a Super-Mind which does all this and in some mysterious way is compering and directing the entire universe. And it also means it is the same Supra-Mind that is making the minds of men revolve in the illusion of mAyA. It is that Power which is known in advaita scriptures as saguNa-brahman or Ishvara. In the scriptures devoted to Shakti or Shiva , whenever they call the Actionless nirguNa-Brahman as 'ShivaM' they call this saguNa-brahman as 'Shakti', 'parAshakti' or 'ambAL'. Just as that nirguNa-Brahman exhibits itself and acts as the saguNa-brahman, so also, it must be presumed, that the enlightened jnAni also does his external actions and that again, is the work of the saguNa-brahman!

What is the path of jnAna? It is the effort through self-enquiry and meditation for the eradication of the mind and vanquishing of mAyA. But the other path is to dedicate oneself and all one's thoughts and actions to that very parA-shakti (who produced this mAyA on us) with an attitude of devotion. It is like giving the house-key to the thief himself! However much the parA-shakti may play with you and toss you and your mind hither and thither, Her infinite compassion cannot be negated. Only when we separate and rejoin, we realise the value of that union. To pray to Her for that reunion and for Her to get us back to Her in answer to our prayers - this is the great LeelA of Duality wherein She exhibits Her Infinite Compassion! So when one prays with Bhakti for such release She releases Him by giving Him that Wisdom of Enlightenment.

It is wrong to think that the goal of Bhakti lies in the dualistic attitude of being separate from God. It is by this wrong assumption that people ask the question: How can a jnAni exhibit Bhakti? In the very path of Bhakti wherein it appears there is an embedded duality, the same Bhakti would lead the practitioner to the stage where he will ask: Oh God! May I be one with You! This is the subtle point which the questioning people miss. When that stage comes to the devotee, the very parA-shakti known as kArya-brahman or saguNa-brahman will bless him with that jnAna that takes him to the non-dual kAraNa-brahman or nirguNa-brahman.

Not everybody can practise the path of jnAna that brings the realisation of the mahA-vAkyas by sravaNa (hearing), manana (thinking and recalling) and nididhyAsana (contemplating). Only when the mind vanishes one can realise the Self as the Absolute Brahman. If that is so, the real question is: How to kill the truant mind, which refuses to be subdued, much less vanquished? The very effort of vanquishing the mind has to be done by the mind only. How can it kill itself? The palm can slap another; but it cannot slap itself. Though we are thus brought to a dilemma, there is a supreme power which has created all these minds. So instead of self-effort to kill our minds, we should leave it to the parA-shakti and surrender to Her. Instead of falling at the feet of the witness for the prosecution we fall at the feet of the prosecutor.


Either She might totally eradicate your mind and give you the peaceful state of "I am shiva" (shivoham) or She might tell you from within:
"Look, after all, all this is My Play. The Play appears real to you because of mAyA. I shall totally erase that mAyA-view for you. Then you can also be like me, with that calm non-dual bliss inside and having on the outside a mind which is untouched by mAyA. Thereby you can also be a witness to all this worldly Dance. You will thus see yourself in Me and see Me in all the worldly multiplicities. In other words instead of making the mind non-existent, your mind will then be full of Me?"

And She might make you just exactly that way. But I know your worry. You constantly worry about the impossibility of transcending mAyA, of eradicationg this worldly vision and of vanquishing the mind. You keep worrying to the extent of almost weeping over it.

To such a wailing seeker She replies:
"Why do you worry and weep like this? You are worrying that you cannot discard the world from your view. But you forget that the world was not your making. This Sun and Moon, mountains, trees, oceans, animal kingdom, and the millions of living beings and categories - all this
was not created by you.
When that is so, you are worrying about the little 'you' that you are, and you forget that this little 'you' also was not your creation. Instead of thinking all this is not only one but one with Me, your mAyA clouded view makes you think they are all different and distinct. And even that mAyA-view that clouds you, again was not your making!
My dear child, you are caught up in the web of the world, a mind and a MAyA-cloud -- all this is My making. Did I not make Krishna say to you: mama mAyA duratyayA - (My mAyA is intranscendable). I have also told you there that it is 'daivI' (made by the Power of God). If you had made it all, then you could have overcome them. But it was all made by Me in the fullness of Power.
You jIvas have only little fragments of that Power. So if you cannot eradicate the world, the mind and the MAyA that I have made, you don't have to cry over it. It is not in your Power. It has to take place only by My Grace. Come nearer to Me through Devotion! I shall do the eradication in proper doses for you.
That somebody is able to control his mind and is able to walk on the path of jnAna - that again is My own Grace. It is I who have granted that privilege to him. What appears as many and different must be seen as one. To crave for that view is what is called 'advaita-vAsanA'. One gets it only by My Grace".

General topics / Radha-Krishna friendly quarrel
« on: October 22, 2010, 12:03:22 PM »
Once Sri Radha told Sri Krishna in a friendly quarrel: Apart from me, who is there to love you so much?

Sri Krishna said: Don't say that; there are many who loves me. If I play my flute my lovers will come to me.

Sri Radha said: Ok, let us take this challenge. Play your flute and let me see who comes to you. She then drew a line around Krishna and said. Whoever comes and does not have genuine love for you, and crosses this line will get destroyed.

Sri Krishna said smiling: Think once again before taking up this challenge.

Sri Radha said: Yes I have thought it and accept this challenge.

Sri Krishna then started playing his flute and slowly the other gopies comes to him and assembles outside the line. Sri Radha was intent to see what happens to them when they cross the line. The other gopies slowly cross the line and nothing happens to them.

Sri Radha said: Yes, I am defeated and started weeping.

Sri Krishna comes near her and said: Who said you have lost? Look carefully at the face of each gopi. Sri Radha looks at the face of each gopi and finds that all the face has the shadow of Radha.

Sri Krishna smiled and said: Yes, I see Radha only in all the gopies.

General topics / A Question
« on: October 22, 2010, 10:39:46 AM »
What is the proof that you are not Self-realised?
How does one know that he/she is not Self-realised?

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