The Forum dedicated to Arunachala and Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi

Ramana Maharshi => General topics => Topic started by: Subramanian.R on October 19, 2009, 12:33:46 PM

Title: Consecration of Ascetism
Post by: Subramanian.R on October 19, 2009, 12:33:46 PM
In formal methods, the Guru consecrates the asectism of a disciple.
There is something called Viraja Homam, where the disciple
performs his own rituals for his death.  This is the death of worldly
life only.  Then the Guru gives a name to the disciple, Swami so and so.... This is called Diksha Name.  Then the Guru gives him,
in secrecy, a Diksha Mantra.  A holy word or phrase to be constantly chanted by the disciple even after attaining sannyasa.
For Ati-varnasrama ascetics like Bhagavan Ramana, there were
no such things.  He had no mantra, excepting the famous Who
am I? and no name, but for the one given by Kavyakanta Ganapati
Muni.  Bhagavan Ramana embraced asectism on His own accord,
without any formal rituals.  There was no Guru, even though He
had mentioned Arunachala Himself as His Guru.

Diksha Name is only naming of the aham-sphurti, the inner-
completeness.  Diksha mantra is only description of this
inner completeness.

Rama Tirtha used to say to any one:  Rama is the name of your

There are two aspects of a person.  Lakshyartam, the goal.  This
is only I AM feeling of any person.  But in this world, we give a person, a name to specifically identity him.  Suppose there is a
person named Mr. White.  If his friend calls: Mr. White, he would
turn back and see.  Here, the White does not mean any colour,
but the person.  But for a Jnani, both are the same.  I AM is the
name.  But for worldly purposes, we give names.  After the
maha nirvana of a Jnani, his worldly name and his realization
become one and the same.  He becomes merely a Presence.  That
is why in Advaita and other schools, after internment of the
Jnani's mortal remains, people keep a Siva Linga or a Tulsi plant
over the samadhi.  No separate identity.

Arunachala Siva.
Title: Re: Consecration of Ascetism
Post by: Chuck Cliff on October 21, 2009, 11:32:16 AM
Dear Subramaniam,

Did you mean by
He had no mantra, excepting the famous Who
am I?
that this was the closest to what one might call a mantra, that is, not a mantra in the usual sense?
Title: Re: Consecration of Ascetism
Post by: Subramanian.R on October 21, 2009, 11:40:20 AM
Dear Chuck Clff,

Yes.  The question Who am I? was the avyakta mantra for
Bhagavan Ramana.  The hidden mantra within.  The death
experience took about 15 minutes.  The mantra had been
answered.  He had no other question to ask.  He had no other
mantra to chant in future.  He has given the same mantra to
Sivaprakasam Pillai in 1901, i.e. after about 5 or 6 years.
Bhagavan Ramana Himself had said on many occasions that
I, I, I is the mantra, which is more potent than the HIndu

Arunachala Siva.
Title: Re: Consecration of Ascetism
Post by: Chuck Cliff on October 22, 2009, 12:37:25 AM
Dear Subramaniam, we must have differing opinions on what constitutes a mantra, since I come from a western background I assume yours should be the more correct.

Still, the english translation of Sadhu Om's "The path of Sri Ramana.." it is Pillai who asks the question:
The first question asked by Sri Sivaprakasam Pillai
was, “Nan yar?” (Who am I?), to which Sri Bhagavan
replied, “Arive nan”, which means ‘knowledge alone is I’,
‘Knowledge itself is I’ or ‘Knowledge indeed is I’, the, Tamil
word ‘arivu’ being approximately equivalent to the Sanskrit
word ‘jnana’ or the English word ‘knowledge’.
(Appendix I page 181)

This is followed by the second question:
Pillai then asked, “What is the nature of (this) knowledge?”,
and Sri Bhagavan answered, “Arivin swarupam sat-chitanandam”
(The nature of this knowledge is existenceconsciousness-
  I'm sorry if this seems argumenative, but I don't want to be confused about what seems to be the core of Ramana's teaching.

Title: Re: Consecration of Ascetism
Post by: Subramanian.R on October 22, 2009, 11:46:37 AM
Dear Chuck Cliff,

I understand your point.  Who am I? appears as a question
and not as a holy word (mantra).  The reply is:  After negating
everything, what remains as Real, which is Knowledge, which
is in the form of Sat-Chit-Ananda, Existence-Knowledge and Bliss.
Now people may ask that it is a question, which does not have
any positive answer but only removal of all negative replies.
Yes. It is true.  But this question leads to the Real, the One
without a second and that is the goal. 

Normally a mantra or a holy word, like Siva, Siva or Rama, Rama
is constantly repeated to get into the goal.  But here, the question
or the holy word is asked a few times or many times, depending
upon the maturity of the seeker.  The answer which is the goal,
is Real. 

In the case of Siva, Siva or Rama, Rama, the mantra is repeated
even after the goal is reached.  Sri Tyagraja, a musician and a
great devotee of Sri Rama, is said to have repeated the mantra
a hundred million times in his life time.  But here, the mantra
is stopped once the goal is reached.

I believe that I have made the point somewhat clearer.  I am not sure.

Bhagavan Ramana Himself has said that Who am I? is not a mantra, in the ordinary sense of the words.

Arunachala Siva.